Higgins Season Over

[aker39]

Just announced on SEN.

There have been lots of questions asked since Saturday, but what were the MC thinking when they selected Higgins for the game.

[Sedat]

They probably thought that he was over the worst of the thyroiditis and had a solid run at Willy the previous week, so assumed that he would run the game out stronger. Obviously the opposite happened, which made the decision look foolish.

[Desipura]

Just announced on SEN.

There have been lots of questions asked since Saturday, but what were the MC thinking when they selected Higgins for the game.
The MC have alot to answer for.......

Ward is clearly hampered as well, will have an op as soon as the seasons finished

Johnno - playing injured

Hahn - Too slow for the modern game

Eagleton - passed it

Callan - see above. Did a good job, but not a long term player.

Addison - not a regular AFL player.

You cannot expect to have success in September when you are carrying so many players. Unfortunately the stars just did not allign for us.

[Raw Toast]

I'll preface this by saying that while I'm no fan of some of the MC's decisions and we've been struggling with the question of how to get more run into the team, I think lots of excellent posters on this board including the two quoted below should be a bit more balanced in judging the MC at the moment.


Just announced on SEN.

There have been lots of questions asked since Saturday, but what were the MC thinking when they selected Higgins for the game.

That Higgins was over the worst of it, that he'd looked very impressive for Willi the previous week, and that he'd been a key player in big finals before on limited preparation.

Now obviously he had a shocker, but I think the MC rolling the dice on him was a reasonable decision. And he shut down O'Brien pretty well for the first bit of the game and did get us an early goal, though of course in retrospect everyone would have preferred another player was out there.


The MC have alot to answer for.......

Ward is clearly hampered as well, will have an op as soon as the seasons finished

Johnno - playing injured

Hahn - Too slow for the modern game

Eagleton - passed it

Callan - see above. Did a good job, but not a long term player.

Addison - not a regular AFL player.

You cannot expect to have success in September when you are carrying so many players. Unfortunately the stars just did not allign for us.

Ward has been getting better and is a key finals player for us. He also had 14 touches in the first quarter against the Dons and was kicking better. He didn't play well, but I didn't see anyone saying we shouldn't have selected him for the game.

Johnson was a crucial aspect of our best form of the season and we need him to get some miles into his legs if we're going to challenge this year and he did stop Shaw killing us like he so often has.

Hahn probably deserved a chance. Certainly no one had been demanding his place even though I didn't want him in the side.

Callan came in and did a very good job in an important final. Cannot understand the issues with this selection.

Addison came in late for Wood. Maybe Moles would've been better but if it had rained the conditions would've suited Addison and he wasn't one of our worst.

[Desipura]

I'll preface this by saying that while I'm no fan of some of the MC's decisions and we've been struggling with the question of how to get more run into the team, I think lots of excellent posters on this board including the two quoted below should be a bit more balanced in judging the MC at the moment.



That Higgins was over the worst of it, that he'd looked very impressive for Willi the previous week, and that he'd been a key player in big finals before on limited preparation.

Now obviously he had a shocker, but I think the MC rolling the dice on him was a reasonable decision. And he shut down O'Brien pretty well for the first bit of the game and did get us an early goal, though of course in retrospect everyone would have preferred another player was out there.



Ward has been getting better and is a key finals player for us. He also had 14 touches in the first quarter against the Dons and was kicking better. He didn't play well, but I didn't see anyone saying we shouldn't have selected him for the game.

Johnson was a crucial aspect of our best form of the season and we need him to get some miles into his legs if we're going to challenge this year and he did stop Shaw killing us like he so often has.

Hahn probably deserved a chance. Certainly no one had been demanding his place even though I didn't want him in the side.

Callan came in and did a very good job in an important final. Cannot understand the issues with this selection.

Addison came in late for Wood. Maybe Moles would've been better but if it had rained the conditions would've suited Addison and he wasn't one of our worst.
You have more than balanced it the other way, not sure I agree with any of the points though. :D

[Curly5]

The point is, WHO would have been preferable to all those players? And don't say, play the kids, please! There are no kids. (Which is a bit of a worry for next year.) Anyone else that played on Saturday night would have got clobbered even worse than the below-par team that played. And then the MC would have copped it for that. Lose-lose situation.

[Sockeye Salmon]

The point is, WHO would have been preferable to all those players? And don't say, play the kids, please! There are no kids. (Which is a bit of a worry for next year.) Anyone else that played on Saturday night would have got clobbered even worse than the below-par team that played. And then the MC would have copped it for that. Lose-lose situation.

Sockeye's 20 game rule.

[Mantis]

The point is, WHO would have been preferable to all those players? And don't say, play the kids, please! There are no kids. (Which is a bit of a worry for next year.) Anyone else that played on Saturday night would have got clobbered even worse than the below-par team that played. And then the MC would have copped it for that. Lose-lose situation.

Are Everitt, Jones or Hooper kids?

On what Higgins was able to produce I would have much preferred exposing one of these 3 to a 'big game' to at the very least give them a taste. Even if they failed (which Higgins did) they would have gained valuable experience which might have spurred them on to train that little bit harder over the next pre-season.

[Desipura]

The point is, WHO would have been preferable to all those players? And don't say, play the kids, please! There are no kids. (Which is a bit of a worry for next year.) Anyone else that played on Saturday night would have got clobbered even worse than the below-par team that played. And then the MC would have copped it for that. Lose-lose situation.

Anyone fit, whether they be young or not. Its a fair chance they will be young. If you are playing ressies and are experienced, the writing is on the wall you would think regarding your future.
Young inexperienced and fit vs experienced and cannot run, or are finished as footballers, you pick?

[Desipura]

Sockeye's 20 game rule. Who is saying youngsters are better than experienced players?

[Curly5]

Anyone fit, whether they be young or not. Its a fair chance they will be young. If you are playing ressies and are experienced, the writing is on the wall you would think regarding your future.
Young inexperienced and fit vs experienced and cannot run, or are finished as footballers, you pick?

Do you think they would have been able to produce a win over Collingwood? I don't.

[Desipura]

Do you think they would have been able to produce a win over Collingwood? I don't.
Neither would/could the experienced players.
Would the youngsters have gained some invaluable finals experience? YES

[comrade]

Sockeye's 20 game rule.

Not really.

More like comrade’s “Let’s play guys who may take us forwards, rather than fall back on experienced, proven big game failures who may not even be at the Club next year in a game where we had no chance to win” rule.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Not really.

More like comrade’s “Let’s play guys who may take us forwards, rather than fall back on experienced, proven big game failures who may not even be at the Club next year in a game where we had no chance to win” rule.

This.

Couple of posters above are missing the point. We were never going to beat Collingwood, but we're fed up of losing the same way with the same cattle. I'd guarantee you that any sensible Bulldog supporter would of said 'fair enough' if we lost with the likes of Everitt, Jones, Hooper etc. playing.

It's the fact that we lost another chance to further develop them in a big game, because we fell back on the players that are finished or injured.

[Raw Toast]

This.

Couple of posters above are missing the point. We were never going to beat Collingwood, but we're fed up of losing the same way with the same cattle.

It's the fact that we lost another chance to further develop them in a big game, because we fell back on the players that are finished or injured.

It's a reasonable idea but I disagree with it. Finals are not a time to concede defeat imo.

I was all for selecting Everitt and Hooper and not against selecting Jones, but none of them had made the compelling case that made it unreasonable to not select them.


I'd guarantee you that any sensible Bulldog supporter would of said 'fair enough' if we lost with the likes of Everitt, Jones, Hooper etc. playing.

If Everitt made some bad mistakes (like he has with a bit too much regularity), and Jones played like he did against Essendon and Hooper suffered from first-game jitters and was unable to adjust to the much greater intensity - all of which were fairly likely - I can guarantee you that this board with its many sensible posters, would've been out for blood.

[Desipura]

It's a reasonable idea but I disagree with it. Finals are not a time to concede defeat imo.

I was all for selecting Everitt and Hooper and not against selecting Jones, but none of them had made the compelling case that made it unreasonable to not select them.



If Everitt made some bad mistakes (like he has with a bit too much regularity), and Jones played like he did against Essendon and Hooper suffered from first-game jitters and was unable to adjust to the much greater intensity - all of which were fairly likely - I can guarantee you that this board with its many sensible posters, would've been out for blood.

But we did virtually conceded defeat by playing a number of half fit players!
I also disagree with the last paragraph, if the kids made mistakes and showed they were not up to it, this would not have been as bad as playing injured experienced players as well as experienced players who are not up to it. Not to mention historically failed to produce in finals.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

It's a reasonable idea but I disagree with it. Finals are not a time to concede defeat imo.

I was all for selecting Everitt and Hooper and not against selecting Jones, but none of them had made the compelling case that made it unreasonable to not select them.

Hahn (especially) made a compelling case not to pick him. It's now twice he's been belted by Leigh Brown. Didn't we learn anything from Scott Welsh last year? They aren't going to suddenly become solid defenders.

Higgins playing injured (or unfit) is an ignorant choice, too. Especially given Ward is not at 100%. Have either one of them played more than two good games all year? (Referring to Hahn/Higgins)

Hahn and Eagleton have been poor in almost every final over the past three years. The MC should have known that given they're three years older, nothing is going to change. It's not as though their H&A form has improved - it's dropped significantly. Why play players that shouldn't even be at the club in 2011?

Personally I just don't see any logic in the decision.


If Everitt made some bad mistakes (like he has with a bit too much regularity), and Jones played like he did against Essendon and Hooper suffered from first-game jitters and was unable to adjust to the much greater intensity - all of which were fairly likely - I can guarantee you that this board with its many sensible posters, would've been out for blood.

Maybe a couple, but not like what we've seen since Saturday Night. At the game, the faithful were clearly frustrated at the sight of Hahn, Eagleton, Higgins and even Johnson. Never quite been to a game like that, where our supporters have been so irritated by the selections.

[bornadog]

Sportal.com.au (http://sportal.com.au/afl-news-display/no-finals-for-higgins-98152)

The Western Bulldogs have suffered a selection blow ahead of Saturday night's semi final against the Sydney Swans with Shaun Higgins ruled out for the remainder of the season because of his thyroid condition.

With a host of first-choice stars including Adam Cooney and Dale Morris unavailable because of injury, the club had been hopeful that Higgins, who was diagnosed with thyroiditis several weeks ago, could return to his best in September.

But the 22-year-old's lacklustre effort in last Saturday night's qualifying final loss to Collingwood has convinced coach Rodney Eade to cut his losses.

"Obviously there's still some residual effect," said Eade of Higgins ahead of the Bulldogs' training run at the MCG on Wednesday morning.

"You could see the way he ran at the weekend, he just didn't have that speed or energy."

"They've done another test and his (thyroid levels) have just gone up a little bit so it's best to shelve him."

"He won't be playing (for the year)."

Eade said Ryan Griffin and Brian Harris had pulled up well from the knee and hip injuries they carried into the Magpies clash and would be right to take on the Swans.

Rebounding defender Easton Wood, who has missed three weeks with a torn hamstring, will be selected if he gets through training, though ruckman Jordan Roughead is only an outside chance to return from the shoulder injury he picked up against the Bombers in Round 22.

Eade nominated Brodie Moles, Andrejs Everitt and Josh Hill as being in the selection mix along with diminutive onballer Andrew Hooper who is yet to play a senior match.

"Perhaps the mistake we made was not playing him earlier to give him a couple of games in the home and away season," Eade said.

"It's a big ask to come in in a final but, having said that, he's a competitive little bugger and he's got some speed so they're ingredients which stand him in good stead in a final."

Eade said Morris was progressing well from the neck injury sustained when the Bulldogs last played the Swans up in Sydney only three weeks ago and would be a chance to return 'if we can keep progressing'.

He conceded his team's morale was down immediately after Saturday night's loss but said he's unlikely to talk up the emotion surrounding skipper Brad Johnson's retirement announcement this week in a bid to lift the mood.

"It will be mentioned a little bit, but it won't be the main driver," he said.

"The main driver is to play the way that we've got to be able to play."

"We've obviously let ourselves down the last four weeks."

Eade said he's taken a different approach this week compared to the past two seasons when the Bulldogs rebounded strongly from qualifying finals defeats to win their semis comfortably.

He said there's been more carrot and less stick.

"The previous two years have probably had some solid reinforcement," he said.

"This one is on the back of some poor form for a couple of weeks so I think we've got to try and get the confidence level back."

"We've done some things differently to get them back on the bike, to get them to play the way we know we can play and the way we want to play."

[Sedat]

Hahn and Eagleton have been poor in almost every final over the past three years.
Not quite true. Eagle does tend to burn in the 2nd week of the finals against inferior interstate opposition, espcially junk time :D

The less said about his QF's and PF's the better.

[mighty_west]

Eade nominated Brodie Moles, Andrejs Everitt and Josh Hill as being in the selection mix along with diminutive onballer Andrew Hooper who is yet to play a senior match.

"Perhaps the mistake we made was not playing him earlier to give him a couple of games in the home and away season," Eade said.

"It's a big ask to come in in a final but, having said that, he's a competitive little bugger and he's got some speed so they're ingredients which stand him in good stead in a final."



Hooray, now just play the kid, would be far more happier if Hooper struggled but gained valuable experience than an injured player who may look like he isn't trying [any sports person who has played at any level whilst injured knows that exact feeling], going in half ass'd, we know they try their guts out, but injuries can make players look that way, the minds are willing, but the body ain't, it can also have a detrimental effect on them longer term imo.

Just give Hoops the full backing and confidence to show what he's got, the team just needs spark, find some of that mojo back.

[The Pie Man]

Hooray, now just play the kid, would be far more happier if Hooper struggled but gained valuable experience than an injured player who may look like he isn't trying [any sports person who has played at any level whilst injured knows that exact feeling], going in half ass'd, we know they try their guts out, but injuries can make players look that way, the minds are willing, but the body ain't, it can also have a detrimental effect on them longer term imo.

Just give Hoops the full backing and confidence to show what he's got, the team just needs spark, find some of that mojo back.

I'm on the give Hoops (if that's his nickname :)) a game wagon as well - the MC will know better than me, so if they don't play the kid due it being a final I will get/accept it. One thing I will say about Hooper is his body size - yes he's a kid who has played 0 games, but he has the frame that at least looks up to physical pressure AFL can bring (like Rich last year....I stress like, not the same) and has been impressive against more experienced bodies at VFL level.

I've got a feeling he could be a nuggety little cult hero for us, and could thrive on the big stage. IF he gets picked and it doesn't work, at least they would've tried.

[AndrewP6]

Sportal.com.au (http://sportal.com.au/afl-news-display/no-finals-for-higgins-98152)


Eade said Ryan Griffin and Brian Harris had pulled up well from the knee and hip injuries they carried into the Magpies clash and would be right to take on the Swans.
"

Quality journalism...:rolleyes:

[bornadog]

Quality journalism...:rolleyes:

Yeah, I noticed that and I am not bsure if thats what Eade called him and they just published it.

Last week I was against Hooper debuting in the finals, but after that shocking performance, we should give him a go.

[mighty_west]

Yeah, I noticed that and I am not bsure if thats what Eade called him and they just published it.

Last week I was against Hooper debuting in the finals, but after that shocking performance, we should give him a go.

It may have been a slip from Rocket, but still, the writer still has his copywriter who has his editor to fix such mistakes, lazy journalism.

[Greystache]

Not really.

More like comrade’s “Let’s play guys who may take us forwards, rather than fall back on experienced, proven big game failures who may not even be at the Club next year in a game where we had no chance to win” rule.

It's a very specific rule this one- but a rule that fits the occasion none the less! ;)

[Grantysghost]

I dont get this obsession with Everitt, people alot wiser than us including a coaching panel dont think he's up to it despite repeated chances. I've seen nothing to suggest he could make a significant difference to the side. As for Hooper he hasn't played a game and the finals aren't the time to be blooding new players.
Seems like we are so desperate we are searching for anything. The team we put out was the best available. We lost. Guess what we are the 4th best team..... Bring on the Swans.

[Cyberdoggie]

Not quite true. Eagle does tend to burn in the 2nd week of the finals against inferior interstate opposition, espcially junk time :D

The less said about his QF's and PF's the better.

So does Hahn.

He was one of our best against Sydney at the MCG last time we met in the semi final from memory.

[Cyberdoggie]

I dont get this obsession with Everitt, people alot wiser than us including a coaching panel dont think he's up to it despite repeated chances. I've seen nothing to suggest he could make a significant difference to the side. As for Hooper he hasn't played a game and the finals aren't the time to be blooding new players.
Seems like we are so desperate we are searching for anything. The team we put out was the best available. We lost. Guess what we are the 4th best team..... Bring on the Swans.

We aren't really playing like the fourth best team at the moment.

I think we just want to see a Bulldogs side that will give it their all, and that is what we haven't been seeing from probably our most experienced players.

They have well and truly had their opportunity and they haven't delivered. We won't win a flag with some of these guys so might as well use this opportunity to educate the players that will.

[Flamethrower]

It is a shame for Shaun that his thyroid condition deteriorated on the weekend, but to say he should not have played is simplistic and easy in hindsight. His thyroid function tests would have been monitored constantly since his diagnosis, and he would not have played unless his blood tests were completely within normal parameters.

What appears to have happened is the combination of the extra physical energy required to play at AFL finals level over VFL level, along with the rise in adrenaline levels from playing in a final, have combined to stress the thyroid gland into crisis and resulted in the deterioration of Shaun's condition. It got worse the longer the game went, which is consistent with this sort of thing and something that could not have been predicted.

Hopefully Maxwell feels about 1mm tall after his sledging of Shaun about his lack of effort, considering the extenuating circumstances.

[Grantysghost]

I think we just want to see a Bulldogs side that will give it their all, and that is what we haven't been seeing from probably our most experienced players.



Totally agree with this. If we can somehow get back what we had in Adelaide only 4-5 weeks ago... That Easton Wood v Tippet moment was one of my season highlights. I have faith we'll be a lot better against the Swans.

[1eyedog]

Totally agree with this. If we can somehow get back what we had in Adelaide only 4-5 weeks ago... That Easton Wood v Tippet moment was one of my season highlights. I have faith we'll be a lot better against the Swans.

If we don't I think we are going to see a lot of Richmond-like behaviour from our fans. Especially if we only make a limited amount of changes.

[EasternWest]

Are Everitt, Jones or Hooper kids?

On what Higgins was able to produce I would have much preferred exposing one of these 3 to a 'big game' to at the very least give them a taste. Even if they failed (which Higgins did) they would have gained valuable experience which might have spurred them on to train that little bit harder over the next pre-season.

What he said.

[stefoid]

I dont get this obsession with Everitt, people alot wiser than us including a coaching panel dont think he's up to it despite repeated chances. I've seen nothing to suggest he could make a significant difference to the side. As for Hooper he hasn't played a game and the finals aren't the time to be blooding new players.
Seems like we are so desperate we are searching for anything. The team we put out was the best available. We lost. Guess what we are the 4th best team..... Bring on the Swans.

Normally Id agree with you, but I think its pretty obvious that we wont stand a chance in the PF unless we add some pace and disposal skills to the side.

And next year, I cant see Hahn getting a game - he will serve out his time as a depth player, so in the very, very likely event that we fail again in the PF, players like Hooper or Jones will benefit enormously from having played a final or two.

On that basis:

Callan/Addison, Hahn, Higgins OUT

Jones, Hooper, Wood IN

Id give Minson one last chance to redeem himself and Roughhead+Morris another week off for their injuries.

[Raw Toast]

It is a shame for Shaun that his thyroid condition deteriorated on the weekend, but to say he should not have played is simplistic and easy in hindsight. His thyroid function tests would have been monitored constantly since his diagnosis, and he would not have played unless his blood tests were completely within normal parameters.

What appears to have happened is the combination of the extra physical energy required to play at AFL finals level over VFL level, along with the rise in adrenaline levels from playing in a final, have combined to stress the thyroid gland into crisis and resulted in the deterioration of Shaun's condition. It got worse the longer the game went, which is consistent with this sort of thing and something that could not have been predicted.

Agree with this. We risked a relatively unfit Higgins in the 2008 Prelim and he was one of the key reasons we got so close.

Of course we'd select the side differently in hindsight. But it was a calculated risk just like Griffen was, and for some reason people don't seem to be complaining about that move...

[comrade]

Agree with this. We risked a relatively unfit Higgins in the 2008 Prelim and he was one of the key reasons we got so close.

Of course we'd select the side differently in hindsight. But it was a calculated risk just like Griffen was, and for some reason people don't seem to be complaining about that move...

Yes, we over-estimated Higgins ability to play under severe duress. Thankfully, Griff was mentally strong enough to stand up.

[LostDoggy]

Yes, we over-estimated Higgins ability to play under severe duress. Thankfully, Griff was mentally strong enough to stand up.

Bit unfair on Higgins. You cant take a jab for severe fatigue to get you up for the game.

[mjp]

Yes, we over-estimated Higgins ability to play under severe duress. Thankfully, Griff was mentally strong enough to stand up.

Harsh.

Playing with an injury is different to playing whilst sick. Having an injury can sometimes increase your focus on the task at hand - there tends to be less 'wasted' running, your efforts become very specific and the level of contribution is high. Playing when suffering from an illness is different again...

[Ghost Dog]

Bit unfair on Higgins. You cant take a jab for severe fatigue to get you up for the game.

Well, the question then is why did they play him? I'm really frustrated that decent second tier players like Moles have not been given a chance to prove themselves. Why bother investing in these players if we won't give them a proper run?

[The Pie Man]

If Shaun's heartrate was highly elevated (someone mentioned on the radio he looked white after the game) I don't believe there's any amount of mental toughness that will push you through that.

I'm glad they've made the call to shelve his year, his health is more important - and a healthy Higgins will benefit us long term.

[LostDoggy]

Well, the question then is why did they play him? I'm really frustrated that decent second tier players like Moles have not been given a chance to prove themselves. Why bother investing in these players if we won't give them a proper run?


No idea Ghost Dog. Just hoping it would come off i guess.

[LostDoggy]

Get him ready for next year.

Was speaking to a guy at work (Geelong supporter) and he couldn't believe how much Higgins had changed in 2 years, he said watching the game on Saturday night, he looked like a shade of his form from 2 years ago.

Injury obviously hampered him.

[Dancin' Douggy]

It is a shame for Shaun that his thyroid condition deteriorated on the weekend, but to say he should not have played is simplistic and easy in hindsight. His thyroid function tests would have been monitored constantly since his diagnosis, and he would not have played unless his blood tests were completely within normal parameters.

What appears to have happened is the combination of the extra physical energy required to play at AFL finals level over VFL level, along with the rise in adrenaline levels from playing in a final, have combined to stress the thyroid gland into crisis and resulted in the deterioration of Shaun's condition. It got worse the longer the game went, which is consistent with this sort of thing and something that could not have been predicted.

Hopefully Maxwell feels about 1mm tall after his sledging of Shaun about his lack of effort, considering the extenuating circumstances.

Thankyou

[SonofScray]

Just a dirty year for Higgins. I have been a harsh critic, and simply do not agree with the calls that he could be a captain, is a star, or a walk up start. However, I do acknowledge that a large part of why I believe this s due to his form in 2010 which was severely hampered through injury and illness, so fair play to Higgo for still getting out there. I'm certain he will be a fantastic contributor in 2011.

What I'd like Higgins to work on and improve in 2011 is his defensive efforts. He doesn't appear to play desperate defensive footy when its not in his hands. Any stats to prove me otherwise? I know his tackle count has been reasonable a few times this year. Just needs to chase harder, get involved in more contests.

I'd also like to see him take more responsibility in front of goals. He is a star quality finisher, if anything and I felt he shirked the responsibility of putting the ball through the sticks a few times this season. Most noticeably was the shocking hand pass to Grant v Hawthorn (i think) that cost us dearly.

Get him fit, address these small issues and he will go from my whipping boy to my favourite quick smart. I'm happy we've given up on him this season though. Just stunk it up something shocking.



Of course we'd select the side differently in hindsight. But it was a calculated risk just like Griffen was, and for some reason people don't seem to be complaining about that move...

Thats a mostly fair comment, which Rocket too was quick to assert in the press conference. My argument would be that Griffen had shown much better form this season and was a safer bet, with Johnno looking a little bit more likely when he got going for a few weeks. Higgo just never got the ball rolling this year, maybe one really good game this year.

[Desipura]

Yes, we over-estimated Higgins ability to play under severe duress. Thankfully, Griff was mentally strong enough to stand up.
Very harsh comment. Do you know how easy it is to play with the injuries/sickness Higgins has had?:rolleyes:
Griffen did the injury the week prior whereas Higgins has had them all year.

[comrade]

Very harsh comment. Do you know how easy it is to play with the injuries/sickness Higgins has had?:rolleyes:

Have I ever been asked to play a cut throat final while diagnosed with thyroiditis, despite coming off a base of no form or fitness?

No, have you?



Griffen did the injury the week prior whereas Higgins has had them all year.

So, if everyone is now saying his illness was such that there was no way we could have expected him to perform, the question must be asked why did he play?

The answer is - the MC over-estimated his ability to play through it. Physically and mentally.

The doctors would have known that the increased effort and adrenaline required to perform in a final was likely to cause issues, but we ignored that advice; I can only assume it was because we believed Higgins was strong enough to step up and contribute, especially considering the role we gave him at the opening bounce (straight to O'Brien).

Not sure why you (and others) are getting upset. It's more a compliment to Griff than a big whack to Higgins.

Pretty simple.

[Desipura]

Not sure why you (and others) are getting upset. It's more a compliment to Griff than a big whack to Higgins.

Pretty simple.
If me and others are getting upset, does that not tell you that perhaps you could have worded it differently? It looked more like a dig at Higgins IMHO.

[comrade]

If me and others are getting upset, does that not tell you that perhaps you could have worded it differently? It looked more like a dig at Higgins IMHO.

Don't get me wrong - I was having a dig at Higgins, but purely to highlight the performance of Griff.

Regardless of whether Higgins should have played (which he shouldn't have), both were asked to perform under severe duress and one succeeded.

[LostDoggy]

I'm usually a bit of a critic of Higgins but I can't fault him on his performance on the weekend. From my observation, he was really busting a gut and gave his all. Whether he was well enough to be selected is a different matter but Higgins himself gave as much as he could
give. You only had to look at Higgins standing alongside say a Beams to know there was something wrong. The woods players were all chest puffed out, focussed, energetic and standing tall. Higgins had sunken eyes, looked pale, head bowed, lethargic and little muscle definition. And this was before the game. He looked like he dragged himself out of bed still sick but he had to be there.

[Mantis]

Regardless of whether Higgins should have played (which he shouldn't have), both were asked to perform under severe duress and one succeeded.

The question remains was it Shaun's illness which made him unable to perform at an adequate level or was it his lack of mental toughness.

All the signs point to the illness (well at least that's what we are being told), but I guess the question can't be answered until Shaun is fully recovered and we can then view the type of footy he plays.

[Greystache]

Very harsh comment. Do you know how easy it is to play with the injuries/sickness Higgins has had?:rolleyes:
Griffen did the injury the week prior whereas Higgins has had them all year.

As far as I'm aware the club is saying Higgins' thyroid problem only surfaced in the later part of the season. His form has been poor for virtually the whole season, I know there's been mention of him carrying a groin issue too, but I seriously question his ability to play at the level required unless he's 100% fit, and unfortunately at AFL level that's not a luxury players can enjoy all that often. I think Higgins needs to have a hard think about his football and whether or not he's going to be able to mentally and physically handle the demands it puts on players.

[Desipura]

As far as I'm aware the club is saying Higgins' thyroid problem only surfaced in the later part of the season. His form has been poor for virtually the whole season, I know there's been mention of him carrying a groin issue too, but I seriously question his ability to play at the level required unless he's 100% fit, and unfortunately at AFL level that's not a luxury players can enjoy all that often. I think Higgins needs to have a hard think about his football and whether or not he's going to be able to mentally and physically handle the demands it puts on players.
For memory Mantis and I noticed him clutch his groin after a kick when we played Essendon the first time this season.

[Topdog]

It is a shame for Shaun that his thyroid condition deteriorated on the weekend, but to say he should not have played is simplistic and easy in hindsight. His thyroid function tests would have been monitored constantly since his diagnosis, and he would not have played unless his blood tests were completely within normal parameters.

What appears to have happened is the combination of the extra physical energy required to play at AFL finals level over VFL level, along with the rise in adrenaline levels from playing in a final, have combined to stress the thyroid gland into crisis and resulted in the deterioration of Shaun's condition. It got worse the longer the game went, which is consistent with this sort of thing and something that could not have been predicted.

Hopefully Maxwell feels about 1mm tall after his sledging of Shaun about his lack of effort, considering the extenuating circumstances.

So we didn't expect him to react poorly to a massive increase in physical energy / pressure being applied to him?

When it was announced that he had the condition they said he was done for the year, 2 weeks later he is playing in a final against a team that applies enormous pressure in H&A games. Lunacy IMO. I don't blame Shaun at all, just think he should not have been risked.

[LostDoggy]

As far as I'm aware the club is saying Higgins' thyroid problem only surfaced in the later part of the season. His form has been poor for virtually the whole season, I know there's been mention of him carrying a groin issue too, but I seriously question his ability to play at the level required unless he's 100% fit, and unfortunately at AFL level that's not a luxury players can enjoy all that often. I think Higgins needs to have a hard think about his football and whether or not he's going to be able to mentally and physically handle the demands it puts on players.

From what i understand thyroid problems rarely just suddenly appear. The thyroid will be overactive, the levels slowly creep up over a number of months (or longer) , you don't feel right but can't put your finger on it, until the symptoms become severe enough that someone in the know can recognize it for what it is and suggest a blood test.