Free Agency

[Sockeye Salmon]

Did everyone read the article yesterday where Brendon Gale said the AFLPA are puishing for unrestricted free agency after 7 years?

What are everyone's thoughts?

Personally, I am vehemantly opposed to it.

It will guarantee:

* Clubs near the bottom will move on mature age players to free up cap to raid the clubs further up the list. You will now be able to get off the bottom with the cheque book again (hello Carlton).

* Clubs have a fantastic reason to cheat the salary cap. At the moment, if you cheat the salary cap the rewards aren't particularily great and the penalties are huge. With free agency the rewards could be huge as well - some clubs will have a crack.

* Kids will cry when their favorite player leaves their club (yes Bernie Quinlan, I'm looking at you).

* Western Australians will go home


I can see the bad old days of the 70's happening all over again.

[LostDoggy]

I hope not as well.
Not a fan of Brendan Gale either. For a guy that suppose to be very clever, why is he such an idiot?

[mjp]

But SS, there was no salary cap in the 1970's, which largely contributed to the lunacy that occured.

I am actually strongly IN Favor of some form of restricted free agency. But I honestly believe that one of the principles that they use in RFA in the NFL needs to be included - the ability of the players current club to 'match' the contract and retain the player. If it is a big money player, then you will usually find it is easier for the players existing club to find the money than another club - imagine trying to find 1million in the salary cap for Riewoldt? Good luck.

Why do I feel this way? Because I honestly believe that the clubs have far too much power right now. If I was a Richmond player who had been at the club for 7 years - which is probably 2 contracts after my draftee contract remember - and hadn't played finals for 5 or 6 years, didn't look like playing for another 2 or 3 and was out of contract, well, why should I have to sign-up for another 3 miserable seasons when the guys running the place had not shown that they have any idea what they are doing.

If I am 31 years old and out-of-contract, I dont have to sit through the misery of tradeweek, hoping that I will find a new club or maybe even get another contract offer (no guarantee) from my current club. Or, I was taken from my home-state at 17 and want to go home. All I have to do is find a club who wants me and I can go and play there...

[Sockeye Salmon]

But SS, there was no salary cap in the 1970's, which largely contributed to the lunacy that occured.

I am actually strongly IN Favor of some form of restricted free agency. But I honestly believe that one of the principles that they use in RFA in the NFL needs to be included - the ability of the players current club to 'match' the contract and retain the player. If it is a big money player, then you will usually find it is easier for the players existing club to find the money than another club - imagine trying to find 1million in the salary cap for Riewoldt? Good luck.

Why do I feel this way? Because I honestly believe that the clubs have far too much power right now. If I was a Richmond player who had been at the club for 7 years - which is probably 2 contracts after my draftee contract remember - and hadn't played finals for 5 or 6 years, didn't look like playing for another 2 or 3 and was out of contract, well, why should I have to sign-up for another 3 miserable seasons when the guys running the place had not shown that they have any idea what they are doing.

If I am 31 years old and out-of-contract, I dont have to sit through the misery of tradeweek, hoping that I will find a new club or maybe even get another contract offer (no guarantee) from my current club. Or, I was taken from my home-state at 17 and want to go home. All I have to do is find a club who wants me and I can go and play there...

But if I've spent 7 years at Richmond and want out, all I have to do is tell them I want out.

They either arrange a trade to the club of my choice (usual) or I go into the PSD. If I have to use the PSD I put a price on my head and get the pay I want.

By all means make the trade easier to work, but I'd hate to see 24/25 yo's leave their club for no recompence just because things look tough in the next few years.

[Raw Toast]

Good points MJP and I like the amendation you suggest but I'm also pretty opposed to free agency. It gives fans a raw deal I think and has the potential to really undercut the equalisation strategies.

Many fans already struggle a bit with loyalty issues over the current trading system and free agency would mean much more player movement. Good for players but they are already doing pretty nicely, particularly those who would be able to use free agency as a means of moving to another club. Do we have enough fans to cope with the number of supporters who might be put off by this? (I spoke to Essendon's CEO Peter Jackson a few years ago about fan loyalty and he was of the opinion that relatively small size of the Australian population meant that clubs couldn't afford to swap players with the same impunity that happens in European soccer and the major US sports).

Name clubs like Collingwood and Essendon would be greatly advantaged, as would the WA clubs who can point to the extra financial advantages of moving to Perth (or is this a Southern states furphy?). I agree with Sockeye that it gives clubs significnantly more incentive to try and rort the system.

If it is going to come in then I would like an additional limit to MJP's of 8-10 years before players became eligible for it.

Is it possible to reform trade week instead?

[mjp]

But if I've spent 7 years at Richmond and want out, all I have to do is tell them I want out.

They either arrange a trade to the club of my choice (usual) or I go into the PSD. If I have to use the PSD I put a price on my head and get the pay I want.

By all means make the trade easier to work, but I'd hate to see 24/25 yo's leave their club for no recompence just because things look tough in the next few years.

Tell the club to arrange a trade huh? There were 9 trades in total last year, and that includes Akermanis (who was leaving in any case) and the likes of McDougall/Polak who basically hadn't been getting a game. Good theory, but not that easy.

Go in the PSD? And get picked up by some other team of nuf-nufs sitting on the bottom of the ladder? Excellent - just how I want to finish my career...7 years with one bottom feeder, followed by 3 years with another one...excellent.

The players have NO say in where they are drafted originally. There should be a point in their careers when they are able to choose where they want to play footy - in most circumstances, you would hope this would be at their original club.

AFL players have less rights than those in virtually every other professional football code around the world - give them at least one chance in their careers to make a professional decision.

[mjp]

Good points MJP and I like the amendation you suggest but I'm also pretty opposed to free agency. It gives fans a raw deal I think and has the potential to really undercut the equalisation strategies.

Many fans already struggle a bit with loyalty issues over the current trading system and free agency would mean much more player movement. Good for players but they are already doing pretty nicely, particularly those who would be able to use free agency as a means of moving to another club. Do we have enough fans to cope with the number of supporters who might be put off by this? (I spoke to Essendon's CEO Peter Jackson a few years ago about fan loyalty and he was of the opinion that relatively small size of the Australian population meant that clubs couldn't afford to swap players with the same impunity that happens in European soccer and the major US sports).

Name clubs like Collingwood and Essendon would be greatly advantaged, as would the WA clubs who can point to the extra financial advantages of moving to Perth (or is this a Southern states furphy?). I agree with Sockeye that it gives clubs significnantly more incentive to try and rort the system.

If it is going to come in then I would like an additional limit to MJP's of 8-10 years before players became eligible for it.

Is it possible to reform trade week instead?


Fan loyalty? What loyalty. A few thousand of our members haven't resigned from last year, 6 thousand members (at least) didn't even bother showing up at Telstra Dome last weekend...As for trade week, the entire week is clubs trying to offload players they dont want who have valid contracts. Those who dont? Hell, just delist them. Have they been prepared for life after footy? Sure...sure they have. Aces at table tennis and playstation.

The salary cap makes the perceived benefits of Collingwood and Essendon really a moot point...with our $25 Million development, we would be as well placed as any side to take advantage...lower cost in Perth? Houses cost more there than they do in Sydney at the moment for a start.

[aker39]

I don't have a concern with richer clubs getting all of the good players, because I believe the salary cap works well to stop that.

My may concern is that a club could put 6 years of work in to a player, and then get nothing in return if he decides to leave.

[Raw Toast]

Fan loyalty? What loyalty. A few thousand of our members haven't resigned from last year, 6 thousand members (at least) didn't even bother showing up at Telstra Dome last weekend....

IIRC we have the highest supporter to member ratio in the league (and are of course still struggling because our supporter base is not that big). I'd reckon a fair proportion of those who haven't signed up are not actually supporters but sympathisers (eg people who support other teams) who think we're starting to do ok now.

I'm not saying fan's are perfectly loyal, just that part of being a fan (at least an aussie rules fan) is bonding to particular players and to a player group and if that group starts changing in large ways from year to year then at least a proportion of fans are going to get pretty disilluisioned. Aussie rules teams have much smaller fan bases than most big professional teams overseas and so loyalty can be a bigger issue (especially for smaller teams like us).


As for trade week, the entire week is clubs trying to offload players they dont want who have valid contracts. Those who dont? Hell, just delist them. Have they been prepared for life after footy? Sure...sure they have. Aces at table tennis and playstation.

No arguments with you on this one, just don't agree that the solution is to bring in free agency. Players should be better prepared for life after footy. But free agency is only going to be a viable option for players who've been fairly successful and outlasted more than half their peers. And these players already get pretty significant compensation for not being able to pick and choose who they play for.


The salary cap makes the perceived benefits of Collingwood and Essendon really a moot point...with our $25 Million development, we would be as well placed as any side to take advantage...lower cost in Perth? Houses cost more there than they do in Sydney at the moment for a start.

But free agency will increase the likelihood that clubs like Collingwood and Essendon will work harder to rort the system and they have more capacity for it than clubs like us who struggle to meet the salary cap payments anyway. And good to very good players generally want to play at prestigious clubs. I don't think it's a fluke that very few marquee players have wanted to come to us - hopefully the development, list, coaches etc will change that but some clubs are still going to suffer and others will gain (this probably happens already but free agency will make it much more of an issue imo).

My point about Perth wasn't that it was a cheaper city. More that they've been reports that players in Perth stand to gain much more money than down here through things like media deals and iinvesting in the booming economy. Might not be true, I'm just going on what I've read in footy media here.

[southerncross]

I think any player that has played 200 games of senior footy should have some say to securing his future.
I know a lot of supporters are quick to write of a 27 or 28yo as being too old but I think we are losing too many player from the game because they are regarded as old. I think if there is a way of providing these guys to find other options then it should be explored.

Uncontrolled free agency would be an issue for the smaller clubs but if they have the right controls in place it could work out well for all the clubs and players.

[Go_Dogs]

I don't have a concern with richer clubs getting all of the good players, because I believe the salary cap works well to stop that.

My may concern is that a club could put 6 years of work in to a player, and then get nothing in return if he decides to leave.

I think this is the crucial point and reading Eade's thoughts, was the one that he seemed to echo too. Imagine if after 2010 just as Cooney was hitting his prime, he decided to up and leave to the Crows and we got nothing in return....

As mjp said, there would need to be certain restrictions placed on the free agency as so not to undermine clubs completely. I think in theory it's a good idea, but it would have to be done in a way that ensures equality and doesn't increase factors such as the 'go home' one etc, on younger draftees, particularly given the ever-increasingly nation-wide selections that are occurring.

[The Coon Dog]

Some observations:


Free agency will hurt AFL: Mick Malthouse (http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/free-agency-will-hurt-afl-mick-malthouse/story-e6frf9jf-1225795032113)

COLLINGWOOD coach Mick Malthouse has warned that the introduction of free agency would lead to big clubs dominating the league.

The AFL Players Association has been calling for the introdution of free agency, claiming that at the moment it is too difficult for players to move clubs.

After the recent trade period, despite the failure of Collingwood to get a deal done with St Kilda for Luke Ball, the AFL said it felt the current system was working well without free agency.

But despite missing out on Ball, Malthouse is no fan of free agency.

"If we had free agency …would we start to get back to what we were in the '60s and '70s where four clubs dominated the competition because they had the money and all the clout?" he said the AFL website.

"Unfortunately, I've got to say that will take place."......



Clause could force AFL to act on free agency (http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/clause-could-force-afl-to-act-on-free-agency/story-e6frf9jf-1225786062951)

A LITTLE-KNOWN clause in the AFL Collective Bargaining Agreement threatens to bring the free agency battle to flash point.

The AFL Players' Association has grown increasingly frustrated by inaction from the league and has the right to withdraw its support for the current transfer rules.

If the AFLPA revoked its agreement under the clause, it would be significantly easier for players to launch legal action against the league's restrictive player-movement system.

A working party has been investigating the issue for more than two years and the AFLPA is uneasy about the lack of progress given the swift movement on more complex issues such as new teams on the Gold Coast and in western Sydney.

Luke Ball being left in limbo on Friday has strengthened the AFLPA's resolve to call on the commission to step in and fast-track a form of free agency.......



Matthew Richardson in favour of free agency (http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/matthew-richardson-in-favour-of-free-agency/story-e6frf9jf-1225718209408)

VETERAN Richmond star Matthew Richardson has thrown his support behind free agency being introduced in the AFL, but allayed fears it would lead to disloyalty among players.

Richardson, at 34 the oldest current player, said he supported the AFL Players' Association's moves to have free agency introduced by 2012 to provide an easier pathway for players to switch clubs.

"I think that free agency should come in, definitely," Richardson told FM radio station Vega on Friday.

"People say they're worried that all the big stars would leave clubs and move clubs, but over the history of the game not a lot of the real big names have actually moved clubs......

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

Did everyone read the article yesterday where Brendon Gale said the AFLPA are puishing for unrestricted free agency after 7 years?

What are everyone's thoughts?

Personally, I am vehemantly opposed to it.

It will guarantee:

* Clubs near the bottom will move on mature age players to free up cap to raid the clubs further up the list. You will now be able to get off the bottom with the cheque book again (hello Carlton).

* Clubs have a fantastic reason to cheat the salary cap. At the moment, if you cheat the salary cap the rewards aren't particularily great and the penalties are huge. With free agency the rewards could be huge as well - some clubs will have a crack.

* Kids will cry when their favorite player leaves their club (yes Bernie Quinlan, I'm looking at you).

* Western Australians will go home


I can see the bad old days of the 70's happening all over again.

Sockeye,

I am in agreement with you. Not a lot to like about the AFL at the moment but the introduction of the Draft and Salary Cap has been the salvation of many Victorian clubs
in particular the Western Bulldogs.The evenness of the competition can be traced back to these two factors.
Can you imagine the number of clubs that will suffer to the likes of the Gold Coast and Western Sydney where buckets of money is being provided to prop them up.
Little concern being shown by Brendan Gale as to the future of the game. Will be interesting to see if he makes any impact back at Richmond.

[Remi Moses]

Brendan Gale must be the only Union boss in history in favour of having less members. That 's would occur if free agency entered our game,less teams which in real terms means less members for AFLPA. Honestly how many players don't get to their destination?

[bornadog]

http://www.theage.com.au/news/rfnews/malthouse-slams-free-agency/2009/11/06/1257247751804.html

Malthouse slams free-agency push

November 7, 2009


THE AFL's longest-serving coach, Collingwood's Mick Malthouse, says player calls for free agency should be resisted for the sake of maintaining an even competition.

Malthouse says giving senior players the chance to join the team of their choice risked creating a league dominated by a select few clubs.

''If we had free agency, would we start to get back to what we were in the '60s and '70s, where four clubs dominated the competition because they had the money and all the clout?'' Malthouse asked on the AFL website.

''Unfortunately, I've got to say that will take place.''

The AFL Players Association has been campaigning for a limited form of free agency and says it has almost unanimous backing from players. It wants players with seven years of service to be able to move to the club of their choice.

The AFLPA used St Kilda midfielder Luke Ball's failure to get his wish to join Collingwood in October's trade period to help justify the push.

But, Malthouse said the fact that 23 other players had managed to switch clubs indicated it was not needed, urging AFL football operations manager Adrian Anderson to ''hold firm''.

''This year has been an extraordinary year in player movement,'' Malthouse said. ''So free agency, in effect, can be almost put on the backburner because of the sheer numbers that have changed clubs. I'm at the end of my career but I want to see this game develop and be the greatest game. The only fear I have is of a two-tiered system which could develop from a free-agency factor.''

The AFLPA has argued that the salary cap and a limit on the size of clubs' player lists will ensure the evenness of the competition is not jeopardised.

Malthouse added that there were aspects of trade week he did not like, saying it ''brings out the worst in people''. ''There are too many suspicions, too many undertone whisperings … everyone wants a $10 player and only wants to give $5 up.''

- North Melbourne yesterday announced the final members of the new Brad Scott-led coaching staff with former Collingwood utility Shane Watson to become back-line coach and Jason Lappin development coach. They will join Darren Crocker, Brett Allison, Glenn Archer and John Lamont.

Watson, who played 141 games for the Magpies, has been coaching the Eastern Ranges in the TAC Cup while Lappin, the older brother of former Carlton forward Matthew, led Wangaratta to flags in 2007 and 2008.

AAP

[anfo27]

After reading all the comments i agree with mjp. I think there needs to be free agency but there also needs to be compensation included.
I think baseball has a good model of free agency. In baseball players in free agency are placed in different categories. So for example if Cooney chooses to go home he would be a categorie A player and therefore our compensation would be an early first round pick even if Adelaide don't have one.

[Twodogs]

After reading all the comments i agree with mjp. I think there needs to be free agency but there also needs to be compensation included.
I think baseball has a good model of free agency. In baseball players in free agency are placed in different categories. So for example if Cooney chooses to go home he would be a categorie A player and therefore our compensation would be an early first round pick even if Adelaide don't have one.



So if Adelaide dont have one they miss out? Or is it up to them to find one.

[anfo27]

So if Adelaide dont have one they miss out? Or is it up to them to find one.

I explained that pretty poorly so i'll try again. In baseball a player who has been playing for 6 years or more & is out of contact is eligible for free aganecy. Free agents are then placed in 3 different categories type A, type B & type C and Type A free agents are worth 2 first round draft picks.

So for example if A Rod from the Yankees leaves New York as a free agent to sign with Boston then the Yankees would get Bostons first round pick & a second first round pick at the end of the first round.

[Drunken Bum]

I explained that pretty poorly so i'll try again. In baseball a player who has been playing for 6 years or more & is out of contact is eligible for free aganecy. Free agents are then placed in 3 different categories type A, type B & type C and Type A free agents are worth 2 first round draft picks.

So for example if A Rod from the Yankees leaves New York as a free agent to sign with Boston then the Yankees would get Bostons first round pick & a second first round pick at the end of the first round.

Where does the second first rounder come from? Boston has to trade for one or it is granted by the league? I do not like the idea of the league granting one and then pushing all the other clubs not involved in the trade back one spot in the scond round, it should be up to Boston to find another pick if they really want the player.

[Sockeye Salmon]

I explained that pretty poorly so i'll try again. In baseball a player who has been playing for 6 years or more & is out of contact is eligible for free aganecy. Free agents are then placed in 3 different categories type A, type B & type C and Type A free agents are worth 2 first round draft picks.

So for example if A Rod from the Yankees leaves New York as a free agent to sign with Boston then the Yankees would get Bostons first round pick & a second first round pick at the end of the first round.

So assuming that a top player like that is only going to go to another top team, your example means A-Rod is worth about the same as Jonathon Hay (picks 14 & 18).

[Twodogs]

Where does the second first rounder come from?


Yep, I'm still a bit vague on that.

[The Coon Dog]

Yep, I'm still a bit vague on that.

From how I read it, it just gets tacked on at the end of the first round, in essence, bumping every other selection after that back by one.

[Twodogs]

From how I read it, it just gets tacked on at the end of the first round, in essence, bumping every other selection after that back by one.


So all the other teams take one up the clacker for the benefit of a competitor? That'd go down well with the other AFL clubs!

[hujsh]

So all the other teams take one up the clacker for the benefit of a competitor? That'd go down well with the other AFL clubs!

No different to priority picks IMO.

[anfo27]

So assuming that a top player like that is only going to go to another top team, your example means A-Rod is worth about the same as Jonathon Hay (picks 14 & 18).

Thats how i understand it but there are parts that get confusing. For example the Yankees signed 3 of the best free agents at the end of last season & 2 of those (CC Sabathia & Mark Texieira) would of been Type A free agents. The Yankees don't have enough first round picks to go around but they still signed them, so i'm not entirely sure what compensation those teams received.

I personally would like something similar to that model but with the 2nd first round pick not set in stone at the end of the first round. So if Adam Cooney left to go home & Adelaide finished in the top 4 then instead of getting 14 & 17 we would get 14 & 5.

[anfo27]

From how I read it, it just gets tacked on at the end of the first round, in essence, bumping every other selection after that back by one.

Spot on TCD.

[LostDoggy]

I think what Brendan Gale is asking for is fair enough. He is looking for the players best interests. And that is unfortunately a free agency. They are limited by their industry in where they can work. It must be frustrating in that after years of service you don't have much say in where you can go and what will happen.

The AFL is doing its best to limit this to keep the competition even and fair which is a good thing. Still I believe that if the players keep pushing for it then some sort of restricted free agency should apply. I think 8 years of service or 200 games at a single club should be the minimum before you have the right to pick where you can play. And then the trade must be a first rounder and the losing club must get some other form of compensation (extra rookie perhaps?, second or third round also?).

In any case I don't think it will be that bad to let in a restrictive free trade. How many players will use this? Will we see superstars changing clubs? I don't think so. I think it will help the Luke Ball's of the world but true champions like Johno, Brown, Riewoldt, etc will be one club players.

[The Coon Dog]

A couple more articles on Free Agency.

Payments under examination in free agency talks


CAROLINE WILSON
December 6, 2009

THIRD-party payments to footballers have come under renewed scrutiny from the AFL, placing the league at odds with its players' union and creating another hurdle in the contentious free agency negotiations.

Football operations boss Adrian Anderson has told the AFL Players Association that payments outside the salary cap, such as Chris Judd's annual six-figure agreement with the Visy Group, have become a concern for the competition as it fights to retain equalisation among the clubs.

Anderson has also told player agents that the AFL executive was having second thoughts about outside payments and the potential damage they could inflict on the weaker clubs, particularly if they face losing their stars once free agency is introduced.

Article in full... (http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/payments-under-examination-in-free-agency-talks-20091205-kc39.html)


AFL justifiably wary of free agency


CAROLINE WILSON
December 6, 2009

EVERYBODY knows AFL footballers will soon be able to move clubs without being forced to subject themselves to the indignity and risk of the trade period, or to the uncertainty of the national, pre-season or rookie drafts.

We know free agency is coming because the clubs have been told it is just around the corner and warned to prepare to lose players after a period of service to be determined by the AFL and its players' union.

We know it because the AFL, without a leg to stand on legally given the very foundation of the player rules amount to a gross restraint of trade, is introducing two new clubs which it cannot hope to give major advantages via draft and trade concessions without spreading the love throughout the playing group.

Article in full... (http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/afl-justifiably-wary-of-free-agency-20091205-kc3a.html)

[Go_Dogs]

Football operations boss Adrian Anderson has told the AFL Players Association that payments outside the salary cap, such as Chris Judd's annual six-figure agreement with the Visy Group, have become a concern for the competition as it fights to retain equalisation among the clubs.

You're kidding me??? Anderson said this?? Let's see if action follows his words.

[The Coon Dog]

Clubs talk on free agency


CAROLINE WILSON February 10, 2010

HAWTHORN president Jeff Kennett has called a summit of club chiefs to thrash out the forthcoming spectre of free agency in the belief the AFL and its players are close to an historic deal.

Kennett, who has grave misgivings for the game should the AFL compromise upon its pre-Christmas stand on free agency, has written to his 15 fellow presidents calling for a meeting in six days to update the clubs on his own concerns under the proposed system.

Kennett is understood to have the ideological support of his Collingwood counterpart Eddie McGuire, who has spoken out in opposition to free agency in the past.

Article in full... (http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/clubs-talk-on-free-agency-20100209-nppd.html)


Should the AFL introduce free agency for players?

YES - (Michael Gleeson) - CURTIS Flood was the pioneering baseballer who took on the sport's archaic rules tying players to clubs. In evocative terms in an interview with Howard Cosell, he said that as a professional baseballer he was ''a well-paid slave, but a slave, nevertheless''.

Flood took on the system and lost, but it paved the way for others. It generated an attitudinal change that ultimately led to the introduction of free agency into baseball.


NO - (Caroline Wilson) - JEFF Kennett is right to be concerned about the so-called ''inevitable'' prospect of free agency thrusting itself into the still spiritual elite of Australian football.

The Hawthorn president has come out with some pretty crazy statements over the journey but he appears well-versed on this issue and understands better than most just how crucial the even nature of the competition has been for both the AFL and for the Hawks - the first club to win a premiership after sinking close to the bottom under the modern system.

Article in full... (http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/should-the-afl-introduce-free-agency-for-players-20100209-nppe.html)

[Twodogs]

A quote from Smorgo in the Age article from TCD's post above;


The thoughts of Western Bulldogs president David Smorgon echoed those of several other club chiefs when he told The Age late yesterday: ''Free agency has not been an issue on our agenda. Clearly it is now.''


I guess it's inevitble.

[Go_Dogs]

Players are still able to get the trade they desire 9/10 times, so I don't see it as being a huge issue - players are relatively free to move to another club if they wish.

As Caroline did mention, the poorer clubs are sure to be hit by free agency, and that will run contrary to the aims of the AFL. Not to mention, Western Sydney could lose it's whole list after their first 7 years in the competition - hang on....maybe it is a good idea?

If they bring it in, I really hope they look for something more like a 10 year at one club requirement, or for 10 year players, 10 years on a Senior AFL list.

[The Coon Dog]

Players are still able to get the trade they desire 9/10 times, so I don't see it as being a huge issue

Except they had to trade for them, in other words, give up something. All you'll get in return from free agency is memories.

[Go_Dogs]

Except they had to trade for them, in other words, give up something. All you'll get in return from free agency is memories.

Sorry, I don't think I was very clear.

What I meant was, the issue of player movement isn't a big one IMO. Players are able to move on if they wish, and generally end up where they want to. And yes, the flow on effect is that generally clubs get "something" for a leaving player, which is fair. (Unless they go the Port/Stevens route, and end up with nothing).

I think you're right about the memories part too, but I think they might be bitter memories.

[Sockeye Salmon]

I hate the whole "they need to earn their living over a short career" arguement.

If they are currently out-of-contract and have a better offer they can ask to be traded to the club of their choice. If the trade cannot be arranged they can still nominate for either draft, state their required pay and earn exactly what they can get.

[FrediKanoute]

3 points re free agency.

1) happy with the 7 or 8 years as I think by that stage a player has served his club well and if success hasn't happened then seeking success elsewhere is reasonable. The on caveat I would put on it is that the 7 or 8 years is from the year of debut, not the year of joining the club. Hence it would effectively mean that the 1 or 2 years of early developmnet time put into a player are not counted.

2) I think what will happen will be a change in strategy of clubs in dealing with transfers. In Europe, a player whose contract is coming to an end can walk, despite the transfer fees paid for their services. The spectre of losing a top player for nothing means that players are typically signed on 4 or 5 year deals and then generally with 18 months to go they are put on the market if the club believes that they will not re-sign once their contract ends.

You could see this happening in the AFL where, say the WB's choose to trade Lake (for eg) 12 months prior to his contract ending and thus get compensated in the form of a player swap or a high draft pick. Those clubs unlikely to be "chosen" by the players who have a need for Lake, say Dee's, Kangas and can afford him in their cap, would jump at the chance to get him before he became a free agent. The arguement of "loyalty" then goes out the window since if Lake (for eg) was looking to walk in 12 months anyway why should the club look after him?

3) the real problem is the 3rd party payments. Lets face it most of these arrangements are sham's and the amount of "work" the player does to justify the additional payments is disproportionate. Stopping/regulating these is the way to go. I think it falls to the AFL to do this and the penalty for misuse needs to fall on the clubs - transfer ban's would be the way to go....not draft ban's.

[LostDoggy]

The whole idea of free agency put more emphasis on individual players interests than club interests. In a team game sport that's wrong.

[Twodogs]

It looks like the qualification is going to 7 years on a list. That looks like what the Players Association are going to make sure happens. Finnis is very much defining his new administration with these negotiations and he's said publicly that he wants the qualification to be 7 years.


Has anyone got the time to list all the Bulldog players that will qualify by seasons end? I had a quick look at the official site but that only says when players debuted not when they were drafted.

[Sockeye Salmon]

3 points re free agency.

1) happy with the 7 or 8 years as I think by that stage a player has served his club well and if success hasn't happened then seeking success elsewhere is reasonable. The on caveat I would put on it is that the 7 or 8 years is from the year of debut, not the year of joining the club. Hence it would effectively mean that the 1 or 2 years of early developmnet time put into a player are not counted.

2) I think what will happen will be a change in strategy of clubs in dealing with transfers. In Europe, a player whose contract is coming to an end can walk, despite the transfer fees paid for their services. The spectre of losing a top player for nothing means that players are typically signed on 4 or 5 year deals and then generally with 18 months to go they are put on the market if the club believes that they will not re-sign once their contract ends.

You could see this happening in the AFL where, say the WB's choose to trade Lake (for eg) 12 months prior to his contract ending and thus get compensated in the form of a player swap or a high draft pick. Those clubs unlikely to be "chosen" by the players who have a need for Lake, say Dee's, Kangas and can afford him in their cap, would jump at the chance to get him before he became a free agent. The arguement of "loyalty" then goes out the window since if Lake (for eg) was looking to walk in 12 months anyway why should the club look after him?

3) the real problem is the 3rd party payments. Lets face it most of these arrangements are sham's and the amount of "work" the player does to justify the additional payments is disproportionate. Stopping/regulating these is the way to go. I think it falls to the AFL to do this and the penalty for misuse needs to fall on the clubs - transfer ban's would be the way to go....not draft ban's.

1. Don't give a rookie a game late in the year to extend the time you have a hold over him by another year. If you are really crap and want to develop kids you risk playing rookies that you could lose by the time they are 25.

2. One of the reasons we love our footy is because of the 'ownership'. They're our boys. We watch them get drafted, play their first games with skinny legs like new foals and love them when they turn into stars. We always love our home grown that little bit more (sorry Aker).

We are risking losing the tribal passion, the reason we can afford 9 teams in a city of 4 million people. We love our clubs because we feel like our boys are family, we all know Johnno from his gait, long before we see his face or number.

Why should we love mercenaries who are happy to play for the highest bidder? Why should we (emotionally) bleed for the club when we know those on the ground don't give a crap about the club? You all read the forums when we get smashed - "they weren't trying", "they don't play for the jumper" we scream. We will be right, they won't.

3. How can you regulate it? It's impossible. Someone with no official affilliation to any club offers the player money. How do you possibly regulate against it? I've told the story here before about a high profile indigenous player who personally told me he was paid $20K by his club president for "original aboriginal artwork". Who decides whether the player is a genuine artist or not? The same player was getting his flying lessons (not cheap) paid for by an indigenous community group, the same group that the players club donated tens of $000's to.


Right now there is not really a massive benefit by cheating the salary cap. If you want to lure a gun from another club you still have to give up plenty in a trade, you're not that much better off.

But what if you could pick up Jonathon Brown for nothing and the only thing standing in your way was the salary cap...?

[FrediKanoute]

1. Don't give a rookie a game late in the year to extend the time you have a hold over him by another year. If you are really crap and want to develop kids you risk playing rookies that you could lose by the time they are 25?

That may well be the case, but in general terms coaches and match committees are not employed/assesed on three or fours years down the track, the majority are assessed on the here and now. If you have a kid in the VFL banging down the door you will play him regardless of whether you'll lose him in 7 years or not. That said, what it will stop though is those players who develop late....think Boumann, Cordy, Grant, Jones etc.... from being poached just as they hit their peak. The caveat I suggest....and its only a suggestion.... is aimed at protecting devlopment so that the team developing gets to reap some of the benefits.


2. One of the reasons we love our footy is because of the 'ownership'. They're our boys. We watch them get drafted, play their first games with skinny legs like new foals and love them when they turn into stars. We always love our home grown that little bit more (sorry Aker).

We are risking losing the tribal passion, the reason we can afford 9 teams in a city of 4 million people. We love our clubs because we feel like our boys are family, we all know Johnno from his gait, long before we see his face or number.

Why should we love mercenaries who are happy to play for the highest bidder? Why should we (emotionally) bleed for the club when we know those on the ground don't give a crap about the club? You all read the forums when we get smashed - "they weren't trying", "they don't play for the jumper" we scream. We will be right, they won't.

Valid points and yes free agency will mean these things diminish and its a reason the AFL has for so long resisted it. However from all accounts its coming. As a club we can either be a club that stands still and refuses to acknowoledge this change or look at how other codes deal with the issue of free agency. One thing is for certain though the days of guys being one club players are over. They will become the exception rather than the rule. However I don't think too many people here will be complaining if a couple of ringins, Aka and bazza step up on the podium to collect their Premiership medals......


3. How can you regulate it? It's impossible. Someone with no official affilliation to any club offers the player money. How do you possibly regulate against it? I've told the story here before about a high profile indigenous player who personally told me he was paid $20K by his club president for "original aboriginal artwork". Who decides whether the player is a genuine artist or not? The same player was getting his flying lessons (not cheap) paid for by an indigenous community group, the same group that the players club donated tens of $000's to.


Right now there is not really a massive benefit by cheating the salary cap. If you want to lure a gun from another club you still have to give up plenty in a trade, you're not that much better off.

But what if you could pick up Jonathon Brown for nothing and the only thing standing in your way was the salary cap...?

Not easy, but if the AFL are serious about the draft and salary cap integrity then they have to do better to police 3rd party player payments. One way of doing it would be make all players who register for the draft sign a release enabling the AFL to view their Income Tax Return. From this the AFL could then identify those incomes which far exceed that listed on the official player payments listing and investigate.

Further, clubs should be made to disclose all payments made to the club or its employees by 3rd parties. Hence its revenues from sponsor's should be disclosed, whether paid to the club or direct to the player. This would put into the open the extent of payments being made. Allowance should be made for maybe an additional 25% of the salary cap to be paid to players in the form of payments from club sponsors. anything above this would be deemed in excess of the salary cap and the club subject to sanctions.

the players should, as their right, be well rewarded for their time in football, but the integrity of the game remains paramount as without the game these guys would be and will be just bums on the street.

[Sockeye Salmon]

the players should, as their right, be well rewarded for their time in football

They already are, and if a player is out of contract and gets a better offer he asks to be traded. In the vast majority of instances this happens - Gibson, Hall, Jolly and Burgoyne this year - and very occasionally it doesn't - Ball this year and and Stevens infamously half a dozen years ago.

For those that don't get their trade done - almost always because the side losing their player are being prats to him for walking out - the player has the option of one of two drafts. He places a price on his head when he nominates and will (usually) get to where he wants to go (Ball, Bradshaw) and sometimes (very rarely) won't (Stevens) but even if he doesn't, he still gets paid what he wants (except for the dodgy bit he got promised as a special "signing on" fee).

The "we have a right to earn a living" arguement doesn't stand up unless you acknowledge it's really "we have a right to earn a living and a bit extra under the table" arguement.


Free agency is about making it easier for players to receive under the table payments, end of story.


May the best cheats win.

[divvydan]

Free to go after eight years


Mike Sheahan
Herald Sun
Feb 23 2010


THE AFL Commission is believed to have set eight years as the qualifying period for the highly contentious free agency for players.

AFL chief executive Andrew Demetriou is expected to make the announcement to club presidents and chief executives at a meeting in Melbourne today.

Full article (http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/free-to-go-after-eight-years/story-e6frf9jf-1225833211887)

[chef]

Would have prefered 10 years. It will be interesting to see how they work out compensation.

[bulldogtragic]

Not a fan here.

[Go_Dogs]

8 years better than what it could have been, but 10 years is also what I would have preferred. At the end of the day though, the career-life of an AFL player is an unpredictable thing, so allowing them to move after 8 years is sufficient I think.

The devil is still in the detail, so I don't want to pass off judgements without seeing the concept in its entirety, suffice to say that a compensation formula is a good concept, whether the application is good, (most likely not knowing the AFL's history with such things) will be the crucial part.

This was bound to happen, but the AFL just need to be weary and keep in mind what they have the salary cap, and draft picks for - to keep the competition even. FA may act against that, so they need to be mindful and make sure that none of the richer clubs can expose a loop hole or act improperly to gain advantage.

[divvydan]

Some of the main points of the free agency to come in for 2012.

• Players delisted by a club on or before 31 October will be unrestricted free agents.

• If a player has completed 8 seasons at a club on the primary list and is NOT in the top 25% of salaries (at that club), they are eligible for unrestricted free agency when their contract expires. Their current club does NOT have the option to match an offer

• If a player has completed 8 or more seasons at a club on the primary list and are in the top 25% of salaries (at that club), they are eligible for RESTRICTED free agency when their contract expires. Their current club has the opportunity to match the preferred option that the player chooses. If the offer is matched, the player then has the opportunity to stay with the current club, seek a trade or enter the draft.

• If a player has served 10 or more seasons on the primary list at one club and has already come out of contract once before after 8 or more seasons, then the next time their contract ends, they will be eligible for unrestricted free agency. The player can choose their preferred option and their current club does NOT have the right to match that offer.

• All offers from clubs can only include capped salary and capped Additional Services Agreement (ASA) amount.

• Compensation in the form of draft pick(s) will apply to clubs with a NET loss of free agents in a transfer period.

• The veterans list will be amended to apply to players with 10years service at a club (no mention of age) and will be a set amount of TPP per player calculated as a % of TPP. This differs from the currently policy of 50% of a player’s salary for up to 2 players (1/n for more than 2 players, where n= number of veterans)

Obviously the critical thing will be enforcing the independent third party deals that certain clubs (you know who) like to use.

In reality, there are probably few occasions where a player will have played 8 seasons with a club and not be in the top 25% of salaries at that club, unless a high percentage of players were recruited over a one/two year period.

This may mean that clubs will try and get players on longer term contracts after they’ve been at a club for 6-7 years and conversely, player managers will be doing everything to ensure a player comes out of contract after 8 years and again after 10 years.

The compensation aspect is interesting, not only to work out what the formula is but also that it’s based on a net loss of free agents. Thus if a team were to lose a great player and pick up an average player they wouldn’t get compensated as they’ve lost one player and gained one player.

[OLD SCRAGGer]

Not a fan here.


Neither am I:mad::mad::mad:

[chef]

Thanks divvydan, so many variables.

[LostDoggy]

• If a player has completed 8 or more seasons at a club on the primary list and are in the top 25% of salaries (at that club), they are eligible for RESTRICTED free agency when their contract expires. Their current club has the opportunity to match the preferred option that the player chooses. If the offer is matched, the player then has the opportunity to stay with the current club, seek a trade or enter the draft.


I don't understand this clause, especially the bolded part. Does this mean that the player still gets to choose if he is traded despite his club matching the offer? How is this any different to unrestricted free agency, then?

It's just giving the original club a chance to match the offer, right? No matter what they're calling it, it's ALL Unrestricted Free Agency, it's just that the 'not in the top 25%' clause is even more diabolical as a players' original club doesn't even get to be in the bidding war!

Just bull$hit clauses attempting to pull the wool over the eyes of the masses.

[aker39]

I don't understand this clause, especially the bolded part. Does this mean that the player still gets to choose if he is traded despite his club matching the offer? How is this any different to unrestricted free agency, then?



It's restricted because if the club matches the offer, and the player still wants to go, he can only go to another club via a trade (where the original club would be compensated with a new player, just as it is now) or the player takes the risk and goes in to the draft.

[LostDoggy]

It's restricted because if the club matches the offer, and the player still wants to go, he can only go to another club via a trade (where the original club would be compensated with a new player, just as it is now) or the player takes the risk and goes in to the draft.

Ah of course. Wasn't really thinking clearly. Thanks aker39!

[anfo27]

I don't understand this clause, especially the bolded part. Does this mean that the player still gets to choose if he is traded despite his club matching the offer? How is this any different to unrestricted free agency, then?

It's just giving the original club a chance to match the offer, right? No matter what they're calling it, it's ALL Unrestricted Free Agency, it's just that the 'not in the top 25%' clause is even more diabolical as a players' original club doesn't even get to be in the bidding war!

Just bull$hit clauses attempting to pull the wool over the eyes of the masses.

I'm with you Lantern it doesn't quite make sense to me.

I think its easier if a player comes out of contract & the club still wants him then the club can offer him arbitration. Then the player has the choice to take the contact offered by his exsisting club or go else where & if he does go else where no matter what his original club gets compensated.

[angelopetraglia]

A new world of trades begin.

There will be so many new variables into play. I'm sure it will take a while for eveyone to see excatly how the landscape will change.

The key is the "under the carpert / third party" payments that if not enforced very strongly will see the superstar players all at those clubs with the most resources.

This is what worries me the most.

[Hotdog60]

Are we going to end up back were the rich clubs snare all the players. 8 years at a club if recruited when 18 years old will be in their prime at this time. All the work put into player development can be reaped by another club with more money.

Collingwood
Carlton
Essendon


Days of old here we come.

[divvydan]

A new world of trades begin.

There will be so many new variables into play. I'm sure it will take a while for eveyone to see excatly how the landscape will change.

The key is the "under the carpert / third party" payments that if not enforced very strongly will see the superstar players all at those clubs with the most resources.

This is what worries me the most.

That's certainly a concern I share and added to that is the greater profile and post career opportunity that going to some clubs provide, particularly if/when someone from the management/board is also an influential media personality.

The other issue is that clubs with lower profiles or abilities to enable players to earn outside football will have to pay relatively more to entice potential free agents from other clubs and the possible snowball effect that might have on the playing list with less money to go to upcoming players, which in turn increases the chance that they'll leave.

[Rocco Jones]

Are we going to end up back were the rich clubs snare all the players. 8 years at a club if recruited when 18 years old will be in their prime at this time. All the work put into player development can be reaped by another club with more money.

Collingwood
Carlton
Essendon


Days of old here we come.

More like

West Coast
Adelaide
Collingwood

Essendon and Carlton can fight it off to be the best of the rest.

[Bulldog4life]

Now the AFL have gone down this track it surely has to make the draw each year more equal. As an example as it is now Collingwood could offer a player from another Club regular games on the MCG, Anzac Day game against Essendon every year etc etc. What do others think?

[chef]

More like

West Coast
Adelaide
Collingwood

Essendon and Carlton can fight it off to be the best of the rest.

There will be a lot more players going back to their home states. Do you think this is going to affect the interstate clubs more than the Vics?

[Sockeye Salmon]

As inevitable as this was, today is one of the darkest days in football's history.

My son was born in 2003. At the time I seriously questioned whether I would enourage him to follow the Bulldogs; I didn't want him to get to 12 and have his football team taken away from him.

If I was to have another child now, I would encourage them to barrack for Essendon because we our days are surely numbered.

All that good work by David Smorgon, Campbell Rose and the rest will soon be wasted and we'll be back where we started - fighting for survival until it becomes impossible and we die.


'Arna Cheats!!!

[boydogs]

There will be a lot more players going back to their home states. Do you think this is going to affect the interstate clubs more than the Vics?

Maybe Brisbane and Sydney, but they have bigger salary caps don't they?

[Happy Days]

Will this model of free agency also include the ability to sign players mid season to cover injuries, etc, like the American models do?

[The Coon Dog]

How free agency in the AFL will work




1. A player has served seven seasons or less of AFL football at one club, and is now out of contract.

The player is not eligible for free agency if his club wishes to retain him. He may only move clubs via a trade or the Draft. If he delists himself, he is subject to the Draft, and may be selected by any club.


2. A player has served seven seasons or less of AFL football at one club, and has been delisted by his club.

The player is a Free Agent and is eligible to field offers from all rival AFL clubs.

The player must decide on the best offer of his choice from one rival club.

The player can move AUTOMATICALLY to the new club of his choice.

His original club, which chose to delist him, does not receive any compensation pick for the loss of the player.


3. A player has served eight or more seasons of AFL football at one club, is one of the 10 highest-paid players at his club, and is now out of contract for the first time since reaching eight seasons of service.

The player is eligible to field offers from all rival AFL clubs.

If he wishes to change clubs, the player must decide on the best offer of his choice from one rival club.

His club has the right to match the presented offer.

If the club matches the offer, he may choose to remain with his original club, seek a trade or enter the Draft.

If the club does not or can not match the offer, the player can move to the new club of his choice.

His original club will receive a compensation pick for the loss of the player, on an AFL-determined formula to apply where clubs lose more free agents than they gain in any single transfer period.


4. A player has served eight or more seasons of AFL football at one club, is NOT one of the 10 highest-paid players at his club, and is now out of contract for the first time since reaching eight seasons of service.

The player is eligible to field offers from all rival AFL clubs.

If he wishes to change clubs, the player must decide on the best offer of his choice from one rival club.

His club does NOT have the right to match the presented offer, and the player can move AUTOMATICALLY to the new club of his choice.

His original club will receive a compensation pick for the loss of the player, on an AFL-determined formula.


5. A player has served ten or more seasons of AFL football at one club, has already come out of contract once in the period after serving his first eight or more seasons at his club, and is now out of contract.

The player is eligible to field offers from all rival clubs.

If he wishes to change clubs, the player must decide on the best offer of his choice from one rival club.

His club does NOT have the right to match the presented offer, and the player can move AUTOMATICALLY to the new club of his choice.

His original club will receive a compensation pick for the loss of the player, on an AFL-determined formula.


Source: AFL.com.au

[Sockeye Salmon]

Ryan Griffen - out of contract at the end of this year - re-signs for another two years. 2012 will be Griffen's 8th year at the club so if his manager allows him to sign for any longer he is totally incompetent.

Late 2010, when Griffen signs his contract extension, Griffen is not in our best 10 players. 2011 (his 6th season) is Griffen's breakout year and by 2012 he is one of the top midfielders in the league. he will be eligible for UNRESTRICTED free agency.

His only decision to make will be to take up the $1 million/year for the sports comments spot on Adelaide's channel 7 to go with the $300K/year he gets from the Crows or take the $1.2 million/year to do advertising for Lexus to supplement the $220K/year salary at Collingwood (that's all they can afford to stay under the salary cap).

[Rocco Jones]

There will be a lot more players going back to their home states. Do you think this is going to affect the interstate clubs more than the Vics?

West Coast and Adelaide are financially stronger than Carlton and Essendon, even after giving millions back to their respective league each year.

I am not as cynical as Sockeye but if the under the table fears are true, Collingood, West Coast and Adelaide will rule the league. Gold Coast and GWS will be with them if all they don't totally waste their concessions.

If Sockeye's deepest fears are realised, the game will become a joke. Aussie Rules is a lot different to soccer when it comes to being competitive. In soccer, one side could have the best XI players on the pitch and still be held to 0-0 draws. Semi-pro/4th tier sides can draw and even beat EPL sides because of the low scoring nature. Footy is very unforgiving when it comes to being outmatched talent wise, like basketball. If the top sides have a monopoly on talent, we will see local footy type smashings in the AFL.

[divvydan]

Ryan Griffen - out of contract at the end of this year - re-signs for another two years. 2012 will be Griffen's 8th year at the club so if his manager allows him to sign for any longer he is totally incompetent.

Late 2010, when Griffen signs his contract extension, Griffen is not in our best 10 players. 2011 (his 6th season) is Griffen's breakout year and by 2012 he is one of the top midfielders in the league. he will be eligible for UNRESTRICTED free agency.

His only decision to make will be to take up the $1 million/year for the sports comments spot on Adelaide's channel 7 to go with the $300K/year he gets from the Crows or take the $1.2 million/year to do advertising for Lexus to supplement the $220K/year salary at Collingwood (that's all they can afford to stay under the salary cap).

Why exactly would Griffen not be in our 10 most paid players by the end of 2012? Cooney, Lake, Gilbee, Hargrave, Boyd?, Cross?, Higgins? Gia? Murphy? might be ahead of him but I can't see there being 10 ahead of him. Even if all the players with ? are ahead of him, that would still put him 10th and that list would be a worst case scenario one.

Assuming Griffen is out of contract at the end of this year (I've heard some varying reports so I'm unsure) and assuming he re-signs for a further two year deal, that deal will be more than his current one and in my opinion, the club would ensure he would be in the top 10 money earners at the club, even if he wasn't going to be naturally.

[Sockeye Salmon]

Why exactly would Griffen not be in our 10 most paid players by the end of 2012? Cooney, Lake, Gilbee, Hargrave, Boyd?, Cross?, Higgins? Gia? Murphy? might be ahead of him but I can't see there being 10 ahead of him. Even if all the players with ? are ahead of him, that would still put him 10th and that list would be a worst case scenario one.

Assuming Griffen is out of contract at the end of this year (I've heard some varying reports so I'm unsure) and assuming he re-signs for a further two year deal, that deal will be more than his current one and in my opinion, the club would ensure he would be in the top 10 money earners at the club, even if he wasn't going to be naturally.

He will definately be in our top 10 by 2012 but until he re-signs at the end of 2012 he won't be acknowledged as such. the AFL will rate him as to where he was when he signed the contact two years previously. Right now he is not one of our best 10 players.


How about another example, then. Brian Lake was drafted in 2001. 2009 was his 8th year. It was widely reported that he was on about $275K in 2009, clearly outside our top 10.
We managed to hold onto him - just - but if another club could get him without having to ante up a trade don't you think they would have gone a bit harder? Say Hawthorn (wouldn't a gun key back go a long way towards winning them a premiership?) decided to risk cheating the salary cap with a dodgy property deal so they could get him for free, certainly the temptation would have to be there.

The best cheats will win.

[FrediKanoute]

Well it had to come and time will tell whether its a good thing or not. A couple of things I think which need to be considered/firmed up:

1) 3rd party payments - the AFL need to police this rigourously. If we see a Collingwood side with Franklin at CHF, Judd, Cooney & Ablett in midfield, Lake at the back etc then there is something seriously wrong. They simply need to get this right or the system will fall apart.

2) I think they have got it wrong re not compensating for player development. In the Football, small clubs often retain a stake in a player and when they are transferred frm say Crystal Palace to Chelsea for a nominal fee, earn additional transfer fees from the next sale....recognition almost of the role that the development club played. I think some clubs are going to have a massive re-think about investing in player welfare and development programs if a gun player leaves once they are really contributing for effectively nothing.

3) Not everyone is going to be a winner. I think the mid-range players will suffer most. Those in the top 10% will take a greater share of the Salary Cap pie forcing the good honest players who are key to a flag tilt to earn less. We have seen at our club that Aka and Eagle are playing for a pittance to accomodate Lake and Hall, both big money earners. If you have £6m to spend on salary and £1m is going to 2 or 3 players ea, it means you have lot of guys earning less than they are earing now without the draft/trade stick to keep them happy.

[aker39]

Ryan Griffen - out of contract at the end of this year - re-signs for another two years. 2012 will be Griffen's 8th year at the club so if his manager allows him to sign for any longer he is totally incompetent.

Late 2010, when Griffen signs his contract extension, Griffen is not in our best 10 players. 2011 (his 6th season) is Griffen's breakout year and by 2012 he is one of the top midfielders in the league. he will be eligible for UNRESTRICTED free agency.

His only decision to make will be to take up the $1 million/year for the sports comments spot on Adelaide's channel 7 to go with the $300K/year he gets from the Crows or take the $1.2 million/year to do advertising for Lexus to supplement the $220K/year salary at Collingwood (that's all they can afford to stay under the salary cap).


I actually rang KB & Patrick Smith this morning with your example. They said that the AFL have yet to decide how they will calculate the top 10 players from a clubs list. They believe it wont be as simple as the top 10 salaries of contracted players.

[Go_Dogs]

Ryan Griffen - out of contract at the end of this year - re-signs for another two years. 2012 will be Griffen's 8th year at the club so if his manager allows him to sign for any longer he is totally incompetent.

Late 2010, when Griffen signs his contract extension, Griffen is not in our best 10 players. 2011 (his 6th season) is Griffen's breakout year and by 2012 he is one of the top midfielders in the league. he will be eligible for UNRESTRICTED free agency.

His only decision to make will be to take up the $1 million/year for the sports comments spot on Adelaide's channel 7 to go with the $300K/year he gets from the Crows or take the $1.2 million/year to do advertising for Lexus to supplement the $220K/year salary at Collingwood (that's all they can afford to stay under the salary cap).

Griff is contracted to the end of 2011 though, isn't he? In which case, we'll hopefully sign him to a 2+ year deal, and certainly in our top 10 $'s wise.

The Advertiser this morning is already jumping up and down about the Crows and Power being able to grab Cooney and Griffen. Clubs will need to be very mindful and probably a bit creative with how they manage players and the stages at which players receive their 'career contracts'.

The more I think about the "New AFL" the more I don't like it...but that's the direction of professional sport, and there is little that can be done. I guess we just need to brace ourselves and try to enjoy the ride, if that's possible.



AND - as far as the 'outside salary cap' payments go - the AFL is really going to need to stop turning a blind eye to this and limit the amounts and ways in which monetary and other remuneration can be paid to players outside of the salary cap. There is no doubt they are at least aware of this issue - but seemingly choose to turn a blind eye to it. It will need to be addressed, and urgently, otherwise the competition will suffer, and supporters will leave the game.

Or, alternatively, we need to find a sponsor or supporter who is happy to put our key players on their payroll so that we can cheat and enjoy the same benefits as all the other, richer clubs do.

[westdog54]

I actually rang KB & Patrick Smith this morning with your example. They said that the AFL have yet to decide how they will calculate the top 10 players from a clubs list. They believe it wont be as simple as the top 10 salaries of contracted players.

Policy on the run. Even better.

The current administration have got a lot right in their time, but they've also managed to create farce after farce in terms of how the league is run, and the writing is on the wall if they've released details of a free agency model without it even being completed.

If it isn't to be based on salaries of contracted players, how do they plan to determine it. Supercoach values? Champion Data rankings? Possessions per game?

I'm sure they'll come up with a 'simple formula' that absolutely no-one in the football world will understand.

[The Coon Dog]

I'm sure they'll come up with a 'simple formula' that absolutely no-one in the football world will understand.
Duckworth-Lewis?

[LostDoggy]

Duckworth-Lewis?

Hahahahaha. Very funny TCD. Maybe Rocket will carry a copy of it in his pocket during trade week and refer to it at the end of every over or when it starts raining.

[westdog54]

Duckworth-Lewis?

Hmmm, the Demetriou-Anderson player valuing method.

Sounds catchy...:rolleyes:

[Doc26]

All the more reason we must take our opportunity this year otherwise it could end up being a 100+ year drought. Fortunately my children are about old enough now to see and appreciate a Bulldog premiership, as for their kids, that could be a whole other story. The odds of taking a premiership are increasing each time a new Team is added and free agency for the 'struggling' clubs with little top end corporate backing just increases these odds.

I'm with Sockeye on this. The third party payment issue coupled with free agency will promote a more uneven competition than we have today and unfortunately will lead to the demise of those less fortunate. Where there's a will there's a way and clubs will exploit it by finding creative ways to get the player/s they deem will make a difference ala Judd and Carlton and his Visy ambassadorial role. No amount of AFL rhetoric in tightening controls around payments made beyond the TPP will save themselves from the looming disaster that threatens clubs like ours.

It's a short sighted determination where the AFL has relented to the ongoing pressure from the AFLPA and restraint of trade fears. I feel for the competition whenthe Media landscape takes a different strategic direction, where the billion dollar contracts dry up. How exposed would the 'weak' be then ?

[Scraggers]

Duckworth-Lewis?

Funny ... very very funny

[Throughandthrough]

.

The Advertiser this morning is already jumping up and down about the Crows and Power being able to grab Cooney and Griffen.
.


they are also basically saying that any player, ever drafted from SA would love to come back, (Gibbs, Pavilich, Didal, etc etc etc ) but any player, drafted to SA from interstate would love the culture and the facilities here and would not want to go back...


sells newspapers I guess.


Even a Crows fanatic colleague was laughing at the one sided nature of the reporting.

[The Underdog]

As much as I'd hope that this is well policed and equal for all teams, the cold hard reality (and this may be the only time I agree with Jeff Kennett) is that this will create a division in the competition between the haves and have nots.
We really do have to take our chance in the next year or two because it's only going to get harder for a team with limited resources such as ourselves. Either that or we hope the "Bulldog Hilton" makes us a heap of cash and we can have 15 or 20 paid spokespeople for the business and our "community projects".
As much as I'd like to see an upside to Free Agency, all I see is bad news for us.

[Go_Dogs]

they are also basically saying that any player, ever drafted from SA would love to come back, (Gibbs, Pavilich, Didal, etc etc etc ) but any player, drafted to SA from interstate would love the culture and the facilities here and would not want to go back...


sells newspapers I guess.


Even a Crows fanatic colleague was laughing at the one sided nature of the reporting.

Haha, yeah I know - they are completely biased and inaccurate, but still...the last thing I like reading in the morning in conjecture that our players will wind up playing for the mortal enemies!

[Swoop]

I like to consider myself an optimistic person but I must admit I question the direction that game will go after this is brought in. The system they use to value players and compensation will be subjective and therefore flawed, I will watch with great interests as it all unfolds.

[Mantis]

I like to consider myself an optimistic person but I must admit I question the direction that game will go after this is brought in. The system they use to value players and compensation will be subjective and therefore flawed, I will watch with great interests as it all unfolds.

The next 2 to 3 years will see massive change within the AFL as we have:

* 2 new teams entering the competition.
- Compromised drafts
- Ability to recruit (poach) uncontracted players due to salary cap allowances - Will compensation be fair??
- How do the extra teams effect the draw? More games?? The end of NAB Cup??
- Re-vamp of finals system??

* Free agency beginning
- Will the poorer clubs lose their best players??

I guess all we can do is sit back and hope that our club somehow keeps it's playing group together and hopefully propsers.... Personally I am just hoping we can survive.

One would think that if shit hits the fan and traditional clubs start feeling the pinch the AFL are going to come under pressure from the people who keep the game ticking over, the fans..... But I guess in reality their/our opinions mean jack shit.

I might go into the bumper sticker business as there might be a bit of work coming my way with slogans such as:

'Up Your's Demetriou/ Anderson'

[bornadog]

PLAYERS ELIGIBLE TO MOVE AT END OF 2012 SEASON

(Age at end of September 2012 in brackets)

WESTERN BULLDOGS

Matthew Boyd (30)

Adam Cooney (27)

Daniel Cross (29)

Nathan Eagleton (33)

Daniel Giansiracusa (30)

Lindsay Gilbee (31)

Ryan Griffen (26)

Mitch Hahn (31)

Ryan Hargrave (31)

Brad Johnson (36)

Brian Lake (30)

Will Minson (27)

Robert Murphy (30)


ADELAIDE

Brett Burton (34)

Michael Doughty (33)

Tyson Edwards (36)

Simon Goodwin (35)

Trent Hentschel (29)

Graham Johncock (29)

Chris Knights (26)

Ivan Maric (26)

Andrew McLeod (36)

Jason Porplyzia (27)

Brent Reilly (28)

Ben Rutten (29)

Scott Stevens (30)

Scott Thompson (29)

Nathan Van Berlo (26)

BRISBANE LIONS

Jed Adcock (26)

Simon Black (33)

Jared Brennan (28)

Jonathan Brown (30)

Jamie Charman (30)

Josh Drummond (29)

Ashley McGrath (29)

Daniel Merrett (27)

Luke Power (32)

Michael Rischitelli (26)

Troy Selwood (28)

Justin Sherman (25)

CARLTON

Eddie Betts (25)

Andrew Carrazzo (28)

Brad Fisher (28)

Ryan Houlihan (30)

Setanta O'hAilpin (29)

Jordan Russell (25)

Heath Scotland (32)

Kade Simpson (28)

Bret Thornton (28)

Jarrad Waite (29)

Andrew Walker (26)

Simon Wiggins (30)

COLLINGWOOD

Travis Cloke (25)

Leon Davis (31)

Alan Didak (29)

Josh Fraser (30)

Ben Johnson (31)

Tarkyn Lockyer (32)

Nick Maxwell (29)

Shane O'Bree (33)

Harry O'Brien (25)

Simon Prestigiacomo (34)

Sean Rusling (25)

Heath Shaw (26)

Dane Swan (28)

ESSENDON

Ricky Dyson (27)

Dustin Fletcher (37)

David Hille (31)

Jason Laycock (27)

Nathan Lovett-Murray (29)

Mark McVeigh (31)

Angus Monfries (25)

Henry Slattery (26)

Brent Stanton (26)

Jobe Watson (27)

Andrew Welsh (29)

Jason Winderlich (27)

FREMANTLE

Ryan Crowley (28)

Steven Dodd (29)

Antoni Grover (32)

Paul Hasleby (31)

Roger Hayden (31)

Des Headland (31)

Michael Johnson (27)

Luke McPharlin (30)

David Mundy (27)

Ryan Murphy (27)

Matthew Pavlich (30)

Aaron Sandilands (29)

Byron Schammer (27)

Scott Thornton (30)

GEELONG

Gary Ablett (28)

Jimmy Bartel (28)

Mark Blake (27)

Shannon Byrnes (28)

Paul Chapman (30)

Joel Corey (30)

Corey Enright (31)

Josh Hunt (30)

Steve Johnson (25)

James Kelly (28)

Cameron Ling (31)

Tom Lonergan (28)

Andrew Mackie (28)

Darren Milburn (35)

Cameron Mooney (33)

Brad Ottens (32)

Max Rooke (30)

Matthew Scarlett (33)

David Wojcinski (32)

HAWTHORN

Chance Bateman (31)

Campbell Brown (29)

Lance Franklin (25)

Luke Hodge (28)

Rick Ladson (28)

Jordan Lewis (26)

Sam Mitchell (29)

Thomas Murphy (26)

Michael Osborne (30)

Jarryd Roughead (25)

Brad Sewell (28)

Simon Taylor (30)

Clinton Young (26)

MELBOURNE

Matthew Bate (25)

Daniel Bell (27)

Cameron Bruce (33)

Aaron Davey (29)

Brad Green (31)

Mark Jamar (29)

Paul Johnson (28)

James McDonald (35)

Brad Miller (29)

Brent Moloney (28)

Jared Rivers (27)

Colin Sylvia (26)

NORTH MELBOURNE

Michael Firrito (28)

David Hale (28)

Leigh Harding (31)

Brent Harvey (34)

Corey Jones (31)

Hamish McIntosh (28)

Drew Petrie (29)

Daniel Pratt (29)

Brady Rawlings (31)

Daniel Wells (27)

PORT ADELAIDE

Dean Brogan (33)

Josh Carr (32)

Domenic Cassisi (30)

Troy Chaplin (26)

Chad Cornes (32)

Kane Cornes (29)

Brett Ebert (28)

Danyle Pearce (26)

Michael Pettigrew (27)

Steven Salopek (27)

Jacob Surjan (27)

Warren Tredrea (33)

RICHMOND

Brett Deledio (25)

Nathan Foley (27)

Daniel Jackson (26)

Kelvin Moore (28)

Chris Newman (30)

Troy Simmonds (34)

Richard Tambling (26)

Will Thursfield (26)

Shane Tuck (30)

ST KILDA

Steven Baker (32)

Jason Blake (31)

Raphael Clarke (27)

Nick Dal Santo (28)

Leigh Fisher (30)

Sam Fisher (28)

Brendon Goddard (27)

Jason Gram (28)

James Gwilt (26)

Lenny Hayes (32)

Justin Koschitzke (30)

Andrew McQualter (26)

Stephen Milne (32)

Leigh Montagna (28)

Nick Riewoldt (29)

SYDNEY

Paul Bevan (28)

Craig Bolton (32)

Jude Bolton (32)

Adam Goodes (32)

Tadhg Kennelly (31)

Brett Kirk (35)

Nick Malceski (28)

Jarrad McVeigh (27)

Jarred Moore (26)

Ryan O'Keefe (31)

Lewis Roberts-Thomson (29)

WEST COAST

Sam Butler (26)

Dean Cox (31)

Andrew Embley (31)

Darren Glass (31)

Ashley Hansen (29)

Brett Jones (30)

Daniel Kerr (29)

Mark LeCras (26)

Quinten Lynch (29)

Mark Nicoski (28)

Matt Rosa (26)

Adam Selwood (28)

Beau Waters (26)

[Swoop]

The positive from that list is majority of those players eligible from our list aren't the type of people who would leave but it's the new generation of players coming through that worries me. As they enter the AFL they will know no different and ultimately what has been known as a game of loyalty will begin to see clubs a lot more pro-active in exchanging players. I would hate to see it become like the NBA where it is hard to track players rosters from one season to another.

My other fear is how much a gap the strong clubs will create between the weaker ones. Despite the salary cap there is already a gulf between richer and poorer clubs in off-field spending and recent sutdies have shown a correlation between those who spend more ultimately equalling on-field success. From a players perspective they will want to go where the best resources are which is where the money is meanwhile the poorer clubs become even less desirable.

By their own admission the AFL have not policied contracts outside of the salary cap and therefore the cap becomes virtually irrelevant. If a company linked to a club chooses to pay any given player for services who are the AFL to say if they can or can't do that. Ultimately the player is worth whatever the employer is prepared to pay for their services and as long as they are doing something in return i.e attend 1 guest speaking function a year than the AFL have no right to say whether it is acceptable or not.

I guess some people fear change and we are entering unknown waters with the possible ramifications not fully known, I would imagine player managers would be rubbing their hands together at the moment. Essentially the free agency means any player that has been with a club 8 seasons and coming out of contract is set for a pay rise if they're any good. The player could very well have no intention of leaving the club but could use other offers to force clubs hands in offering larger contracts. Even if the player doesn't leave the club this could still create disharmony within the group and as has been mentioned in the media we will see 6-7 star players making up 50% of the salary cap while the fringe players live off the rest.

That's my rant over, I feel a little better now.

[Sockeye Salmon]

AND - as far as the 'outside salary cap' payments go - the AFL is really going to need to stop turning a blind eye to this and limit the amounts and ways in which monetary and other remuneration can be paid to players outside of the salary cap. There is no doubt they are at least aware of this issue - but seemingly choose to turn a blind eye to it. It will need to be addressed, and urgently, otherwise the competition will suffer, and supporters will leave the game.


What can the AFL do about it?

We know how pissed Adelaide supporters were with missing Bryce Gibbs as a Father/son selection. What if SAFM (do they still exist?) decide it would be a really good marketing ploy to offer Bryce Gibbs a job offering football comment for $2M, but only if he plays for the Crows.

What if we have a whip around on WOOF and raise enough to offer Kurt Tippett $1M to come to the Dogs? What could the AFL do?

[Doc26]

What can the AFL do about it?

What if we have a whip around on WOOF and raise enough to offer Kurt Tippett $1M to come to the Dogs? What could the AFL do?

And to get around any scrutiny simply bequest it to his parents who then pass it onto their son at a later unscrutinised point in time. 3rd party payments simply cannot be adequately scrutinised where there is a will. Tell 'em their dreamin.

[The Coon Dog]

And to get around any scrutiny simply bequest it to his parents who then pass it onto their son at a later unscrutinised point in time. 3rd party payments simply cannot be adequately scrutinised where there is a will. Tell 'em their dreamin.


AFL stars' secret perks as extra payments revealed

Michael Warner - Herald Sun - 25 February


THE AFL last night conceded 114 players were paid more than $2 million outside the league salary cap by club associates last season - and insisted it was all legal.

Chris Judd and Gary Ablett were already known to be pocketing substantial third-party sums, but after inquiries from the Herald Sun, the AFL admitted another 112 had been beneficiaries of extra payments involving club officials and sponsors.

The secret deals - classified as "employment and independent agreements" - ranged from less than $10,000 to more than $200,000, and fell outside AFL-approved marketing allowances, known as Additional Services Agreements.

Article in full... (http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/afl-stars-secret-perks-as-extra-payments-revealed/story-e6frf9ix-1225834081183)

[Go_Dogs]

So, the AFL admit that players get extra payments. All 114 of them mind you. They investigate the payments, but they don't do anything other than condone it. Only some clubs are involved?? :rolleyes: Let me guess.......

More than $2 million outside league salary? Isn't Judd on $1M? It would be more like, over $10M I'd say. The AFL's standpoint on this issue alone, is enough to see the competition fail once FA comes in.

We need to lure Bill Gates and a Saudi Prince in as supporters, and a creative accountant, so we can cheat too. Cheating is obviously the only way to be on level playing terms, let alone get ahead.

[Doc26]

So, the AFL admit that players get extra payments. All 114 of them mind you. They investigate the payments, but they don't do anything other than condone it. Only some clubs are involved?? :rolleyes: Let me guess.......

More than $2 million outside league salary? Isn't Judd on $1M? It would be more like, over $10M I'd say. The AFL's standpoint on this issue alone, is enough to see the competition fail once FA comes in.

We need to lure Bill Gates and a Saudi Prince in as supporters, and a creative accountant, so we can cheat too. Cheating is obviously the only way to be on level playing terms, let alone get ahead.


It is possible we may already be one of them to have achieved what we did with our salary cap issues of last year although nowhere near the $1m dollar arrangements. Hopefully Mission have deep pockets. Keep eating those Burritos.

[aker39]

I think I have worked it out.

Brown paper bag payments are illegal, but be open about these payments and we'll give them the tick of approval.

[Go_Dogs]

I think I have worked it out.

Brown paper bag payments are illegal, but be open about these payments and well give them the tick of approval.

Now we just need to find someone with deep pockets and a spot on their payroll.

[LostDoggy]

I think I have worked it out.

Brown paper bag payments are illegal, but be open about these payments and we'll give them the tick of approval.

KB, the AFL's donkey mouthpiece, said as much on SEN this morning.

Some absolute rubbish logic spouting from his mouth -- 'players are entitled to a second job, it's nearly impossible to value how much a "publicity" position is worth' blah blah blah. It's essentially a free pass to anything bloody goes.

What a pisswit -- apart from the fact that 'publicity' positions are valued ALL THE TIME (just pick up any Fortune 500 richest people list from the last 20 years, or look up the basic 'net worth' accounting of famous people) and there are companies that exist PURELY to value goodwill (ie. brand/image equity), we can STILL safely block any potential conflict of interest or rorting of the system by simply banning ANY third-party deals, be it publicity for VISY or otherwise (**** off Dick Pratt, dead or not) that can be shown to have originated directly or indirectly from the club. Penalties can also be applied retrospectively, so if any evidence of wrongdoing surface five, ten, fifteen years after the fact, the club can still face heavy sanctions and fines.

This is not that hard to police -- the ACCC do it all the time, and boards of all companies have to comply with this as well as part of BASIC corporate governance. KB's just talking out of his arse (as usual) and I still have no idea why the AFL basically gets a forum every morning to give us their propaganda shit.

**** OFF KB, YOU'RE AN IGNORANT ASS.

[LostDoggy]

Now we just need to find someone with deep pockets and a spot on their payroll.

I don't see how we can't just work this out with our sponsors -- the sponsorship money goes to paying staff anyway, we can just reduce Mission's official 'sponsorship' allocation, cut up the salary cap however you like and then make half the team employees of Mission to cover the rest.

It's so simple, and surely you can't begrudge Will Minson having a very well-paid second job as a Mission spokesperson or Callan Ward working part-time as an expert quality controller with Mission's product testing division -- it's their right to work as much as they like (hey, they even had to interview for the job and everything and they just happened to be the best qualified applicants), and it's impossible to value what a 'spokesperson' or 'quality controller' is worth anyway.

-- If it's about being the best cheats, then I say we cheat our flarking heads off and take the AFL to court if we get pinged for it and no one else does. Honour means nothing when we're all whores anyway.

[Go_Dogs]

I don't see how we can't just work this out with our sponsors -- the sponsorship money goes to paying staff anyway, we can just reduce Mission's official 'sponsorship' allocation, cut up the salary cap however you like and then make half the team employees of Mission to cover the rest.

Problem being for a club like us, how do we then pay our staff?

To enable us to cheat effectively we will need another major sponsor. If we can get 2 more major sponsors, then bring on FA - we could win premierships for the next 20 years straight! And it would all be above board and legit.

[Sockeye Salmon]

I don't see how we can't just work this out with our sponsors -- the sponsorship money goes to paying staff anyway, we can just reduce Mission's official 'sponsorship' allocation, cut up the salary cap however you like and then make half the team employees of Mission to cover the rest.

It's so simple, and surely you can't begrudge Will Minson having a very well-paid second job as a Mission spokesperson or Callan Ward working part-time as an expert quality controller with Mission's product testing division -- it's their right to work as much as they like (hey, they even had to interview for the job and everything and they just happened to be the best qualified applicants), and it's impossible to value what a 'spokesperson' or 'quality controller' is worth anyway.

-- If it's about being the best cheats, then I say we cheat our flarking heads off and take the AFL to court if we get pinged for it and no one else does. Honour means nothing when we're all whores anyway.

The problem is everyone else have more money than us so therefore they can cheat more effectively.

[LostDoggy]

It doesn't take an accounting genius to figure what you do is push all your current players to non salary cap payments ala Judd then you could quiet easily out bid for a star from another club.
It's a can of worms.
Haven't heard a valid reason yet why free agency is needed.

[Doc26]

Whether or not 3rd party payments are made transparent those with the greatest access to such corporate or high net wealth philanthropy will be the winners. I agree with Jeff on this that the divide between the haves and have nots will get greater with the implementation of free agency as it currently stands.

I'd prefer that the security of the competition and the teams that make it up be of utmost importance rather than promoting a system that places a gun to the head of the less fortunate clubs through players and their managers seeking personal fortune.
I'm not a player advocate but one for the competition and of securing the viability of our mighty Bulldogs. The players should reap rewards for their input, and they do, but never to the extent of putting at risk the viability of a strong and healthy competition that protects its clubs.

[chef]

It's not free agency thats the problem, it's the salary cap and all the loopholes that are attached.

[Go_Dogs]

The players should reap rewards for their input, and they do, but never to the extent of putting at risk the viability of a strong and healthy competition that protects its clubs.

This is the other fallout from FA imo - yes, the better players will be more handsomely rewarded, but I fear the mid-tier players will suffer as a result.

[Flamethrower]

All I know about Free Agency is that whoever wins, the fans lose.

In the end the players are going to get massive pay increases, with the top players earning multi-million dollar per season contracts (maybe not in the first few years, but give it time and it will happen).

And who pays for those massive pay increases.....the fans.

It is all done by emotional blackmail. The clubs insist that to be competitive they need to offer free agents and their own players huge contracts, and to pay for those contracts, ticket prices must be raised. Give it time but eventually that $20 general admission ticket will become $100, and those premium level seats will rise from $50 to $500 per game.

Want proof - the first time I went to see a Yankee game I got infield box seats for $27, and my first Angels game cost me $14 for a premium seat. That was just as free agency and player payments were starting to explode. These days top players are on $30M a season contracts, and those $14 Angels seats are now $150 a game and the $27 Yankee seats are now $2500!!! (since reduced to $1250 because few would pay that much). The Yankees play 81 home games a year! Imagine how much they would charge if they only played 11 home games.

And unless those same fans follow one of the powerhouse clubs, they can just about kiss goodbye ever seeing their team win a championship.

The salary cap will help a little, but don't forget the NBA and NFL have a salary cap, and MLB has a luxury tax, and it has done nothing to stop the outrageous salaries and ticket prices.

[hujsh]

All I know about Free Agency is that whoever wins, the fans lose.

In the end the players are going to get massive pay increases, with the top players earning multi-million dollar per season contracts (maybe not in the first few years, but give it time and it will happen).

And who pays for those massive pay increases.....the fans.

It is all done by emotional blackmail. The clubs insist that to be competitive they need to offer free agents and their own players huge contracts, and to pay for those contracts, ticket prices must be raised. Give it time but eventually that $20 general admission ticket will become $100, and those premium level seats will rise from $50 to $500 per game.

Want proof - the first time I went to see a Yankee game I got infield box seats for $27, and my first Angels game cost me $14 for a premium seat. That was just as free agency and player payments were starting to explode. These days top players are on $30M a season contracts, and those $14 Angels seats are now $150 a game and the $27 Yankee seats are now $2500!!! (since reduced to $1250 because few would pay that much). The Yankees play 81 home games a year! Imagine how much they would charge if they only played 11 home games.

And unless those same fans follow one of the powerhouse clubs, they can just about kiss goodbye ever seeing their team win a championship.

The salary cap will help a little, but don't forget the NBA and NFL have a salary cap, and MLB has a luxury tax, and it has done nothing to stop the outrageous salaries and ticket prices.

Raising ticket prices does nothing for us.

[Rocco Jones]

Say it turns really ugly and the rich sides get easy access to the stars. Just a hypothetical.

As I have mentioned earlier in the thread, Aussie Rules is a very difficult game to remain competitive in when talent is disproportionate (unlike soccer, a game with the biggest gap between the rich and the poor).

Say Adelaide, West Coast and Collingwood are the super rich sides who benefit most with Carlton and Essendon not too far away. The NSW and Qld clubs will be spoon feed by the AFL if things go awry. Hawks, Geelong and perhaps Richmond can remain competitive.

It is not a stretch to see us, Melbourne, North, Melbourne and St.Kilda get massive weekly beatings. Tigers and Hawks won't be far off. Hawks have a massive membership base but I am not sure it has the extra revenue sources the others do.

How long will these fans cop 20 goal beatings? Will the AFL be happy/want 4-6 clubs to fold or merge? I think it's a good way to open up a few spots so we go back to the user friendly 16 or open a spot or two for more interstate sides, such as another one in Perth if population growth continues, they continue to flourish after boom etc.

What will happen to Port? Surely AFL can't have a franchise fold?

[Doc26]

Say it turns really ugly and the rich sides get easy access to the stars. Just a hypothetical.



Unfortunately Rocco I don't see this scenario as being too hypothetical.

I have my submission for our 2011 slogan, 'Leashed'.

[The Coon Dog]

Rogue traders behind secret deals

Mark Stevens - Herald Sun - 1 March

CLUBS chasing third-party deals to retain their stars risk destroying the integrity of competition, Bulldogs chief Campbell Rose warned.

Rose said it would be "mischievous" if rivals were approaching backers to arrange payments outside the salary cap for their players.

"The integrity of this competition relies on the integrity of the whole salary cap and the Collective Bargaining Agreement," Rose said.

Article in full... (http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/rogue-traders-make-secret-deals/story-e6frf9jf-1225835348995)

[Mantis]

^^^

Fair enough too.

Why even have a salary cap if clubs are finding ways to get around it.

[The Coon Dog]

McGuire not convinced by AFL free agency

Collingwood president Eddie McGuire fears the introduction of free agency could backfire on players and end up driving an AFL club to extinction.

McGuire said the new player movement system, to start in 2012, could create unsustainable inflation and was a step down a dangerous path towards viewing football as a business rather than a passion.

"My biggest fear is that it will drive a team down to Tasmania or out of the competition completely," McGuire told a Melbourne Football Club fundraiser on Wednesday.

"I think it's going to have a massive inflationary effect.

Article in full... (http://news.theage.com.au/breaking-news-sport/mcguire-not-convinced-by-afl-free-agency-20100324-qwio.html)

[Throughandthrough]

they are also basically saying that any player, ever drafted from SA would love to come back, (Gibbs, Pavilich, Didal, etc etc etc ) but any player, drafted to SA from interstate would love the culture and the facilities here and would not want to go back...


sells newspapers I guess.


Even a Crows fanatic colleague was laughing at the one sided nature of the reporting.



And LOL at Rucci's article in the paper last week

"it will cost a fortune for the Crows/Power to attract every player they want..."

welcome to salary cap, goose....

[chef]

I see the players are pushing to have free agency come into play after 6 seasons and being allowed to sign with another club before the season finishes.

[bornadog]

I see the players are pushing to have free agency come into play after 6 seasons and being allowed to sign with another club before the season finishes.

Yet the coaches want to drop it.

[westdog54]

I see the players are pushing to have free agency come into play after 6 seasons and being allowed to sign with another club before the season finishes.


Yet the coaches want to drop it.
Both of which probably tell us that what we have is a good balance.

[Hotdog60]

I don't like free agency and although it's perfect for the player it sucks big time for the supporter and the club.

6 years is not good, a quality player is just about to hit his straps and a club with a lot of money will rape and pillage.

Shortening the time spent by players at one club will destroy the last traces of club loyalty once and for all and the bonding and mateship that is gain over the course of time will be eroded to business as usual and company A can pay more than company B so see ya later.

[KT31]

I see the players are pushing to have free agency come into play after 6 seasons and being allowed to sign with another club before the season finishes.

The shortening of free agency would be a huge blow and a big step backwards in the equalisation debate to smaller clubs like ours.
Surely the AFL and players themselves can see what the clubs put into young players, from starting out and eventually playing seniors.
Shortening the time line will mean a club will put all the hard yards in only for the player to be stolen and possibly become a champion elsewhere.
One of the remaining things I love about our game is the loyalty, no others games do and hopefully AFL listens to the coaches and not the players.

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/chris-scott-says-distasteful-free-agency-should-be-scrapped-20140729-zy042.html

[bornadog]

The shortening of free agency would be a huge blow and a big step backwards in the equalisation debate to smaller clubs like ours.
Surely the AFL and players themselves can see what the clubs put into young players, from starting out and eventually playing seniors.
Shortening the time line will mean a club will put all the hard yards in only for the player to be stolen and possibly become a champion elsewhere.
One of the remaining things I love about our game is the loyalty, no others games do and hopefully AFL listens to the coaches and not the players.

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/chris-scott-says-distasteful-free-agency-should-be-scrapped-20140729-zy042.html

Also: http://news.theage.com.au/breaking-news-sport/reform-free-agency-to-aid-all-hardwick-20140731-3cw92.html

[westdog54]

As a person who is an advocate of free agency I would wholeheartedly support the measures that Hardwick has suggested.

[Mofra]

As a person who is an advocate of free agency I would wholeheartedly support the measures that Hardwick has suggested.
Just read that, it makes a lot of sense.

[bornadog]

LIST OF CURRENT RESTRICTED & UNRESTRICTED FREE AGENTS
ADELAIDE
Jason Porplyzia - likely to retire or be offered a one year deal. Could fetch offers from rivals.

CARLTON -
Jarrad Waite – Has been linked to North Melbourne more recently. 50/50 call on whether he’ll stay or go.

ESSENDON –
Dustin Fletcher - likely to retire or be offered a another one-year deal.
Heath Hocking (Restriced) – Likely to sign-on.
Leroy Jetta – Unlikely to be offered a new contract, will likely shop himself around.

FREMANTLE -
Luke McPharlin - likely to retire or be offered a another one-year deal.

GEELONG -
Corey Enright - likely to retire or be offered a another one-year deal
James Kelly - likely to retire or be offered a another one-year deal. Clubs are likely to pursue.

HAWTHORN -
Brad Sewell - likely to retire or be offered a another one-year deal

MELBOURNE -
James Frawley – Has put off contract negotiations until the end of the year. Has been linked heavily with Collingwood, still remains closely linked to Hawthorn, Geelong whilst Gold Coast are heavily pursing the unrestricted free agent.

NORTH MELBOURNE -
Michael Firrito – Likely to accept a new contract

PORT ADELAIDE –
Tom Logan – Likely to accept a new contract
Paul Stewart - Likely to accept a new contract

ST KILDA -
Clint Jones – Will either accept a new contract or fetch offers from rival clubs
Sam Fisher - Will either accept a new contract or fetch offers from rival clubs
James Gwiltt - Likely to accept a new contract

SYDNEY -
Nick Malceski – Has put off Has put off contract negotiations until the end of the year. Has been linked heavily with Melbourne to tee-up with former coach Paul Roos, has also been linked with a move to Perth team, West Coast where his wife is originally from.
Ryan O’Keefe – Will likely fetch offers from rival clubs. Unlikely to be offered a new contract. Richmond coach Damien Hardwick is on the record saying that he would “love him” at the Richmond Football Club.
Adam Goodes - likely to retire or be offered a another one-year deal

WEST COAST –
Sam Butler - Likely to accept a new contract

WESTERN BULLDOGS –
Shaun Higgins - Has put off Has put off contract negotiations until the end of the year. Has been linked heavily to Carlton, however Melbourne and Geelong have also emerged as potential suitors.
Matthew Boyd - offered another one-year deal
Daniel Giansiracusa - retiring

[Hotdog60]

Is this a bit out of date?
Daniel Giansiracusa did a deal last year that this is his final year.

[Bulldog Joe]

Surprised to see Gold Coast apparently pursuing Frawley.
If that is true it will surely shake one of their KP players loose.

Should we be talking to Rory Thompson or Steven May?

[bornadog]

Is this a bit out of date?
Daniel Giansiracusa did a deal last year that this is his final year.
It was supposedly updated today. I will amend the doggies ones.

[Hotdog60]

It was supposedly updated today. I will amend the doggies ones.

Well Done.

Somewhere in the back of my head I think Higgo is gone. I don't know why, just a feeling. The only thing is why on earth would you go to Carlton. Take Geelong... if your going.

[bornadog]

Well Done.

Somewhere in the back of my head I think Higgo is gone. I don't know why, just a feeling. The only thing is why on earth would you go to Carlton. Take Geelong... if your going.

My gut says he will stay.

[Remi Moses]

Think Higgins is gone.

[Twodogs]

I keep thinking he'll stay and then thinking he will go. I just don't know but if I was pushed I'd say he's going. The whole thing has a bit of a Nathan Brown or Cal Ward sort of feel to it. Like he's just waiting until the end of the season. Which to be fair was what he said he was going to do on the first place.

[jeemak]

The jungle drums are beating a bit too hard for me with respect to Higgins.

Sure, he's an easy target due to his age and his contract status though each time this has happened since Lake signed his last deal with us it's mainly gone against us.

[bornadog]

The jungle drums are beating a bit too hard for me with respect to Higgins.

Sure, he's an easy target due to his age and his contract status though each time this has happened since Lake signed his last deal with us it's mainly gone against us.

I wonder who his manager is? They seem to influence the discussions quiet a bit. Obviously he is hanging out for a bigger contract and the manager has advised him this is the best way to do so.

[ratsmac]

I believe Higgins will stay. The club has stuck by him through a career that has been unfortunately riddled with injuries, and he is well aware of that. He is doing what most of us would do and that is to try get a pay rise and job security. However if he does move on it would be a mutual decision between club and player IMO.

[bornadog]

Unrestricted Free Agents:

Jason Porplyzia - Adelaide
Jarrad Waite - Carlton
Leroy Jetta - Essendon
Dustin Fletcher - Essendon
Luke McPharlin - Fremantle
Brad Sewell - Hawthorn
James Frawley - Melbourne
Michael Firrito - N/Melbourne
Tom Logan - P/Adelaide
James Gwilt - St.Kilda
Clint Jones - St.Kilda
Adam Goodes - Sydney
Nick Malceski - Sydney

Restricted Free Agent:

Shaun Higgins - W/Bulldogs

[LostDoggy]

Pretty sorry list that one. At least a third of the UFA's should/will retire this season anyway.

[Twodogs]

Pretty sorry list that one. At least a third of the UFA's should/will retire this season anyway.


Very ordinary. I'll bet half of them will be linked to North.

[Mofra]

Weren't we linked to Gwilt at one point?
Has been delisted so would cost nothing.

[soupman]

Weren't we linked to Gwilt at one point?
Has been delisted so would cost nothing.

Except a senior list spot, which is too much imo.

[bornadog]

Waite officially at North. Waiting to see what happens with Higgo.

[bornadog]

North have lodged the papers for Higgins. We have 72 hours to match the offer (if we want)

[Ghost Dog]

Unrestricted Free Agents:

Jason Porplyzia - Adelaide
Jarrad Waite - Carlton
Leroy Jetta - Essendon
Dustin Fletcher - Essendon
Luke McPharlin - Fremantle
Brad Sewell - Hawthorn
James Frawley - Melbourne
Michael Firrito - N/Melbourne
Tom Logan - P/Adelaide
James Gwilt - St.Kilda
Clint Jones - St.Kilda
Adam Goodes - Sydney
Nick Malceski - Sydney

Restricted Free Agent:

Shaun Higgins - W/Bulldogs

Has Firrito ever played up forward? See Bulldogs? Such hair brained thinking is how DESPERATE I have become.

[Doc26]

North have lodged the papers for Higgins. We have 72 hours to match the offer (if we want)

I understand the league provides us with an indication on F/A compensation. I assume this happens within the 72 hours to form part of our consideration. Given this, and beyond pure peculation, has anyone heard any official word as yet as to what the league has advised us on compensation ?

[Greystache]

I'd be surprised if no one gave Clint Jones a go. A team nearing their window who needs another mature body who can lock down could do worse for 2 years. Geelong might be a good fit, or even Hawthorn.

[G-Mo77]

I'd be surprised if no one gave Clint Jones a go. A team nearing their window who needs another mature body who can lock down could do worse for 2 years. Geelong might be a good fit, or even Hawthorn.

I was surprised he was still on an AFL list last year.

[LostDoggy]

I'd be surprised if no one gave Clint Jones a go. A team nearing their window who needs another mature body who can lock down could do worse for 2 years. Geelong might be a good fit, or even Hawthorn.

Think the game's gone past him. Lacks speed now and his disposal efficiency is down. Probably would be a one year stop gap for a Melbourne, or GWS at best.

[Remi Moses]

Stkilda fans I work with bag him constantly, but he's got a lot out of an ordinary skill set.

[Axe Man]

Has Firrito ever played up forward? See Bulldogs? Such hair brained thinking is how DESPERATE I have become.

I know (well hope) you're joking, but Firrito re-signed with North during the week anyway.

[divvydan]

We've decided not to match Nth's offer to Higgins.

We have received Band 3 compensation*, Rd 2 pick to be taken after our pick for finishing position, currently pick 26.
Carlton did not receive any compensation for Waite.

* Subject to change if we pick up a free agent ourselves.

Additionally, we are able to trade the pick during the trade period but once the pick is traded we are no longer able to claim any free agent.

[1eyedog]

Thanks DD no surprises there. Given his injury history that sounds about right and is what was expected. I think it will come in very hand for us. It's an enticing number.

[chef]

Great stuff. What we deserve for him.

[Twodogs]

Yep a good result for us. Hopefully it means we can take Zaine and maybe a taller defender?

[Drunken Bum]

Even though i didn't think band 2 compo was out of the question i'm kind of happy that it is band 3, especially as in real terms band 2 and 3 are not far removed. if we got band 2 it would have been all the easier for the AFL to hand out band 1 compo to Melb for Frawley. I'm quietly optimistic(not confident) they will only get band 2 compo

[Twodogs]

That was quick


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=6sMdLwHeef8

[bornadog]

That was quick


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=6sMdLwHeef8

He is a classy player and I am sorry to see him go.

[Remi Moses]

Definitely a good result.
Under performer for me, and he got a decent contract there

[mighty_west]

You only have to watch his highlights package to know how talented he is, pity his body continually failed him as he could have been a star for us, that said had he not been a free agent I would have wanted us to put him up for trade anyway to try and get something in return and give him a fresh start elsewhere, as a supporter I no longer trust his body likewise with Tommy Williams.

The 2nd round pick is a terrific result for us and hopefully us used to try and snag someone like Sam Reid.

[Twodogs]

I reckon North will play him forward and he will kick lots of goals for them if his body holds out.

[1eyedog]

I reckon North will play him forward and he will kick lots of goals for them if his body holds out.

I agree. If his body holds out they'll reap the benefits. What has he done - elbow, collarbone, foot? The foot is the problem.

[Twodogs]

I agree. If his body holds out they'll reap the benefits. What has he done - elbow, collarbone, foot? The foot is the problem.

Sounds about right. The body takes an extra battering up forward too. Waiting under all those helicopter kicks will take it's toll.

[Axe Man]

Bugger:

MELBOURNE has been given the third pick in the 2014 NAB AFL Draft as compensation for losing defender James Frawley to Melbourne.

The compensation is tied to the size of the the contract Hawthorn has offered the 26-year-old as well as his age.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Ridiculous.

[LostDoggy]

Melbourne's timing of asking for the priority pick was perfect. This was always going to happen. AFL say no to the priority pick but give them pick 3 as a sweetener.

If Higgins is on 4 years at 400k and gets band 3, then Frawley must be on 5 years at 600k.

Have we been told of the deal yet?

[chef]

Well done to Melbourne. Squeaky wheel gets the grease.

[Remi Moses]

What a joke, but then again it's the AFL and it's stupid policies.
Just have a committee on what a players worth .
Frawley middle first round, Higgins end of second round.
Common sense not to common with AFL thinking .

[ratsmac]

I am totally pissed at Melbourne getting pick 3. They get hand out after hand out and still can't build a decent football team. Free agency is of the devil!!

[KT31]

I am totally pissed at Melbourne getting pick 3. They get hand out after hand out and still can't build a decent football team. Free agency is of the devil!!
or Demons in this case.

[Eze Dog]

I am totally pissed at Melbourne getting pick 3. They get hand out after hand out and still can't build a decent football team. Free agency is of the devil!!

I'm not so sure this is a bad thing as Melbourne may be a bit easier to deal with than say the GWS in terms of if we try to offer our pick 6 + either 1 second round draft pick / a player / multiple draft picks (if its worth it) to get their Pick 2/3.

Though in general I definitely think that the Free Agency rulings need to be changed. I mean when you have a system that gives Pick 18 I think it was for Buddy but Pick 3 for Frawley it's obviously flawed.

[Remi Moses]

I'm not so sure this is a bad thing as Melbourne may be a bit easier to deal with than say the GWS in terms of if we try to offer our pick 6 + either 1 second round draft pick / a player / multiple draft picks (if its worth it) to get their Pick 2/3.

Though in general I definitely think that the Free Agency rulings need to be changed. I mean when you have a system that gives Pick 18 I think it was for Buddy but Pick 3 for Frawley it's obviously flawed.

It flies in the face of the Scully Ward Compo,as that was ruled on their draft positions taken.
The whole issue is just one of whinge up a storm and then get over compensated .

[boydogs]

Frawley middle first round, Higgins end of second round.

It was as close to middle first round as they get, after Melbourne's first pick.

Higgins was after our second round, not end of second round

[mighty_west]

A better chance for us to grab Wright or McCartin with Dees being handed this pick, besides I'm not sure why people are jumping up and down at Dees or the AFL, it was the Hawks who are paying way overs in their cap for a second rate defender that gifted the Dees this selection.

[Topdog]

A better chance for us to grab Wright or McCartin with Dees being handed this pick, besides I'm not sure why people are jumping up and down at Dees or the AFL, it was the Hawks who are paying way overs in their cap for a second rate defender that gifted the Dees this selection.

Thats actually 100% impossible.

[w3design]

A better chance for us to grab Wright or McCartin with Dees being handed this pick, besides I'm not sure why people are jumping up and down at Dees or the AFL, it was the Hawks who are paying way overs in their cap for a second rate defender that gifted the Dees this selection.
Definitely will be more willing to trade one of their picks for a mix of pick 6 and one of our second round picks, 2 if Carlton work out a third round pick is worth a lot less now that Cordy f/s was pick 61 and we keep our third round pick which is before Carltons

[westdog54]

http://www.afl.com.au/trade/free-agency

With Cooney and Griffen both departing the club, we will have a total of zero free agents to try and sign up at the end of this year.

[Sedat]

http://www.afl.com.au/trade/free-agency

With Cooney and Griffen both departing the club, we will have a total of zero free agents to try and sign up at the end of this year.
The names that spring to mind for me are Alex Rance (highly unlikely to remain unsigned) and Colin Garland. Garland looks a very good fit for us if he remains a free agent - I hope we are already making enquiries to his management.

[1eyedog]

Man Kruezer already a free agent next year and hardly on the park. How time flies.

[Twodogs]

The names that spring to mind for me are Alex Rance (highly unlikely to remain unsigned) and Colin Garland. Garland looks a very good fit for us if he remains a free agent - I hope we are already making enquiries to his management.


Another F/S via another club if he were to come.

[LostDoggy]

Speaking of time flying, what about Jack Steven. Seems like he's only been around for 3 seasons. Drafted back in 2007 FGS!

[bornadog]

Push to block top six from signing free agents (http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/push-to-block-top-six-from-signing-free-agents-20150222-13lk45.html)
story here (http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/push-to-block-top-six-from-signing-free-agents-20150222-13lk45.html)

[Testekill]

Push to block top six from signing free agents (http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/push-to-block-top-six-from-signing-free-agents-20150222-13lk45.html)


story here (http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/push-to-block-top-six-from-signing-free-agents-20150222-13lk45.html)

I'd be fine with this. At the moment it really is "rich get richer" so this could perhaps even the playing field.

[Ozza]

Its not really free agency if you are going to prevent clubs from trying to find the 'missing ingredients' they feel they need to win a premiership, or preventing unrestricted free agents from going where they want to get to.

In my view, you either have free agency without these restrictions - or you scrap it entirely.

In our current position, it works for us to have the top 6 teams restricted. But if it were 2008-2010 and we were prevented from getting Hall or Akermanis (just examples - realise these were different scenarios) - we would be ropable that we were prevented from getting a key forward, or match winner that wanted to be at our club.

[Mofra]

In our current position, it works for us to have the top 6 teams restricted. But if it were 2008-2010 and we were prevented from getting Hall or Akermanis (just examples - realise these were different scenarios) - we would be ropable that we were prevented from getting a key forward, or match winner that wanted to be at our club.
It only blocks teams from using FA to gain a player - they're still free to trade for them (as we did with Aker & Hall)

There are concerns with how slow the rest of the competition are catching up with the top tier teams, especially in the wake of GWS/GCS concessions.

[westdog54]

It only blocks teams from using FA to gain a player - they're still free to trade for them (as we did with Aker & Hall)

There are concerns with how slow the rest of the competition are catching up with the top tier teams, especially in the wake of GWS/GCS concessions.

Exactly.

Under this rule, Sydney would have had to enter into a trade to acquire Lance Franklin, as an example, and Hawthorn would have been compensated far more adequately than what they were.

[LostDoggy]

I love this new suggestion. Also no risk of teams tanking to gain a better concession as it have significant implications on their finals campaigns.

It is not right that Hawthorn won the flag last year and then was able to pick up the most sought after FA basically free of charge in Frawley. They would have been able to trade probably pick 18 to Melbourne an the deal would have been seen in much better light then what transpired. i.e. Hawthorn pays fair value, Melbourne was not ridiculously over-compensated for Frawley.

As it turned out only those two clubs won and the rest of the comp suffered.

[LostDoggy]

Its not really free agency if you are going to prevent clubs from trying to find the 'missing ingredients' they feel they need to win a premiership, or preventing unrestricted free agents from going where they want to get to.

In my view, you either have free agency without these restrictions - or you scrap it entirely.

In our current position, it works for us to have the top 6 teams restricted. But if it were 2008-2010 and we were prevented from getting Hall or Akermanis (just examples - realise these were different scenarios) - we would be ropable that we were prevented from getting a key forward, or match winner that wanted to be at our club.
Agree. The reasons for this were all out forward when free agency was originally discussed, yet it went ahead anyway. This reeks of knee jerk reactions to an ill-drafted policy.

[bornadog]

Players are seeking a reduction in years to qualify, ie from 8 to 6

[chef]

Players are seeking a reduction in years to qualify, ie from 8 to 6

Was always going to happen.

[bornadog]

Now this: AFL flags prospect of a less-restrictive free agency system (http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-flags-prospect-of-a-lessrestrictive-free-agency-system-20150520-gh5t69.html)

[bulldogtragic]

Now this: AFL flags prospect of a less-restrictive free agency system (http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-flags-prospect-of-a-lessrestrictive-free-agency-system-20150520-gh5t69.html)

Seriously? If a player Hasnt been given big cash and the coach sends him back to the reserves to develop playing as he wants, the player can walk for nothing to the club of their choice... So bookmark this post when it all blows up, again...

[Greystache]

Seriously? If a player Hasnt been given big cash and the coach sends him back to the reserves to develop playing as he wants, the player can walk for nothing to the club of their choice... So bookmark this post when it all blows up, again...

Sounds like the Liam Jones rule. Free agency sounds a lot more appealing than hard work to earn your place at your current club.

[azabob]

Sounds like the Liam Jones rule. Free agency sounds a lot more appealing than hard work to earn your place at your current club.

Well he is in the picture they used.

[bulldogtragic]

Sounds like the Liam Jones rule. Free agency sounds a lot more appealing than hard work to earn your place at your current club.

Yep. Why should we have been penalised under this proposed change if it was there last year? Surely delisting free agency is fair to players who aren't wanted for trade. If pea hearts want to take the wooing of other clubs then they can pay, including us in opposite circumstances. This is not responsible guardianship of the game, and I'm getting tired of the constant attempts to change a game that survived for 150 years before these brilliant leaders took over.

[bulldogtragic]

Well he is in the picture they used.

And now he's 'erratic'. Pre season he was the medias love child...

[Twodogs]

I wonder if Mick has said anything nasty to him.

[soupman]

Also not sure why they brought up the example of Carlton downgrading draft picks to get Jaksch and Whiley. Whiley may have been eligible if they count his time as pre-listed but this year is Jakschs 4th so he wouldn't have been a free agent.

[bornadog]

I'm getting tired of the constant attempts to change a game that survived for 150 years before these brilliant leaders took over.

i have been saying that for a long time now. In the last ten years we have seen the most changes and its getting worse.

[Remi Moses]

Ditto for me .
Honestly there must be many hired suits in Afl circles with bugger all to do.
Can we just leave some things alone,FFS!!

[Hotdog60]

Come on guys,

There just trying to make it easier for the Eddie McGuire's of this world to be able to poach.

There are struggling rich clubs out there that haven't won a Grand Final in 15 years.

They couldn't keep there members if they got out to 51 years.

[Twodogs]

Come on guys,

There just trying to make it easier for the Eddie McGuire's of this world to be able to poach.

There are struggling rich clubs out there that haven't won a Grand Final in 15 years.

They couldn't keep there members if they got out to 51 years.


And Northern state clubs with COLA to fill.

[bornadog]

Player
Team
Status


Patrick Dangerfield
ADEL
Restricted


Richard Douglas
ADEL
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-06-16/crows-resign-another-as-richard-douglas-puts-pen-to-paper)


Brodie Martin
ADEL
Unrestricted


Andy Otten
ADEL
Unrestricted


Brent Reilly
ADEL
Retired (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-05-13/crow-reilly-calls-time-after-horror-head-clash)


Scott Thompson
ADEL
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-09-02/crows-veteran-thompson-signs-on-for-another-season)


Taylor Walker
ADEL
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2014-11-18/tex-not-walking)


Jed Adcock
BL
Unrestricted (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-08-20/lions-part-ways-with-former-skipper-jed-adcock)


Matthew Leuenberger
BL
Restricted


Dennis Armfield
CARL
Unrestricted


Andrew Carrazzo
CARL
Retired (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-09-01/blues-veteran-carrazzo-calls-it-quits)


David Ellard
CARL
Retired (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-09-04/blue-walks-away-from-the-afl-at-just-26)


Chris Judd
CARL
Retired (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-06-09/judd-to-make-his-call)


Matthew Kreuzer
CARL
Restricted


Brent Macaffer
COLL
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-07-02/magpies-lock-away-free-agent-macaffer)


Tom Bellchambers
ESS
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-08-29/bombers-lock-in-big-bellchambers-for-two-more-seasons)


Courtenay Dempsey
ESS
Unrestricted


Dustin Fletcher
ESS
Retired (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-09-04/dustin-fletcher-retires-after-400-games-and-23-years)


Tayte Pears
ESS
Unrestricted


Brent Stanton
ESS
Unrestricted


Jason Winderlich
ESS
Retired (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-09-06/bomber-winderlich-quits-this-time-for-good)


Ryan Crowley
FRE
Unrestricted


Paul Duffield
FRE
Unrestricted


Michael Johnson
FRE
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-04-21/johnson-stays-a-docker)


Luke McPharlin
FRE
Unrestricted


Matthew Pavlich
FRE
Unrestricted


Aaron Sandilands
FRE
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-06-08/sandy-resigns-with-freo)


Jimmy Bartel
GEEL
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-09-18/bartel-on-track-for-300-after-signing-new-deal)


Corey Enright
GEEL
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-09-11/corey-enright-signs-on-set-to-break-cats-games-record)


Tom Hawkins
GEEL
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-07-09/hawkins-a-cat-for-life-after-signing-fiveyear-deal)


Steve Johnson
GEEL
Unrestricted (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-09-04/stevie-j-to-bid-farewell-to-cats-on-saturday)


James Kelly
GEEL
Unrestricted (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-09-02/james-kelly-cats-part-ways)


Andrew Mackie
GEEL
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-09-08/veteran-and-debutant-resign-with-the-cats)


Dawson Simpson
GEEL
Unrestricted


Mathew Stokes
GEEL
Unrestricted (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-09-01/twotime-premiership-player-stokes-calls-time-at-geelong)


Luke Hodge
HAW
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-04-04/hodge-and-shiels-resign)


Sam Mitchell
HAW
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-03-26/star-hawk-to-play-on)


Matthew Suckling
HAW
Unrestricted


Brendan Whitecross
HAW
Unrestricted


Colin Garland
MELB
Restricted


Mark Jamar
MELB
Unrestricted (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-09-11/demons-farewell-jamar-but-will-he-play-on)


Nathan Jones
MELB
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2014-12-18/four-more-for-jones)


Michael Firrito
NM
Unrestricted


Nathan Grima
NM
Retired (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-07-08/back-injury-forces-kangaroos-defender-grima-to-retire)


Brent Harvey
NM
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-08-20/veteran-resigns-boomer-harvey-to-go-around-again)


Scott McMahon
NM
Unrestricted


Drew Petrie
NM
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-08-20/drew-petrie-crashes-boomers-party-to-announce-resigning)


Andrew Swallow
NM
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-02-03/key-roo-inks-new-deal)


Robbie Tarrant
NM
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-08-14/north-defender-robbie-tarrant-rejects-free-agency-to-sign-new-deal)


Kane Cornes
PORT
Retired (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-05-14/kane-cornes-expected-to-retire-after-300th-afl-game)


Robbie Gray
PORT
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2014-12-02/port-star-gray-resigns)


Matthew Lobbe
PORT
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2014-12-07/ruckman-lobs-in)


Tom Logan (rookie)
PORT
Retired (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-09-17/recruit-wagner-one-of-five-delisted-by-power)


Trent Cotchin
RICH
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2014-12-04/cotchins-2020-vision)


Nathan Foley
RICH
Retired (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-08-13/axel-calls-time-knee-injury-forces-nathan-foley-to-retire)


Chris Newman
RICH
Retired (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-08-18/veteran-tiger-defender-to-call-it-quits-at-end-of-2015)


Alex Rance
RICH
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-06-20/relief-for-tigers-as-rance-signs-new-fouryear-deal)


Sean Dempster
STK
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-08-13/veteran-saint-resigns)


Sam Fisher
STK
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-09-09/saint-fisher-signs-new-oneyear-deal)


Sam Gilbert
STK
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-09-03/veteran-saint-sam-gilbert-locked-in-for-two-more-seasons)


Adam Schneider (rookie)
STK
Retired (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-08-25/saint-schneider-calls-time-on-career)


Jack Steven
STK
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-03-26/steven-a-saint-for-life)


Adam Goodes
SYD
Retired (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-09-19/swans-champion-adam-goodes-calls-it-a-day)


Heath Grundy
SYD
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-06-22/free-agent-off-the-market-as-swan-resigns)


Ted Richards
SYD
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-09-16/teddy-playing-on-swans-inks-new-oneyear-deal)


Sam Butler
WCE
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-09-18/2006-premiership-eagle-sam-butler-signs-on-for-another-season)


Patrick McGinnity
WCE
Unrestricted


Scott Selwood
WCE
Restricted


Beau Waters
WCE
Retired (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-02-19/waters-to-call-it-quits)


Matthew Boyd
WB
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-09-09/three-young-bulldogs-the-latest-to-resign)


Jarrad Grant
WB
Unrestricted


Dale Morris
WB
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-09-09/three-young-bulldogs-the-latest-to-resign)


Robert Murphy
WB
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-05-22/bulldogs-and-i-are-still-in-love-murphy-playing-on-next-year)


Easton Wood
WB
Re-signed (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-04-16/bulldog-signs-on-again)

[Ghost Dog]

Ah I love a good table. Nice :)
Pavlich, what's his story?

You would get Jamar pretty cheaply as a bull around packs for a year in our VFL. Number 6 in hit outs for AFL. If we can't get Martin, You have Minson and Jamar backing up our AFL side, Campbell and Roughead as our main Rucks.

Age is reporting Dangerfield to Cats.