Changes for Round 6

[Hotdog60]

With Boyd and Hargrave to come back in who will miss this week?

I think maybe Moles and Addison maybe the unlucky ones.

[LostDoggy]

As you said or Moles and Hahn, with Grant filling his shows while Mitch has a rest.

I doubt it but I would consider it.

What happened to Hargy? He wasnt great last week.

[LostDoggy]

Big bodies needed next week against a very good defense. As good as Grant was if Boyd and Hargrave are available I foresee out Grant and Addison.

[LostDoggy]

Big bodies needed next week against a very good defense. As good as Grant was if Boyd and Hargrave are available I foresee out Grant and Addison.

I agree, I think Grant might struggle against the saints

[Go_Dogs]

In: Boyd, Hargrave

Out: Grant, Moles


That's what I'd be doing. Big game this week, and whilst Grant and Moles weren't our worst, they're the players I'd have less trouble removing for a game against St Kilda.

[azabob]

Is Hargrave certain to come back in?

Not sure Boyd will come back in either. Think some games may be being played with that one.

Is Williams injured? Saw him come off late holding his hamstring.

Could Everitt be sighted on the match reveiw panel for accenditally hitting I think Ivan Marich rather than the ball? People who saw it on TV might have a better idea.

I really would like to give Roughead and Grant at least 2-3 more games to give them a real feel for what is required.

[LostDoggy]

Will wait and see who is available before i make my selections, i wouldn't be dropping Grant or JR though.

[LostDoggy]

I hate to say it but Murph has just played his 2 worst games in history.
Could catching the train to training be a bit too relaxing???

[robb]

I hate to say it but Murph has just played his 2 worst games in history.
Could catching the train to training be a bit too relaxing???

The signs in the last qtr and a half suggested that Murphy is close to regaining the form that we know of. Indeed I thought his last qtr was excellent. A couple of times he did that typical one grab gather turning on his right and passing effectively forward.

[G-Mo77]

Is Hargrave certain to come back in?

I think this one is a legitimate concern I hear it was mainly precautionary but for something to flare up after 2 weeks there might be a little bit more to it.


Not sure Boyd will come back in either. Think some games may be being played with that one.

Listening to MMM on the way home they were saying Boyd spoke with them at half time and is certain he'll be back. It's a broken arm however.

If both come back someone will be very unlucky.

Hopefully Port knock the hell out of the Saints tonight!

[Doc26]

In: Hargrave
Out: Addison

Believe that Boydy will miss another otherwise, In: Boyd Out: Moles. It wont happen but would prefer to persevere with more youth eg Hill over Mitch. We're a soft tissue issue or 2 waiting to happen in our forward half and will need more strings to our bow as the season progresses.

[bornadog]

What happened to Hargy? He wasnt great last week.

He felt a twinge in the neck on Tuesday so they decided not to take any chances.

[Greystache]

In: Boyd, Hargrave
Out: Moles, Addison

Assuming both are fit to return, Moles' disposal the past two games has been a bit ordinary, despite Addison having been quite good is still a fringe player. Keep Gia in the midfield and give Grant another game to get the feel for it, he didn't do a lot but his effort was there.

[LostDoggy]

After listening to Eade's Press confrence after the game i can say that Grant wont be dropped, Rodney was very happy with him.

In: Boyd, Hargrave
Out:Addison, Moles (unlucky)

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Moles is a much better runner than Addison. I'd have him playing before Dylan who lacks pace. Moles made some errors last night, but they're fixable IMO. Another big bodied, hard running mid is what we'll need against St. Kilda. Addison can't really provide this, at least not for long enough.

[Rocco Jones]

Moles is a much better runner than Addison. I'd have him playing before Dylan who lacks pace. Moles made some errors last night, but they're fixable IMO. Another big bodied, hard running mid is what we'll need against St. Kilda. Addison can't really provide this, at least not for long enough.

While I think Moles is a superior individual player to Addison, I think Addison can potentially play in a run with role on someone like Montagna whereas Moles is just another midfielder/runner at the bottom end of rotations. That being said, I would still have Brodie ahead.

[LostDoggy]

Eade on SEN this morning talked up the preformance of Addison and how he kept a very dangerous player in Knights out of the game. I was thinking Addison would make way as well but on hearing that i am not so sure

[Go_Dogs]

I was thinking Addison would make way as well but on hearing that i am not so sure

I think he's the exact sort of guy we need to persist with, and his past 2 weeks have obviously been highly valued in the eyes of the coach and MC. He'll get more confidence and improve at this level, where as at VFL level he is simply too good, and could stagnate.

[Rocco Jones]

Eade on SEN this morning talked up the preformance of Addison and how he kept a very dangerous player in Knights out of the game. I was thinking Addison would make way as well but on hearing that i am not so sure

Yep. It's a big difference if a player can actually fill a role in a side. Picken being out means we are looking out for an outside tag type which suits Dylan. I keep on saying it but I think a lot of fans put the best 22 ahead of the best 22 to run out there.

[Raw Toast]

I keep on saying it but I think a lot of fans put the best 22 ahead of the best 22 to run out there.

Agreed - I think the match-committee are still working it out as well.

I'm still concerned with our run, so would be very reluctant to drop Moles, and I think while Grant might be outbodied at times, his pressure skills in the forward line are pretty important (and his hands were excellent in close on a number of occasions). And I thought Murphy started working his way into the game and is super-valuable to us structurally, he and the rest are still adjusting to a forward line with Hall.

So if both Boyd and Hargrave are right we've got a dilemma. I'd drop Addison and Hahn, with both obviously pretty unlucky, though I can't see this happening.

[Mofra]

Big bodies needed next week against a very good defense. As good as Grant was if Boyd and Hargrave are available I foresee out Grant and Addison.
Grant seems to be playing the same role that Hill does, and given his defensive pressure I would have him in.

Moles' disposal under pressure is still poor and against the Saints that would equal turnover city so I'd have him out for Boyd. Shaggy would be a hard one - Addison would be my guess even though he hasn't played poorly.

[Bumper Bulldogs]

So if both Boyd and Hargrave are right we've got a dilemma. I'd drop Addison and Hahn, with both obviously pretty unlucky, though I can't see this happening.

Agree it's a fantastic dilemma and with the current list of injury's it is quite amazing, I think if both are fit Mitch & Moles will be dropped as DFA will continue with run with roles until Pickens return.

[Scorlibo]

Eade was very pleased with Grant in the press conference, I doubt he will be dropped.

[AndrewP6]

I think this one is a legitimate concern I hear it was mainly precautionary but for something to flare up after 2 weeks there might be a little bit more to it.



Listening to MMM on the way home they were saying Boyd spoke with them at half time and is certain he'll be back. It's a broken arm however.



Hand, I think.

[Rance Fan]

No change. No need to risk others who may not be 100%

[AndrewP6]

Just caught a clip of Willy at Willi (funny, isn't it? :) ) on the Fifth Quarter.... maybe it's just the different uniform, but up close he did look heavy to me, backs up Rocket's claim of him needing to lose weight. Reporter said he was "only moderate, to be honest" and said with Roughy's first effort, Will could likely be in for a spell at Willi.

[bornadog]

No change. No need to risk others who may not be 100%

Boyd, Hargrave?

[choconmientay]

Just caught a clip of Willy at Willi (funny, isn't it? :) ) on the Fifth Quarter.... maybe it's just the different uniform, but up close he did look heavy to me, backs up Rocket's claim of him needing to lose weight. Reporter said he was "only moderate, to be honest" and said with Roughy's first effort, Will could likely be in for a spell at Willi.

I went to watch him and Hill yesterday at Willi. Willy had an average day. He didn't play convincely enough to push for spot back in the team.

Hill did put in more efforts but be played most of the times at the back. He was willing to lay tackles which he always lack at the dogs games.

Fair to say that the weather didn't allow them to play at their full potential. The game was patchy and affected by the strong wind (you can only score at one end). btw, Willi lost only by 1 point!

[LostDoggy]

Fair to say that the Rocket will only make changes if Boyd and Hargrave are ready to come back in and i think Moles will be first out and then it will be tough maybe Grant will be very unlucky

[AndrewP6]

I went to watch him and Hill yesterday at Willi. Willy had an average day. He didn't play convincely enough to push for spot back in the team.


Can't believe I didn't think of that... Hilly and Willy at Willi! Hilarious... or not. :)

[Bumper Bulldogs]

Can't believe I didn't think of that... Hilly and Willy at Willi! Hilarious... or not. :)

I'm sure it was chilli also!:D

[LostDoggy]

Grant seems to be playing the same role that Hill does, and given his defensive pressure I would have him in.

Moles' disposal under pressure is still poor and against the Saints that would equal turnover city so I'd have him out for Boyd. Shaggy would be a hard one - Addison would be my guess even though he hasn't played poorly.

The Grant role does seem similar to Hill. My thinking is along the lines that we may need the extra Midfielder. I felt in the NAB we were able to maintain the pressure through having more options in the middle.

[chef]

Someone mentioned that they said on The Winners on Fox that Gia has broken ribs, anyone else hear this?

[The Pie Man]

Just saw on AFL winners that Gia has broken ribs??

[LostDoggy]

No mention of Williams being the man to drop for Hargreave.With Saint Sook not playing is he required this week?

[The Bulldogs Bite]

No mention of Williams being the man to drop for Hargreave.With Saint Sook not playing is he required this week?

I wouldn't think so, unless they play Stanley or intend to rest Gardiner up forward. Given their forward line woes last week, that might be a strong possibility.

I doubt we'll ever drop Williams unless he's horribly out of form or injured. He needs to play as many games as possible, the club is aware of this, so in terms of reaping long term benefits Williams probably needs to keep playing.

[soupman]

No mention of Williams being the man to drop for Hargreave.With Saint Sook not playing is he required this week?

Why would you drop a player that:
a) Struggles to string more than a handful of games together as is, let alone when you drop him
b) Has done nothing wrong
c) Has shown continuous improvement throughout the season in almost every aspect of his game
d) Still has so much unfulfilled potential which will undoubtably only be filled if he is given every opportunity at AFL level
e) Holds such an important role in our side not just currently but for the remainder of the season (and hopefully the next 5+ years)

Williams isn't a chance to be dropped for Hargrave, and it would be a terrible move if he was.

[Mantis]

I doubt we'll ever drop Williams unless he's horribly out of form or injured. He needs to play as many games as possible, the club is aware of this, so in terms of reaping long term benefits Williams probably needs to keep playing.

So he plays on?

[LostDoggy]

Why would you drop a player that:
a) Struggles to string more than a handful of games together as is, let alone when you drop him
b) Has done nothing wrong
c) Has shown continuous improvement throughout the season in almost every aspect of his game
d) Still has so much unfulfilled potential which will undoubtably only be filled if he is given every opportunity at AFL level
e) Holds such an important role in our side not just currently but for the remainder of the season (and hopefully the next 5+ years)

Williams isn't a chance to be dropped for Hargrave, and it would be a terrible move if he was.

Lake v Kosi
Harbrow v Milne
Hargrave v Schneider
Morris v Goddard
Gillbee v Armitage/McQualter
Everitt v any makeshift tall forward ( Blake) which could be Williams match up
Where does Williams fit in? Everitt out ... not for me

[Ozza]

Why would you drop a player that:
a) Struggles to string more than a handful of games together as is, let alone when you drop him
b) Has done nothing wrong
c) Has shown continuous improvement throughout the season in almost every aspect of his game
d) Still has so much unfulfilled potential which will undoubtably only be filled if he is given every opportunity at AFL level
e) Holds such an important role in our side not just currently but for the remainder of the season (and hopefully the next 5+ years)

Williams isn't a chance to be dropped for Hargrave, and it would be a terrible move if he was.

The answer to all the above points is that he may not be the right fit this week balance-wise.

Its not a pot on Williams - some players have to miss out and with no obvious match up or necessity in this week's side I wouldn't be against him missing out.

I don't think Williams being omitted for one week - against a side that currently only has one tall forward - will have as dramatic effects as you've described. I agree he is playing fairly well - but the team should be picked on this week's needs - not catering to a blokes future over the next 5 years.

Aside from this, I find calls for Murphy to be dropped a tad ridiculous - seeing as he was probably our best player for the first three rounds - and the fact he is one of our best and most important players.

[Rocco Jones]

So he plays on?

Depends whether we plan to use Morris on Goddard or one of their small forwards.

Goddard and Kosi will probably be the permanent tall forwards with pinch hitting roles from Gardiner and possibly Fisher.

Lake seems the perfect fit for Kosi. Williams might give us another option for Goddard/free up Shaggy, Morris and/or Everitt. I think we might also be a bit vulnerable if Gardiner does well up forward.

I can also definitely see the merit of playing a runner ahead of Williams though.

[hujsh]

Why are we talking about finding a matchup for a guy who appeared (on TV at least) to be against guys like Dangerfield last week? It doesn't seem that we're afraid to play Williams on either tall or small opponents.

[Rocco Jones]

Why are we talking about finding a matchup for a guy who appeared (on TV at least) to be against guys like Dangerfield last week? It doesn't seem that we're afraid to play Williams on either tall or small opponents.

I guess because of Shaggy being able to do the same.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

So he plays on?

Stanley (if he plays), Gardiner/Dawson/Gwilt (whichever is resting forward)

[Bulldog Joe]

Give up any thought of dropping Williams. If that is the only way to get Shaggy in the side, Shaggy misses out. His form in the games he has played is worse than any other defender. I see Addison as more deserving at the moment.

Minson was dropped for errors and Shaggy was even worse against Brisbane.

Boyd is the automatic in and unfortunately it looks like Moles could be the one to miss, if everyone else is ok.

[chef]

Lake v Kosi
Harbrow v Milne
Hargrave v Schneider
Morris v Goddard
Gillbee v Armitage/McQualter
Everitt v any makeshift tall forward ( Blake) which could be Williams match up
Where does Williams fit in? Everitt out ... not for me

He will play on....

Either Gwilt, Fisher, Gilbert, Gardiner or Dawson if there are played forward like they have been at various times over the last two weeks.

Or Stanley, Lynch or McEvoy they are included this week.

I would also give Everitt Gilbee's match up to release Gilbee further up field(where he seems to be playing more often this year).

[chef]

Give up any thought of dropping Williams. If that is the only way to get Shaggy in the side, Shaggy misses out. His form in the games he has played is worse than any other defender. I see Addison as more deserving at the moment.

Minson was dropped for errors and Shaggy was even worse against Brisbane.

Boyd is the automatic in and unfortunately it looks like Moles could be the one to miss, if everyone else is ok.

I thought he was dropped because he had bulked up too much and has lost a bit of speed and mobility?

[Desipura]

Can't believe I didn't think of that... Hilly and Willy at Willi! Hilarious... or not. :)
Did either player get the pill? sorry could not help myself.

[Mofra]

Stanley (if he plays), Gardiner/Dawson/Gwilt (whichever is resting forward)
I wouldn't be surprised to see McEvoy come in this week either (I really rate the kid).

Williams is starting to take a few marks from opposition kicks, a la Lake when he was developing as Harris. In modern footy, these sort of turnovers are gold.

[Bulldog4life]

The Grant role does seem similar to Hill. My thinking is along the lines that we may need the extra Midfielder. I felt in the NAB we were able to maintain the pressure through having more options in the middle.

I tend to agree with you. Especially against St.Kilda. If Shaggy & Boyddy are in this week I'd relunctantly drop Addison & Grant. It might seem harsh on the kid (Grant) but he has many years in front of him to become a permanent fixture with our aging stars retiring over the next couple of years.

[Bulldog Joe]

I thought he was dropped because he had bulked up too much and has lost a bit of speed and mobility?


Pretty sure it was the errors, the fitness issue is more of an explanation of why he is unable to execute as well as in 09.

[chef]

Pretty sure it was the errors, the fitness issue is more of an explanation of why he is unable to execute as well as in 09.

Do you think these were caused by being fatigued?

[LostDoggy]

I wouldn't be surprised to see McEvoy come in this week either (I really rate the kid).

Williams is starting to take a few marks from opposition kicks, a la Lake when he was developing as Harris. In modern footy, these sort of turnovers are gold.

Tom Rivers is on the cards then?

[Ozza]

Tom Rivers is on the cards then?

Lot of water to go under the bridge until we get there...

[AndrewP6]

Did either player get the pill? sorry could not help myself.

Hilly and Willy were chilly at Willi - no pill-y!

God that was soooooo bad :)

[Bulldog4life]

Hilly and Willy were chilly at Willi - no pill-y!

God that was soooooo bad :)

You're silly.

[Before I Die]

Why does everyone seem to see Shaggy as an automatic in? I know there have been question marks over his fitness in just about all the games he has played, virus, concussion, neck soreness. However, his form has not ben great. A game at Willy would not do him any harm.

[Sedat]

Why does everyone seem to see Shaggy as an automatic in? I know there have been question marks over his fitness in just about all the games he has played, virus, concussion, neck soreness. However, his form has not ben great. A game at Willy would not do him any harm.
Because he has improved year on year since Rocket came to the club and is one of the first picked on the basis of 5 years of extremely coinsistent (and in the last 2-3 years, brilliant) form. Was extremely unlucky to miss out on AA selection in 2009, due in no small part to the Collingwood propaganda machine going into overdrive to get Maxwell the gig.

If Hargrave is 100% fit, he is an automatic selection IMO.

[bulldogsman]

In Boyd (hopefully)
Out Moles

- Moles is a little unlucky but I thought he had a poor 1st half and was a late replacement anyway
- Hargrave can spend sometime a Williamstown just to get some form back. It's hard to see who he replaces also.
- Grant is a certainty judging by Eade's comments and I thought he was good providing excellent forward line pressure
- Addison has been good and deserves his spot over Moles also as mentioned he will be needed to do a tagging job

[LostDoggy]

In Boyd (hopefully)
Out Moles

- Moles is a little unlucky but I thought he had a poor 1st half and was a late replacement anyway
- Hargrave can spend sometime a Williamstown just to get some form back. It's hard to see who he replaces also.
- Grant is a certainty judging by Eade's comments and I thought he was good providing excellent forward line pressure
- Addison has been good and deserves his spot over Moles also as mentioned he will be needed to do a tagging job

Hargrave will not spend time at willi he has enough credits to come straight back in

[Rocco Jones]

Because he has improved year on year since Rocket came to the club and is one of the first picked on the basis of 5 years of extremely coinsistent (and in the last 2-3 years, brilliant) form. Was extremely unlucky to miss out on AA selection in 2009, due in no small part to the Collingwood propaganda machine going into overdrive to get Maxwell the gig.

If Hargrave is 100% fit, he is an automatic selection IMO.

If they had a financial year 2009 AA, Shaggy would have been one of the first picked. He was great from mid 2008 to mid 2009.

Totally agree with the Shaggy love. He has been extremely valuable since Eade came along and moved him off the taller forwards. A great option for a variety of medium and small forwards and helps free up our other defenders for suitable roles.

The 100% fit is an interesting one. Neck injuries seem very hard to tell, especially when players are having tingles/feeling of pins etc, really hard to predict. I really hope there isn't something potentially career ending in this.

[AndrewP6]

You're silly.

Thank you...

[Mofra]

Hargrave will not spend time at willi he has enough credits to come straight back in
Johnno has more credits in the bank than Shaggy, was 4th in our B&F and was close to returning via Willy. No player is an automatic in - having said that, I think Shaggy will play this week.

[LostDoggy]

Just saw on the Facebook Page, apparently Boyd has been given the all clear from the surgeon and will play Friday Night. Not sure how reliable that is but seems pretty reliable.

[jazzadogs]

Just saw on the Facebook Page, apparently Boyd has been given the all clear from the surgeon and will play Friday Night. Not sure how reliable that is but seems pretty reliable.
It's reliable, facebook page is run by the club.

Great news.

[LostDoggy]

SEN recently confirmed that Boyd has the ok to train.

[Topdog]

Johnno has more credits in the bank than Shaggy, was 4th in our B&F and was close to returning via Willy. No player is an automatic in - having said that, I think Shaggy will play this week.

Sorry but I just don't believe Johnno had more than a 2% chance of coming back via Willi.

[LostDoggy]

Johnno has more credits in the bank than Shaggy, was 4th in our B&F and was close to returning via Willy. No player is an automatic in - having said that, I think Shaggy will play this week.

Hargrave has missed one game and is prob one of the most important players in our team. When he is not playing we lack a lot of drive out of the back line as no other player on our list can play his role.

[bulldogsman]

Hargrave has missed one game and is prob one of the most important players in our team. When he is not playing we lack a lot of drive out of the back line as no other player on our list can play his role.

Is he? I'm not so sure he's one of our most important players, but he's definitely great value when playing well. Everitt has done okay when playing in his role I think.

[boydogs]

Hargrave has missed one game and is prob one of the most important players in our team. When he is not playing we lack a lot of drive out of the back line as no other player on our list can play his role.

Don't Gilbee and Harbrow have similar rebounding roles?

[Rocco Jones]

Don't Gilbee and Harbrow have similar rebounding roles?

Gilbee provides rebound with his kicking while Harbrow provides it with his run. I think Shaggy is again different as he is more defensive. I think his run is more effective than his kicking.

[boydogs]

Gilbee provides rebound with his kicking while Harbrow provides it with his run. I think Shaggy is again different as he is more defensive. I think his run is more effective did (than?) his kicking.

I just don't see Hargrave as that unique that no other player can play his role. Gilbee, Harbrow, even Everitt should be able to be relied upon to provide drive out of the backline if Hargrave is not available.

I would be more worried missing Morris or Hall for example as they are harder for us to replace. I don't think we need to rush an 80% Hargrave back in is what I suppose I am getting at

[LostDoggy]

Where is this week's Preview?

[Rocco Jones]

I just don't see Hargrave as that unique that no other player can play his role. Gilbee, Harbrow, even Everitt should be able to be relied upon to provide drive out of the backline if Hargrave is not available.

I would be more worried missing Morris or Hall for example as they are harder for us to replace

My point was that Hargrave isn't primarily a rebounding defender IMO. Here are the main roles I see our defenders playing:

Gilbee- setting up ball with foot skills
Harbrow- rebound via running/line breaking
Shaggy- combo of keeping small/mediums quite + rebound
Morris- lock down tall/medium/small
Lake- stopping KP forward + rebound/zoning off
Williams- stopping KP forward

Everitt is the play I most see like Shaggy. Shaggy's value IMO is how he frees up others in the backline. He is able to perform defensive jobs on smalls and mediums as well as offering rebound.

[Mantis]

Where is this week's Preview?

It will be posted later tonight.

[LostDoggy]

It will be posted later tonight.

Thanks Mantis!
Didnt know where to post the question, so thought id put it in anything relating to the round 6 match..

[Sedat]

Shaggy's value IMO is how he frees up others in the backline. He is able to perform defensive jobs on smalls and mediums as well as offering rebound.
Exactly right. Shaggy is the only player in our defensive list that has the capability to do a lock-down Morris type role and also a free-wheeling Gilbee style rebounding role (sometimes both in the one match). Just a terrific footballer and an extremely versatile one at that, whose presence allows the likes of Gilbee and Harbrow (even lake on occasions) to concentrate on attacking and rebounding in their defensive roles. Really surprised that a couple of poor performances seem to be enough for some posters to virtually erase 5 years of consistently high quality output from him.

My only knock on Shaggy is his occasional propensity to bomb it long when rebounding without looking to spot up free targets. Otherwise he is the prototype of the modern mid sized defender.

[bornadog]

Exactly right. Shaggy is the only player in our defensive list that has the capability to do a lock-down Morris type role and also a free-wheeling Gilbee style rebounding role (sometimes both in the one match). Just a terrific footballer and an extremely versatile one at that, whose presence allows the likes of Gilbee and Harbrow (even lake on occasions) to concentrate on attacking and rebounding in their defensive roles. Really surprised that a couple of poor performances seem to be enough for some posters to virtually erase 5 years of consistently high quality output from him.

My only knock on Shaggy is his occasional propensity to bomb it long when rebounding without looking to spot up free targets. Otherwise he is the prototype of the modern mid sized defender.

Yes this hurts us sometimes. I notice he has done this particularly when sides are using zones. Not sure if he is trying to kick it long over the zone or what he is doing.

[LostDoggy]

My point was that Hargrave isn't primarily a rebounding defender IMO. Here are the main roles I see our defenders playing:

Gilbee- setting up ball with foot skills
Harbrow- rebound via running/line breaking
Shaggy- combo of keeping small/mediums quite + rebound
Morris- lock down tall/medium/small
Lake- stopping KP forward + rebound/zoning off
Williams- stopping KP forward

Everitt is the play I most see like Shaggy. Shaggy's value IMO is how he frees up others in the backline. He is able to perform defensive jobs on smalls and mediums as well as offering rebound.

I agree with exactly what you have written, the only thing i will add is the reason i think he is hard to replace is that i think he receives more balls on the wing then anyother of our defenders. They look for hargrave as the second kick out of the backline. IMO we have struggled to take the ball out of defence, especially kick outs when he has not played

[LostDoggy]

Is he? I'm not so sure he's one of our most important players, but he's definitely great value when playing well. Everitt has done okay when playing in his role I think.

Would you trust Everitt to keep Milne quite this week as well has having 20+ possesions and provide plenty of run?

I doubt he could do that at this stage

[Before I Die]

Exactly right. Shaggy is the only player in our defensive list that has the capability to do a lock-down Morris type role and also a free-wheeling Gilbee style rebounding role (sometimes both in the one match). Just a terrific footballer and an extremely versatile one at that, whose presence allows the likes of Gilbee and Harbrow (even lake on occasions) to concentrate on attacking and rebounding in their defensive roles. Really surprised that a couple of poor performances seem to be enough for some posters to virtually erase 5 years of consistently high quality output from him.
My only knock on Shaggy is his occasional propensity to bomb it long when rebounding without looking to spot up free targets. Otherwise he is the prototype of the modern mid sized defender.

I think this is a little strong. Some posters are simply suggesting that given his relatively poor form (possibly all injury driven) and lingering injury doubt (the medicos clearly got it wrong in Round 4) combined with the good performance of the team last game, a week at Willy for Shaggy doesn't seem like an unreasonable idea.

I must also admit though, that I think Shaggy is overated. He is unable to play on players who match him physically. He has had some good shutdown games on small forwards, but has also been taken to the cleaners on a number of occasions. He doesn't play the sweeping role particularly well nor is he all that great at going third man up in marking duels. What he is very good at is running off his opponent, receiving a non-contested ball and setting up play. However this depends on him being matched up on the weakest opposition forward. Last year, particularly when Williams played, this was a situation which the coaching team were regularly able to create.

This is not meant as an attack on Shaggy. At his best, he is clearly in our best 22. However, if I was asked who out of Lake, Harbrow, Shaggy, Williams, Gilbee or Morris could we most easily cover, I would have no hesitation in naming Shaggy.

Re Changes fo Round 6

In: Boyd
Out: Moles

If Hargrave also comes in then one of Hahn, Grant or Addison out.

[boydogs]

In: Boyd, Hargrave
Out: Addison, Grant

[stefoid]

Shaggy is an hardened veteran defender who is able to play on a variety of opponents and provides attack as well as defence. Sometimes he is beaten, as all defenders are from time to time. He may not be elite, but he is one of Jack Dyers good average players of the type that are required in successful teams. If fit, he has as much chance of being dropped as I have of being picked.

[LostDoggy]

Hilly and Willy were chilly at Willi - no pill-y!

God that was soooooo bad :)

Don't be a dilly, that's overkilly. No, really!

[Sedat]

Don't be a dilly, that's overkilly. No, really!
Reminds me of that TISM song, "Lillee Caught Dilley Bowled Milli Vanilli"

[Desipura]

In: Boyd, Hargrave
Out: Addison, Grant

I would be very surprised/disappointed if we dropped Grant.