Grant Thomas has one last dig

[aker39]

http://wwos.ninemsn.com.au/blog.aspx?blogentryid=705332&showcomments=true

The Bulldogs were predictable...

Honorable effort for a couple of quarters and then the obligatory capitulation after half time. Coach Rodney Eade needs to "up" his expectations if he was proud of their efforts - maybe thats the problem? He reinforced to his charges post game that their effort was to be the benchmark or "basic ingredient" as he calls it. He says his team showed a lot of commitment and he was proud of them. He thinks they stood up in adversity? He infers injuries counted against them? He says his list is in good shape? He sings the praises of their team spirit and courage?

Was I watching another game?

Haven't they completely compounded since the disastrous Akermanis issue?

Where was Johnson? Where was Giansiracusa?

Why on earth would they persist with Hahn and Eagleton?

Why was Cal Ward left out of games? Why haven't we seen more of Addison? What has Everitt done wrong? Has Hills papers been marked? How is Rougheads development going? Between Johnson (0), Murphy (1), Giansiracusa (2), Eagleton (0), Gilbee (1), Griffen (1), Lake (0), Hudson (0) and Hall (1) they combined for the grand total of six tackles. Thats right six tackles from nine of their most experienced leaders. That is mystifying and a complete reflection of their leadership and coaching. Not one Saints player failed to register a tackle and only three players had less than two. On the other hand six players only had one tackle in the Bulldogs list. This is a game that determines who you are and what you stand for. On both counts the standards set by the Bulldogs are mediocre to say the least and warrant urgent addressing if they are to be considered a serious threat in the future.

[comrade]

What a flog.

Why was Cal Ward left out of games? Umm, because he was injured.

How is Rougheads development going? Very bloody nicely, thanks for asking.

He makes some valid points regarding our tackle count etc, but he has some weird, unbridled hatred of the Bulldogs that is way too transparent.

[Remi Moses]

I agree with his sentiments about our tackling. Not Good enough it's left to a few to do our tackling.Disagree with his sentiments about Akermanis ,going backwards while he was there!
Disagree about Ward. Do your research Grant as he was injured!
Roughead's had a shoulder injury. Also can somebody inform him when you lose your best midfielder and your best defensive backman has a broken back,it's actually detrimental to your side!
Interesting perhaps Grant can give us some advice on nepotism
When you appoint your best mate as coach!!!!

[EasternWest]

Sacked coach says you got it wrong. Next.

[EasternWest]

Why haven't we seen more of Addison?

Although he does make a good point :D.

[comrade]

Although he does make a good point :D.

Ha. Dylan has hit the big time, being name checked in a Cornflakes article!

[Topdog]

He is right about everything except Ward and Roughead.

[Doc26]

Unfortunately Thomas's inaccuracies in this article eg Why was Ward left out ? does diminish some otherwise reasonable commentary.

[Dancin' Douggy]

And I presume he didn't see any of Josh Hills completely underwhelming games for Willy.

[Sedat]

I did think Rocket was a little too "up" in the post-match press conference. I know we were down on rat power, but our 3rd qtr was inept at best. The midfield battle in particular was one-way traffic with St Kilda imposing their will on proceedings for 20 very costly minutes. No problem with Rocket mentioning the injuries sustained on the night in the presser, but acknowledgement of some extremely poor football during the 3rd qtr probably should have been offered up as a counter-point.

[Greystache]

As others have said, apart from some poor research in relation to Ward and Roughead I agree with virtually everything else in his article. We can cry outrage as much as we like but the simple fact is we've done nothing to change the perception of us.

Thomas has said publicly before he doesn't rate the Bulldogs as a club because we haven't beaten a contender in a final in 50 years, and this group is no different at 0-6 in the past three years. If we ever beat anyone he might start giving us some respect.

It's hard to mount a case against his logic.

[Ghost Dog]

I did think Rocket was a little too "up" in the post-match press conference. I know we were down on rat power, but our 3rd qtr was inept at best. The midfield battle in particular was one-way traffic with St Kilda imposing their will on proceedings for 20 very costly minutes. No problem with Rocket mentioning the injuries sustained on the night in the presser, but acknowledgement of some extremely poor football during the 3rd qtr probably should have been offered up as a counter-point.

rat power haha. I love that.

[Ghost Dog]

As others have said, apart from some poor research in relation to Ward and Roughead I agree with virtually everything else in his article. We can cry outrage as much as we like but the simple fact is we've done nothing to change the perception of us.

Thomas has said publicly before he doesn't rate the Bulldogs as a club because we haven't beaten a contender in a final in 50 years, and this group is no different at 0-6 in the past three years. If we ever beat anyone he might start giving us some respect.

It's hard to mount a case against his logic.

Not really hard at all.

So Where did he say this and when?
It's a pretty illogical thing to say. If he did say it.
Which Bulldogs is he not rating?
The Bulldogs of 50, 30, 20 or ten years ago? -all different teams to my mind. Football is complex, and for whatever reason, we haven't made it to the final. Lots of reasons. Poor form, Financial trouble leading to trading quality players, bad luck and better opposition. A complex of factors. Slap the label on the club if you like, but it's rather a simplistic view. For supporters who follow, we know why Callan was out, why Everitt has been overlooked and why Hill is on the outer. Easy to take cheap shots from the outside.


Hardly

[bornadog]

Its easy to criticize teams, just sit back and pick players off one by one, have a go at the coach etc, however, its harder to come up with a solution which Grant doesnot have.

[Greystache]

Not really hard at all.

So Where did he say this and when?
It's a pretty illogical thing to say. If he did say it.
Which Bulldogs is he not rating?
The Bulldogs of 50, 30, 20 or ten years ago? -all different teams to my mind. Football is complex, and for whatever reason, we haven't made it to the final. Lots of reasons. Poor form, Financial trouble leading to trading quality players, bad luck and better opposition. A complex of factors. Slap the label on the club if you like, but it's rather a simplistic view. For supporters who follow, we know why Callan was out, why Everitt has been overlooked and why Hill is on the outer. Easy to take cheap shots from the outside.


Hardly

Not sure what point you're trying to make.

He's saying the club hasn't achieved anything which is why he doesn't rate the club, and this team has continued on the tradition. If the team can break the trend then he'll take us more seriously, so far they haven't been able to.

[Ghost Dog]

Not sure what point you're trying to make.

He's saying the club hasn't achieved anything which is why he doesn't rate the club, and this team has continued on the tradition. If the team can break the trend then he'll take us more seriously, so far they haven't been able to.

Bollocks.
He makes some obvious points. Sure, tackling is an issue this season.
But The stuff about Ward and Everitt that he spouts in his article is proof he is taking a few cheap shots.

Even if we did win the final last year, now is now. Who cares about last year? This year is the issue.
If Essendon didn't win a flag for another 56 years, would they be rated as a better club just because of finals they won centuries ago? Your club is only as good as your current team. Grant Thomas is not the most respected man in footy and while making some good points, has it in for us. So who cares.

[LostDoggy]

Haven't they completely compounded since the disastrous Akermanis issue?


Getting a bit sick of this.

Since round 10 (Akers last game for the Dogs) to when the "Flu" hit in round 19:

Lost 2 games by an average of 6 pts

Won 6 games by an average of 63 pts.
"Compounded" my arse!
It was the "Flu" that "Compounded" us.

[FrediKanoute]

He is right about everything except Ward and Roughead.

Agree......I don't see a lot wrong in his comments aside from the above. Its a damning stat the tackle count and probably shows what many of us observers have been grumbling about for a while....... Eagle, Gia and Johnno this year have failed to contribute defensively and it has cost us. Less concerned about Hall and Lake who both did jobs and contributed in otehr areas (well Hall would have if he'd kicked straight!). Gilbee and Murphy, it just shows that the way they played on Saturday was pretty average and Griffin.....well I'm prepared to cut him some slack.

What the comments do show however is that if we can get our defensivel;y pressure right, tackle count up across the team we will probably make great strides next season.

[AndrewP6]

Less concerned about Hall and Lake who both did jobs and contributed in otehr areas (well Hall would have if he'd kicked straight!). G

Apart from Saturday, Hally has had the radar working pretty well...including finals, 80 goals, 41 behinds.

[ratsmac]

Dare I say it but I almost want the filth to win this Saturday just to stick it up this piece of shite.

[BulldogBelle]

I have read many posts in this forum where people have said words along the line of 'attack the ball and not the man'. Dismissing Thomas as irrelevant or having a grudge is in my opinion missing the point.
Ok, the Ward and Roughead comments are wide of the mark, but its hard not to agree with some of his criticisms of us. Too many on here are quick to defend us with an almost blind faith. I hate Grant Thomas as much as anyone because he has had a penchant for taking pot shots at our club over the last few years, but... he has got some valid points.
I too was unhappy with Eade's upbeat manner in the post match presser. Ross Lyon gave his team an absolute serve at their B&F last year after they lost the GF. We are too nice as a club and our MC (as most would agree on other threads) have shirked taking the hard decisions time and time again... If Josh Fraser played for us, he'd be up to 210 games...
Ghost Dog, although I agree a current team can not be responsible for the history of a club's under performance, it can however adopt an entrenched culture and carry on a cycle of behaviors and expectations, which I believe is what we have done over a long time. The entrenched culture within our club is that we become overly enamored and centered on individuals/personalities rather than the team; we are not harsh enough critics of our own performances; The club is predisposed to take the positive/encouraging line than take a clinical/critical approach. I believe it is these entrenched cultural characteristics that have stunted our ability to truly realise our potential as a club.

[mighty_west]

Thomas's big blunder is leaving himself wide open for ridicule by not working hard enough to find info in why he fell short with the Ward & Roughead comments.

Apart from that, i can't really fault his comments, he is saying what most of us think anyway, and it isn't as though he has always had some beef with our club, he was quite complimentary a while back.

[Mofra]

I agree with his sentiments about our tackling. Not Good enough it's left to a few to do our tackling.
I actually agree with his tackling comments too. It's an area we have been poor in all year.

He does make some silly comments on other areas. Ward had been injured for much of the year Grant, a small amount of research before your next article please.

[anfo27]

As many have said I agree with Grants comments except for the obvious about Ward & Roughie.

People comment that out tackling has been a problem this year. I don't know what the stats are but we were one of the worst tackling sides before Eade took the job and nothing has changed. We simply have a side that can not physically tackle but crap on about how its more about the intent to tackle then to actually tackle. To have 40 tackles in a H & A game is not good enough let a alone a final.

As Ron Barassi would say 'you give me tackles and I'll shut up'.

[Before I Die]

Thomas's big blunder is leaving himself wide open for ridicule by not working hard enough to find info in why he fell short with the Ward & Roughead comments.

Apart from that, i can't really fault his comments, he is saying what most of us think anyway, and it isn't as though he has always had some beef with our club, he was quite complimentary a while back.

Don't confuse number of posts with number of posters. The article is a nasty, hate mail piece by a man who clearly has a very big axe to grind with Eade. Sure there are some facts in the article, along with some mistruths. But he is simply picking out the ones that support his vitriol. An Eade fanboy could have just as easily written a directly opposing article and it would have been no more valid and no less correct.

However, this post is not about Grant Thomas, it is about the presumption of a majority view in MWs post. Run a poll if you want to know the views of other posters. Don't simply use the 'everyone says' approach to validate your own views or the views of what may in fact be a vocal minority.

[KT31]

Don't confuse number of posts with number of posters. The article is a nasty, hate mail piece by a man who clearly has a very big axe to grind with Eade. Sure there are some facts in the article, along with some mistruths. But he is simply picking out the ones that support his vitriol. An Eade fanboy could have just as easily written a directly opposing article and it would have been no more valid and no less correct.
However, this post is not about Grant Thomas, it is about the presumption of a majority view in MWs post. Run a poll if you want to know the views of other posters. Don't simply use the 'everyone says' approach to validate your own views or the views of what may in fact be a vocal minority.

Yes, but it would take much more for it to be believable and instal belief after our performance last weekend.

[Bulldog4life]

Not sure what point you're trying to make.

He's saying the club hasn't achieved anything which is why he doesn't rate the club, and this team has continued on the tradition. If the team can break the trend then he'll take us more seriously, so far they haven't been able to.

And his Club has! One premiership at the time of his writing...yes just like the Bulldogs.:rolleyes:

[Greystache]

And his Club has! One premiership at the time of his writing...yes just like the Bulldogs.:rolleyes:

Not to want to go too deep into the subject, at least they're playing in their 3rd GF in the past 15 years. Do you know how you win a premiership? It's by playing in Grand Finals. Over the past 30 years our record is poor compared to every club in the AFL barring Fremantle and that includes Richmond.

[mighty_west]

Don't confuse number of posts with number of posters. The article is a nasty, hate mail piece by a man who clearly has a very big axe to grind with Eade. Sure there are some facts in the article, along with some mistruths. But he is simply picking out the ones that support his vitriol. An Eade fanboy could have just as easily written a directly opposing article and it would have been no more valid and no less correct.

However, this post is not about Grant Thomas, it is about the presumption of a majority view in MWs post. Run a poll if you want to know the views of other posters. Don't simply use the 'everyone says' approach to validate your own views or the views of what may in fact be a vocal minority.

Actually my post wasn't about Grant Thomas at all, it was about his article itself, so perhaps you generalised as much as i did with my one liner about what most of us think, and yes, i probably did generalise.

I'm not too sure Thomas does have an axe to grind with Rocket [unless i don't know something that hasn't been publicised?], but like i mentioned, he has been full of praise towards Rocket and the Dogs in the past, was it start of this season / end of last season?

We set a bar with intensity, pressure, tackling in last years Prelim, unfortunatly that was down this year, the tackling count was way below par, especially low for a team that had high expectations this year, he was also correct in saying that perhaps we played a few older players when perhaps they didn't warrant selection, Rocket even acknowledged that in one of his recent press conferences.

[Bulldog4life]

Not to want to go too deep into the subject, at least they're playing in their 3rd GF in the past 15 years. Do you know how you win a premiership? It's by playing in Grand Finals. Over the past 30 years our record is poor compared to every club in the AFL barring Fremantle and that includes Richmond.

You can dress it up any way you like. When it comes to the ultimate prize St.Kilda and the Western Bulldogs are neck & neck.

[Cyberdoggie]

Dare I say it but I almost want the filth to win this Saturday just to stick it up this piece of shite.

If they did win i'm sure he'll claim some of the credit.

[Greystache]

You can dress it up any way you like. When it comes to the ultimate prize St.Kilda and the Western Bulldogs are neck & neck.

That's your view.

Personally I would love for the first time in my life to have a commitment on the last Saturday in September other than getting pissed at a BBQ

[Bulldog4life]

That's your view.

Personally I would love for the first time in my life to have a commitment on the last Saturday in September other than getting pissed at a BBQ

Then you should get married :D

[Greystache]

Then you should get married :D

Haha, touché!

[Topdog]

You can dress it up any way you like. When it comes to the ultimate prize St.Kilda and the Western Bulldogs are neck & neck.

OK but how does that make his article wrong?

[Bulldog4life]

OK but how does that make his article wrong?

I wasn't commenting on the Article. As a number of posters do regularly, I detoured away from the subject to give my 2 cents on St.Kilda's & Western Bulldogs similar history.

[Remi Moses]

Dare I say it but I almost want the filth to win this Saturday just to stick it up this piece of shite.

Agreed I'm hoping The Pies win . His article has a few fair points,but coming from a culture like Stkilda and saying he doesn't rate us is like getting back packing advice from Ivan Milat.

[Ghost Dog]

I have read many posts in this forum where people have said words along the line of 'attack the ball and not the man'. Dismissing Thomas as irrelevant or having a grudge is in my opinion missing the point.
Ok, the Ward and Roughead comments are wide of the mark, but its hard not to agree with some of his criticisms of us. Too many on here are quick to defend us with an almost blind faith. I hate Grant Thomas as much as anyone because he has had a penchant for taking pot shots at our club over the last few years, but... he has got some valid points.
I too was unhappy with Eade's upbeat manner in the post match presser. Ross Lyon gave his team an absolute serve at their B&F last year after they lost the GF. We are too nice as a club and our MC (as most would agree on other threads) have shirked taking the hard decisions time and time again... If Josh Fraser played for us, he'd be up to 210 games...
Ghost Dog, although I agree a current team can not be responsible for the history of a club's under performance, it can however adopt an entrenched culture and carry on a cycle of behaviors and expectations, which I believe is what we have done over a long time. The entrenched culture within our club is that we become overly enamored and centered on individuals/personalities rather than the team; we are not harsh enough critics of our own performances; The club is predisposed to take the positive/encouraging line than take a clinical/critical approach. I believe it is these entrenched cultural characteristics that have stunted our ability to truly realise our potential as a club.

I agree with you on GT. He has some points and I mentioned this. Particularly tackles. How can you argue with that? However, he seems biased. Case in point, no mention of the flu Virus in round 19.

2pot -- I totally agree with you about club culture and the cult of personality. People can get too wrapped up in past success or failure. As mentioned, club is only as good as its present performance. Label us as a club entrenched in near miss failures or paint a brighter picture of where we are at; either way none of it helps. Need to be really focused on what is happening now, current list, performance and plans.
I'm not one for painting a pretty picture of where the club is at. But saying you 'don't rate the team' because of it's track record or history is 'bulldog-shite'. We are at where we are at for more reasons than GT states.

For a more balanced end of season review of our club's performance this season, read here.

http://www.afl.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/208/newsid/102862/default.aspx

[Stefcep]

Apart from Saturday, Hally has had the radar working pretty well...including finals, 80 goals, 41 behinds.

So what? LAst season we scored more than anyone, we had a spread of goal kickers, and some semblance of system going in to the forward 50. Now we ignore our forwards and just bomb to Barry. The balance is out of kilter: I'd rather Barry kick 50 with the other forwards getting their 2.5 goals per game with the midfielders looking to hit them on the chest like we did 1-2 years ago.

BTW Grant is more or less on the money. I'm sick of us being too precious as supporters to take the cold hard truth.

[Before I Die]

So what? LAst season we scored more than anyone, we had a spread of goal kickers, and some semblance of system going in to the forward 50. Now we ignore our forwards and just bomb to Barry. The balance is out of kilter: I'd rather Barry kick 50 with the other forwards getting their 2.5 goals per game with the midfielders looking to hit them on the chest like we did 1-2 years ago.

BTW Grant is more or less on the money. I'm sick of us being too precious as supporters to take the cold hard truth.

You don't suppose that the improvement in our defence may have had an impact on our scoring. Less free wheeling means less scoring opportunities.

Now let me get this straight. Grant's article says we didn't win because we weren't good enough. I am not too sure there are many supporters who don't accept that. As for his explanation for why we were not good enough, he may be right or wrong. Last year it was because we didn't have a power forward. This year it is supposedly because we played too many veterans and didn't tackle enough. And if we go close next year, it will be something else. It is so easy to be an expert when all you are doing is describing the past. If Grant is so knowledgable why couldn't he win a flag with a team which (if memory serves me right) won 13 games in a row under his tutelage.

BTW Stefcep, I am happy to hear your opinions on anything Western Bulldogs, but I am not interested in hearing others criticised because they may not share those opinions.

[Sedat]

Where GT loses credibility is attempting to link the Akermanis sacking into our failed prelim final performance. This coming from the coach who sacked Matthew Capuano mid-season for no apparent reason other than he was giving GT a bit of lip at a teammate's party one night.

[Mofra]

So what? LAst season we scored more than anyone, we had a spread of goal kickers, and some semblance of system going in to the forward 50. Now we ignore our forwards and just bomb to Barry. The balance is out of kilter: I'd rather Barry kick 50 with the other forwards getting their 2.5 goals per game with the midfielders looking to hit them on the chest like we did 1-2 years ago.
Last year we had Johnno, Aker, Hahn and Hill as F50 contributers.
Injuries and form left Bazza as our only real F50 target, with Gia playing the odd cameo, and Grant learning the ropes. We definately need to be less predictable with our F50 entries but I think we were left with little choice in 2010.

Scary thought, but I think Grant needs to set himself to finish in the top two or three in our goal tally next year lest we become too predictable.

[Greystache]

Last year we had Johnno, Aker, Hahn and Hill as F50 contributers.
Injuries and form left Bazza as our only real F50 target, with Gia playing the odd cameo, and Grant learning the ropes. We definately need to be less predictable with our F50 entries but I think we were left with little choice in 2010.

Scary thought, but I think Grant needs to set himself to finish in the top two or three in our goal tally next year lest we become too predictable.

He came 3rd this year with 29, so not a big stretch.

[bornadog]

He came 3rd this year with 29, so not a big stretch.

Needs to kick closer to 40 plus.

[Greystache]

Needs to kick closer to 40 plus.

It'll be interesting to see what he looks like come the NAB cup, hopefully he'll be pushing 90kgs. If he is I think 40 goals is pretty realistic.

Despite what the club had continually told the media, I've been told he was anything but a hard trainer and his attitude was pretty poor, that was until he got a few games in the early part of this season, now he's apparently busting a gut at training. I wouldn't be surprised to see him bulk up considerably this preseason, I actually think once he started giving it a crack he put on some muscle through out the course of the season.

[bornadog]

It'll be interesting to see what he looks like come the NAB cup, hopefully he'll be pushing 90kgs. If he is I think 40 goals is pretty realistic.

Despite what the club had continually told the media, I've been told he was anything but a hard trainer and his attitude was pretty poor, that was until he got a few games in the early part of this season, now he's apparently busting a gut at training. I wouldn't be surprised to see him bulk up considerably this preseason, I actually think once he started giving it a crack he put on some muscle through out the course of the season.

He needs to balance bulking up and retaining his great speed. We also forget that he is 192cm, so I expect that he will take more contested marks in the future.

[Mofra]

He needs to balance bulking up and retaining his great speed. We also forget that he is 192cm, so I expect that he will take more contested marks in the future.
I don't think he will bulk up much anyway - he may attain Bob Murphy's build but not much more.
His speed and timing of his hands are fantatstic assets and I would hope the club protect that aspect of his game at all costs.

[Ghost Dog]

It's been great to watch older opponents try to burn him off only to be chased down by Granty. :)

[Stefcep]

You don't suppose that the improvement in our defence may have had an impact on our scoring. Less free wheeling means less scoring opportunities.

Sp what are you saying: if you tighten up the defense you automatically lessen your scoring opportunities? This season, we WERE too one dimensional going forward. Maybe that was due to injuries to key forwards from the previous season (IMO both Aker and Johnno played one season too many, and we missed their goal scoring when their older bodies predictably broke down). Maybe. But I reckon it was a change in the players mindset with Hall now in the forward line.



Now let me get this straight. Grant's article says we didn't win because we weren't good enough. I am not too sure there are many supporters who don't accept that.

I reckon we have supporters who first look at WHO is saying what about us, instead of WHAT it is they are saying and why.



As for his explanation for why we were not good enough, he may be right or wrong. Last year it was because we didn't have a power forward. This year it is supposedly because we played too many veterans and didn't tackle enough. And if we go close next year, it will be something else. It is so easy to be an expert when all you are doing is describing the past. If Grant is so knowledgable why couldn't he win a flag with a team which (if memory serves me right) won 13 games in a row under his tutelage.

Thomas may not have a very endearing personality, but the guy coached one of the lesser AFL clubs and made it two straight prelims and three finals series. More than most of us (indeed more than most AFL coaches) will will ever achieve in football. He's right: We DID play the season with too many veterans. The senior players DIDN'T lead by example with applying tackling pressure in the finals. All valid points he makes. If this came from one of our own, we'd nod and agree.

People have already contrasted the way Malthouse left out established players who weren't performing. We need to be THAT ruthless to take the next step. That means casting a critical eye over the club and players. And if we don't do it, outsiders like Thomas will. Instead we got Eade sounding not too disappointed.



BTW Stefcep, I am happy to hear your opinions on anything Western Bulldogs, but I am not interested in hearing others criticised because they may not share those opinions.

I didn't criticise anyone in particular. Just a point about a culture in many of our supporters-and even the club-that we dismiss outside criticism(and making the hard call)-even when its accurate.

[LostDoggy]

Wow, hammered the “Multipost” button…


Getting a bit sick of this.

Since round 10 (Akers last game for the Dogs) to when the "Flu" hit in round 19:

Lost 2 games by an average of 6 pts

Won 6 games by an average of 63 pts.
"Compounded" my arse!
It was the "Flu" that "Compounded" us.

Round 11: Collingwood
Round 12: Brisbane
Round 13: West Coast (though this one, on a personal note for me, was pretty sweet :))
Round 14: Hawthorn
Round 15: Carlton
Round 16: Port Adelaide
Round 17: Fremantle
Round 18: North Melbourne
Round 19: Adelaide

From those games, we lost to Collingwood and Hawthorn — the Hawks game we were just unlucky, I'll concede. But the only games I'd be happy about in terms of the team progress were the Fremantle game where we showed some pride in the club, and the Adelaide game when we fought it out sick. The rest were against the cellar-dwellers of 2010. Nothing to brag about, really. None of those games improved our perception as finals contenders.


I have read many posts in this forum where people have said words along the line of 'attack the ball and not the man'. Dismissing Thomas as irrelevant or having a grudge is in my opinion missing the point.
Ok, the Ward and Roughead comments are wide of the mark, but its hard not to agree with some of his criticisms of us. Too many on here are quick to defend us with an almost blind faith. I hate Grant Thomas as much as anyone because he has had a penchant for taking pot shots at our club over the last few years, but... he has got some valid points.
I too was unhappy with Eade's upbeat manner in the post match presser. Ross Lyon gave his team an absolute serve at their B&F last year after they lost the GF. We are too nice as a club and our MC (as most would agree on other threads) have shirked taking the hard decisions time and time again... If Josh Fraser played for us, he'd be up to 210 games...
Ghost Dog, although I agree a current team can not be responsible for the history of a club's under performance, it can however adopt an entrenched culture and carry on a cycle of behaviors and expectations, which I believe is what we have done over a long time. The entrenched culture within our club is that we become overly enamored and centered on individuals/personalities rather than the team; we are not harsh enough critics of our own performances; The club is predisposed to take the positive/encouraging line than take a clinical/critical approach. I believe it is these entrenched cultural characteristics that have stunted our ability to truly realise our potential as a club.

I agree 100%. Those who don't learn from history, see it repeated. I don't agree with taking history across that white line come game day, but if the club doesn't pull itself out of that culture we'll never see the light of day, no matter how well we do off-field. Never. Not in a hundred years. It doesn't matter how much we improve on where we were, we need to improve on where the other 15 (and soon 16 and 17) teams are, and be better than them in everything we do.

The motto at the Dogs needs to be: You are here to win. You are here for the team. If you can't hack that, leave.

That said, I do believe the Dogs are getting there, and are on the road to fixing this issue. Unfortunately the best way to fix any corporate culture is led from the top, and perhaps the top guys are just too ingrained to push much harder. Perhaps some new board leadership is needed (I'm talking about a gradual turnover, not an outing of the board) to drive that improvement even further?

The way we dealt with Akermanis, although criticised by external parties, does show that improvement in culture and I take it as a good sign and will retain the faith we're making progress in this area.


And his Club has! One premiership at the time of his writing...yes just like the Bulldogs.:rolleyes:

Before we get all cocky and dig at the Saints for only having one premiership same as us, stop for a minute and compare these two teams. The Saints are at the same level, perhaps even better across the team in general, as last year. They certainly haven't fallen away.

Now compare last Saturday night to 2009's prelim. Yeah — we've dropped away. No other way to look at it. If it's injuries, fine, but we can't see a drop in results as acceptable if we want to be successful.


You can dress it up any way you like. When it comes to the ultimate prize St.Kilda and the Western Bulldogs are neck & neck.

No, we're not. They're playing for the ultimate prize tomorrow, as they did last year. We haven't since ’61.


So what? LAst season we scored more than anyone, we had a spread of goal kickers, and some semblance of system going in to the forward 50. Now we ignore our forwards and just bomb to Barry. The balance is out of kilter: I'd rather Barry kick 50 with the other forwards getting their 2.5 goals per game with the midfielders looking to hit them on the chest like we did 1-2 years ago.

BTW Grant is more or less on the money. I'm sick of us being too precious as supporters to take the cold hard truth.

Hear, Hear! 100% on the money!

We need to strike that balance between faith and support. Have faith they'll get better, support your team, but make damned sure you keep the bastards honest and let them know we expect our faith to be repaid.

If you give your faith away for nothing, what does that say about you?

[comrade]

If you give your faith away for nothing, what does that say about you?

You're Christian?

:D

Jokes aside, good post.

[LostDoggy]

You're Christian?

:D

Jokes aside, good post.

:D Hahahaha.