Murphy should be left in the backline

[bornadog]

I thought he played his best game for the year yesterday in the backline. I really believe we should leave him in the backline. We have missed someone running off the backline and hitting targets in the forward line.

With Johnno coming back, and Hill, Grant and Stack contributing in the forward line, we don't need him up forward.

[GVGjr]

I'm in two minds about leaving him in the back line but think it's a good move until he gets back into his best form.
He is a player who frustrates me more as a forward than he does as a defender.

[w3design]

With the team lacking drive from the backline I tend to agree. He hasn't been that flash up forward in terms of conversion this year either

[Chicago1]

He seemed to be the rocket from the backline that set off a few of our goals. His run can be electrifying.

[azabob]

I think with Hargrave and Harbrow both down on form and run I would like to see both Murphy and Wood have an extended run at playing in defence.

Murphy is such a great reader of the play and covers the ground with effortless ease.

He is also is a great 3rd man up in the contest, this will also help allowing Lake to either go forward or concentrate on his man when needed rather than having to help provide a chop out to either Morris or Williams.

What was most pleasing and suprising was Murhpy's ball use, before the injury it was not up to scratch but yesterday he was able to hit targets with either long or short kicking.

[LostDoggy]

And easier on his knees too, playing him back.

[lemmon]

His ball use was a highlight for me yesterday, really scythed through the traffic with his foot skills which are probably more value to us coming off half back then up forward. Leave him there for the time being.

[GVGjr]

With the team lacking drive from the backline I tend to agree. He hasn't been that flash up forward in terms of conversion this year either

I just think he is more self assured in the back line. Way too many easy dropped marks up forward as he seemed to be spending it before he owned it.

[w3design]

I just think he is more self assured in the back line. Way too many easy dropped marks up forward as he seemed to be spending it before he owned it.

Yeah funny one isn't it? Probably all in the head, also he started playing well for us as a defender before moving forward when he was younger.

[chef]

As long as the team doesn't fall down over half forward he should stay back, but if we are he should be thrown back forward.

[Sockeye Salmon]

Playing CHF is destroying his body. If he can stay at HB it might extend his career by a year or two.

[dog town]

Playing CHF is destroying his body. If he can stay at HB it might extend his career by a year or two. Agreed but in a team crying out for someone to lead up at the footy and attract it to take some pressure off Hall it may prove difficult to leave him down back. Against the good sides so far this year we have really been caught short up forward for guys presenting at the footy and I am not sure we really have an answer to the hole it leaves not having Murphy up forward. It is going to be interesting to see how Eade handles it.

[always right]

Keep him at half back and keep developing Grant playing the Murphy role up forward. At various stages of a game swing Murphy into attack. Would create loads of problems for the opposition.

Agree witht the general view however that his body allows him to be far more damaging running out of the backline. Also takes some pressure off Harbrow to be the only real attacking option in defence.

[LostDoggy]

Leave him in the back, if he isn't dominating or doing to well move him up forward.

[Bumper Bulldogs]

Its a funny game at times, for me its a difficult one as he has clearly been carrying an injury this year. If you look back prior to his knee injury he was a gun at 1/2 forward with a small target in Jonno out of the square. When he has been not playing well Eade has thrown him down back to get a few touches and some confidence.

This is not what a senior player should do. It is clearly between the ears as he could be damaging in any spot on the ground.

I think with the team at the moment and the young guys like Grant, Wood, Hill & Stack coming on, Rocket and the MC must be loving the flexibility and allowing it to come down to game day match ups.

[Mofra]

The backline will play him into form, but I think he offers too much as a forward when in top gear.
With Shaggy due back & Wood getting a little confidence (much better after halftime), we will have the luxury of sending Murphy forward without losing too much.
Hahn looks out of sorts and with Johnno coming back after the break, replacing Hahn & Stack with Johnno & Murphy will make our F50 a much more dangerous place.

[Rocco Jones]

I'm in two minds about leaving him in the back line but think it's a good move until he gets back into his best form.
He is a player who frustrates me more as a forward than he does as a defender.

Agree with that but I also think he has great potential value as a forward and it's probably the type of potential we need to extract to become out and out contenders again.

[Desipura]

I made the comment that playing Half back flank could possibly prolong his career. I still think we lack a key forward who can take a contested mark, that is another isuue for another day.

[Go_Dogs]

Definitely should stay at half back. His creativity and kicking skills are so damaging when he runs from behind the ball. He's also a very good reader of the play, and as such, it enables him to make good position defensively, and also a chance to cut off opposition attacks.

I don't mind the idea of him having some stints up forwards once he's fully up and running, but I tend to agree that half back should be his 'permanent' position.

[Greystache]

I think it depends on Johnson's form and fitness when (or if) he comes back. We are often falling down across half forward due to players not working hard enough to be that hit up option, Murphy provides that but the down side is his delivery inside 50m following up is terrible. Johnson has the ability to play the same role with better disposal, it will just depend on his fitness.

Murphy's kicking seems a lot more effective coming out of defence, possibly because the play is in front of him so he know his options before he decides to move the ball on quickly, plus he offers additional run which is something we've been really lacking.

So for me Murphy to play in defence all year providing Jono can regain fitness.

[Mantis]

I think it depends on Johnson's form and fitness when (or if) he comes back. We are often falling down across half forward due to players not working hard enough to be that hit up option, Murphy provides that but the down side is his delivery inside 50m following up is terrible. Johnson has the ability to play the same role with better disposal, it will just depend on his fitness.

Murphy's kicking seems a lot more effective coming out of defence, possibly because the play is in front of him so he know his options before he decides to move the ball on quickly, plus he offers additional run which is something we've been really lacking.

So for me Murphy to play in defence all year providing Jono can regain fitness.

You think?

Johnno's field kicking isn't one of his strengths eitehr.

[MrMahatma]

Great half back. Average fwd. Keep him down back.

[Desipura]

Great half back. Average fwd. Keep him down back.

Perhaps you should watch the preliminary final against St Kilda?

[Ozza]

While Bob is a brilliant forward, defence seems a good fit for him in the current line up.
He's just so quick that he is perfect for zoning off and spoiling or marking in front of the big forwards - and he is so good one on one that he almost always either wins or halves the contest.

[Desipura]

I think our defence lacks poise when they are under pressure with Williams, Lake and Harbrow. Murphy certainly improves that area down back as well as provides run out of defence, he showed good accelaration on the weekend.
Wood also showed an ability to run and carry. Along with his pace and strength, Wood provides another dimension to our backline.

[Greystache]

You think?

Johnno's field kicking isn't one of his strengths eitehr.

I said better, not good. Johnson at least looks to kick the ball flatter, even if it's not necessarily to his team mates advantage.


Perhaps you should watch the preliminary final against St Kilda?

His presenting was first class, his blind high bombs inside 50m was one of the reasons most people said we needed a big pack marking forward that day.

[Desipura]

His presenting was first class, his blind high bombs inside 50m was one of the reasons most people said we needed a big pack marking forward that day.

Thats what happens in finals footy where you do not have enough time to pinpoint passes.
Hall does not address this issue of a big pack making forward, he does however gives another option to kick to on a lead.

[stefoid]

So assuming Williams is our CHB of choice, what does our ideal backline look like?

I am assuming Lake, Harbrow, Morris, Gilbee are locks.

Hargrave when fit is a lock.

That leaves Murph and Williams for the 6th spot.

Personally, this year I am leaning towards Murph back there to give us better ball movement out of defence, and rely on flooding to cover our lack of height, just like the hawks and the saints do with their defences.

[LostDoggy]

It's not rocket science why Murph's future lies in facing the goals rather than away from it -- his knee(s). With a wonky knee the last thing you need is regular, constant twisting, which playing as a lead-up CHF is a non-negotiable necessity (as he has to spin around to kick it into the forward 50). Any tentativeness also detracts from his ability to concentrate on nailing the forward 50 pass (thus the regular bomb, which requires less thinking/concentration).

Facing the play from CHB means that he can run in straight-ish lines more often with the ball (of course he still has to twist and turn as a defender, but that's unavoidable as a footy player regardless of where you play), and I don't think there's any doubt that the lessened impact on his body has a direct effect on the quality of his kicking.

[Ozza]

Thats what happens in finals footy where you do not have enough time to pinpoint passes.
Hall does not address this issue of a big pack making forward, he does however gives another option to kick to on a lead.

I think he does. He has taken contested marks and some pack marks this season. But importantly - Hall brings the ball to the ground. The problem in the Prelim was that Fisher and Gilbert were marking alot of the long high balls we sent in.

[Greystache]

Thats what happens in finals footy where you do not have enough time to pinpoint passes.

The only reason you don't have time to pin point a pass from a mark is because you've automatically played on without assessing your options and force yourself to kick under pressure.



Hall does not address this issue of a big pack making forward, he does however gives another option to kick to on a lead.

Hence Murphy needs to play across half back

[Desipura]

The only reason you don't have time to pin point a pass from a mark is because you've automatically played on without assessing your options and force yourself to kick under pressure.

No, it is not the only reason. Its also because there are NO options down the ground as they are all manned up. Therefore you need to kick it long to a 50/50 contest or a pack situation and hope it either falls to ground and is crumbed by one of our forwards, or a pack mark is taken.

I would think it was the coaches instructions to play on at all costs so as to avoid the above.

[Greystache]

No, it is not the only reason. Its also because there are NO options down the ground as they are all manned up. Therefore you need to kick it long to a 50/50 contest or a pack situation and hope it either falls to ground and is crumbed by one of our forwards, or a pack mark is taken.

I would think it was the coaches instructions to play on at all costs so as to avoid the above.

I'd suggest to you a random high bomb is the last thing an undersized forward line would want when outnumbered. Murphy's kicking into the forward line got to the point where he'd have better served the team by dribbling the ball along the ground inside 50m, at least a small forward would have a chane in a 2 on 1. I wouldn't say that about any other player (with perhaps the exception of Callan).

[always right]

So assuming Williams is our CHB of choice, what does our ideal backline look like?

I am assuming Lake, Harbrow, Morris, Gilbee are locks.

Hargrave when fit is a lock.

That leaves Murph and Williams for the 6th spot.

Personally, this year I am leaning towards Murph back there to give us better ball movement out of defence, and rely on flooding to cover our lack of height, just like the hawks and the saints do with their defences.

I think Murphy goes back and that frees up Gilbee to play elsewhere. With the number of rotations nowadays, he'll play some game time in defence anyway. My starting backline would be;
Harbrow Lake Morris
Hargrave Williams Murphy

Gilbee to swing through there and perhaps Wood if he holds his spot. With the right matchups, it might even pay to surprise the opposition by throwing Harbrow into the middle for a period of time. Reckon he would cause a lot of concerns for the opposition as he ran at their defence. It's about time we became a bit more unpredictable.

[craigsahibee]

Hey, you know what?

Just play Murph where Murph wants (feels he has) to play. He is a free spirit and should be allowed to play that way.

[w3design]

I think he will stay down back now with Wood, noticed how both Harbrow and Gilbee have been released up the ground?

Gilbee's best game for the year and it was due to him being able to find space.

[Desipura]

I think he will stay down back now with Wood, noticed how both Harbrow and Gilbee have been released up the ground?

Gilbee's best game for the year and it was due to him being able to find space.
Sure was, and how happy was Gilbee after the game? Good to see as he is extremely important to us.

[The Coon Dog]

Gilbee's best game for the year and it was due to him being able to find space.

He must have loved not being shackled. Not a hope in Hawthorn will afford him that luxury.

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

I think Murphy goes back and that frees up Gilbee to play elsewhere. With the number of rotations nowadays, he'll play some game time in defence anyway. My starting backline would be;
Harbrow Lake Morris
Hargrave Williams Murphy

Gilbee to swing through there and perhaps Wood if he holds his spot. With the right matchups, it might even pay to surprise the opposition by throwing Harbrow into the middle for a period of time. Reckon he would cause a lot of concerns for the opposition as he ran at their defence. It's about time we became a bit more unpredictable.

I would like to see Harbrow added to the midfield group leaving Wood to take his back pocket. Gilbee could give us something off a wing position. The return of Ward also would give us a handy relief backman in Picken who can play tight. It is now obvious that Murphy's best possie is at half back. Murph would also have the class to play on a Rioli type. The return of Williams enables Morris to play on a good opponent more suited to his height.

[Ozza]

Backline worked very very well yesterday. Only allowing 14 scoring shots is a good effort. Regardless of how WCE are performing - at home they are always a challenge to knock off (Geelong & St.Kilda struggle to shake them) - so I'd say it was a 'big tick' for the defence - in particular for Murph who was outstanding early.

[stefoid]

Harbrow has a lot to learn about playing midfield, but its a good investment. He could crack games open with his carry and short passes into the F50.

I think we have all forgotten how good murph is body on body in a 1:1 situation. he might actually be our 2nd best negating defender for non-gorilla opponents. He can probably stitch up most small goal sneaks easily, Id love to see him embarrass the likes of Milne, Stokes and Davis.

[w3design]

Harbrow has a lot to learn about playing midfield, but its a good investment. He could crack games open with his carry and short passes into the F50.

I think we have all forgotten how good murph is body on body in a 1:1 situation. he might actually be our 2nd best negating defender for non-gorilla opponents. He can probably stitch up most small goal sneaks easily, Id love to see him embarrass the likes of Milne, Stokes and Davis.


His only issue would be on the lead, agree with body on body work though.