Beware the Western Bulldogs

[The Coon Dog]

Mike Sheahan - Herald sun - 1 February

THE Western Bulldogs, it seems, are on the nose. That can happen with dogs, of course, but we're talking a more subtle malaise for the AFL breed.

Whether it's in the street, on the beach or at the bar, the Doggies have become the subject of ridicule and scorn.

The broad view is the club's proverbial window of opportunity has closed, is snibbed and barred.

Why?

Article in full... (http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/beware-the-western-bulldogs/story-e6frf9jf-1225997724570)

[LostDoggy]

Goodness, I find it hard to admit that I have to agree with Sheehan for once - OUR TIME IS NOW!!!!!!!:D

[aker39]

Throw in the fallout from an off-field business arrangement involving three players and their respective partners that turned sour and you should get the picture.


What's this about?

Is he referring to the kids play centre?

[Mantis]

Is he referring to the kids play centre?

Yes he is.

There wasn't a whole lot of talking going on between the parties involved.

[LostDoggy]

Ist rule of business is... Never go into business with family. I've seen blood brothers go into business together and come out the other end mortal enemies.

As for the article, Sheehan seems to write one of these articles every year, he enjoys putting the blowtorch on us and deservedly so. He speaks to the idea that it will be a vastly different team that will take the park this year, some established players who missed crucial footy will be fit and also some new blood will help throw the cat amongst the pigeons.

Ward and Higgins will be like having 2 mature age recruits, Wood and Addison really showed their class at the business end and will only get better. Josh Hill could not have presented any worse than he did last year. He looms as a real key player if he can stay fit and switch on. Roughhead, Jones, Grant all showed promise last year and will be expected to take further steps. Cautious about mentioning Cordy, Wallis, Libba and Howard as they are still unproven, however anyone of those could surprise and step up.

Our backline is set in stone and looks super strong, our midfield as always looks elite. Our forward line is our achillies heel and a part of the ground where we need to improve defensively. Hopefully our recruiting over summer has addressed this concern and players are on notice, if you do not chase, defend and tackle, you will not play.


The general consensus was that the list needed a real shake up and it looks like we have got a fairly different side/approach coming into 2011. Insanity is defined as doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different outcome, hopefully 2011 is the year when sanity prevails and we take the next step.

[LostDoggy]

The general consensus was that the list needed a real shake up and it looks like we have got a fairly different side/approach coming into 2011. Insanity is defined as doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different outcome, hopefully 2011 is the year when sanity prevails and we take the next step.

Yes our list is looking good and has had a nice shakeup but i dont think that is the real issue.
We have had a great list for a number of years now but keep falling down against the teams
with the most disciplined zone / flood whatever you want to call it. The Bulldogs / Geelong attacking style is exactly the type of gameplan that this tactic was designed to negate, and unfortunately it has worked spectacularly. It wasnt too long ago we were accounting for the Saints easily. Neither our list nor theirs has changed drastically since then.
Yes injuries played their part last year but unless we are putting a huge amount of energy
this pre season into coming up with a tactical curveball of our own we are only going to see the same result in 2011. This should be the focus of our pre season and Rocket should
be judged on how he responds.

[Mantis]

Yes our list is looking good and has had a nice shakeup but i dont think that is the real issue.

We have had a great list for a number of years now but keep falling down against the teams with the most disciplined zone / flood whatever you want to call it. The Bulldogs / Geelong attacking style is exactly the type of gameplan that this tactic was designed to negate, and unfortunately it has worked spectacularly. It wasnt too long ago we were accounting for the Saints easily. Neither our list nor theirs has changed drastically since then.

Yes injuries played their part last year but unless we are putting a huge amount of energy this pre season into coming up with a tactical curveball of our own we are only going to see the same result in 2011. This should be the focus of our pre season and Rocket should be judged on how he responds.

What would you be suggesting we try and implement into our gameplan?

[stefoid]

Midfield has elite ball winning ability, but disposal overall is not elite.

[LostDoggy]

Midfield has elite ball winning ability, but disposal overall is not elite.

St Kilda and Collingwoods disposal is not elite either but because they are capitalising on turnovers they look like a million bucks on the rebound.

[LostDoggy]

Midfield has elite ball winning ability, but disposal overall is not elite.

As mentioned many times, certain midfielders need to understand their limitations and not extend beyond them, our captain being a prime example.

[Mr.1975]

I'm pretty sure Mike Sheehan has a real soft spot for our Bulldogs. Having said that, he does raise some valid points. Our Improvement needs to come from the Wards, Addisons, a fit Higgins and Cooney etc and the post Johnson era of new blood. Our game plan had become very tired last year and we no answer for the likes of Collingwood, St Kilda and Geelong (where as in previous seasons we had). Some good luck withe injuries, hard work in getting the pill when we don't have it and some heated jockeying for spots in the side throughout the season - hopefully - will add some extra bows to our game and get us a spot in the big dance (Once &If we get there, it will be a whole new ball game)

[mjp]

What would you be suggesting we try and implement into our gameplan?

Interestingly enough, the thing worth doing is supposedly the thing we already do 'excessively' - run forward of the play.

We need to run to attack with the same commitment and cohesiveness that Collingwood ran to defend last season...It will be nearly impossible to do though given that players are criticised as selfish for running forward from u9's onward.

If we are planning on just increasing defensive pressure and replicating Collingwood's zone, then we are in for disappointment.

[LostDoggy]

Interestingly enough, the thing worth doing is supposedly the thing we already do 'excessively' - run forward of the play.

We need to run to attack with the same commitment and cohesiveness that Collingwood ran to defend last season...It will be nearly impossible to do though given that players are criticised as selfish for running forward from u9's onward.

If we are planning on just increasing defensive pressure and replicating Collingwood's zone, then we are in for disappointment.

You've mentioned this a few times MJP, I am really interested in your extended thoughts on this. The general rule is, monkey see monkey do, when someone creates something that works, copy it.

you're saying that we need to byass what Collingwood is doing and find a way of actually counter acting their game plan with something completely different.

Also, you copped a lot of crap for predicting quite strongly that we would struggle the way we did last year, I thought your posts were well balanced and saw through the usual spin, good work.

How do you see us shaping this year, are you more postive about our chances of going further?

[LostDoggy]

It's all up stairs in my opinion, fix that & we can have a genuine chance.

[LostDoggy]

Every year we see articles like this one. Shane Crawford said the same thing last year.

What we need, is a blockbuster game against the top team of the moment, and to smash them to bits Geelong-style. From there, if we can ward off injuries we're set. We need arrogance and supreme confidence, pure and simple.

I see the Bulldogs as a massive flywheel. It takes a lot to get this club off and running, but we do well once the momentum is up.

[Ghost Dog]

Raise the tackle count.
Hope Rocket is able to adapt and try a few new things.

[BulldogBelle]

Mike Sheehan has kicked us too many times when we've been down for me to care too much about his opinion. He has had some good articles in the past, but also some pointless articles stating non-truths about the state of our list during the season.

Should we encounter some great success I surely hope he doesn't plan on joining us for the celebrations!

I am writing this on an iPhone in a rush so it's kind of hard to word it how I mean to.

[mjp]

You've mentioned this a few times MJP, I am really interested in your extended thoughts on this. The general rule is, monkey see monkey do, when someone creates something that works, copy it.



My thoughts are you win by doing something better than anyone else. It might be something innovative (like Hawthorn in 2008) or it might be evolutionary (like Collingwood mashing the St Kilda pressure and Hawthorn zone together last year) but whatever it is, you had better be the best at it. Inside 50 tackles jumped up 50% last year (Saints top in 2009 with 10 / game, Pies top in 2010 with 15 / game - one game against Melbourne they had 20+ in the first quarter)...where is it all going to stop? I just think if our focus is going to be 'better at forward pressure' than anyone we have missed the boat and should instead focus on the next thing.

Everyone is countering the zones in a pretty similar way - hesitate, go out and around basketball style and get the ball to the open side. Of course, if a team can fast-break and get the ball over the back, they try this but it is a difficult strategy to continually use because finding forward targets is hard...the defenders will still outnumber in most cases so they take it away anyway.

Finding a way to get the players pushing at the press/zone in real numbers has not really been tried. Everyone 'holds a couple back' in case there is a turnover, players hang behind the ball for a quarterback style bail-out receive (Lake when he took 20-odd marks last year) etc. If a team is prepared to push forward as quickly and aggressively as the opposition push back though, they might just be onto something.

[Mantis]

Also, you copped a lot of crap for predicting quite strongly that we would struggle the way we did last year, I thought your posts were well balanced and saw through the usual spin, good work.



All things being equal I'm not sure 'mjp' could have predicted that we would run into the injury & illness issues that we did in 2010.

Leading into our rd 20 clash with Geelong we were pretty close to being flag favourites, but we got hit by a virus which by all reports hit us hard and then got clobbered by injuries to key players.

mjp predicted us to finish 5th or 6th from memory, but we were pretty much a top 4 team all season and with a clear run in the medical room we probably would have finished the season off a little better than what we did.

[Cyberdoggie]

Interestingly enough, the thing worth doing is supposedly the thing we already do 'excessively' - run forward of the play.

We need to run to attack with the same commitment and cohesiveness that Collingwood ran to defend last season...It will be nearly impossible to do though given that players are criticised as selfish for running forward from u9's onward.

If we are planning on just increasing defensive pressure and replicating Collingwood's zone, then we are in for disappointment.

I don't think we could ever be Collingwood with the players we have.
I think we do need to apply more pressure in the midfield area. Both defensive pressure and when we have the ball. We are terrible at protecting our team mates. Our midfielders all run away trying to get a receive when we get our hands on it, just allowing the opposition to apply pressure.

The key as you said is our run though. We didn't really have much out of defense last year. We were slow in general and out of the back half we relied on Harbrow to do all the work. When we played our best footy for the year we had Wood, Harbrow, Murphy and Gilbee all providing options out of defence at various times.
While Gilbee didn't have a great year and may be on the tail end of his career, I think we have a few more options this year. Harbrow is gone but Howard looks set to be given some chances, Sherman and Djekurra might be options, and we have drafted some future options in Schofield, Johannissen.
As long as we keep most of the first options runners fit all year then we'll be a much better side.
If we lose Wood and Murphy for example then we'll have to do some major reshuffles to cope.

[mjp]

mjp predicted us to finish 5th or 6th from memory, but we were pretty much a top 4 team all season and with a clear run in the medical room we probably would have finished the season off a little better than what we did.

I think I said we would finish 7th.

My main point pre-season was that trying to add Hall to a forward line already including Hahn, Johnson, Gia, Aker, Hill etc was a bad plan and I think I was right on that. I agree that after Aker was sacked and Hill permanently banished we were playing some pretty impressive footy - then we got hit by injuries to key players.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Still have a lot of areas we need to improve in, most of which has been covered.

Our midfield needs to be much, much better against the top sides. It dominates the teams below us, but struggles to find the balance between containing/attacking against Collingwood, Geelong and St. Kilda. A fit Cooney, Ward and Higgins should improve us - but we need to get the balance right.

I feel we're often intimidated by those three sides. Not in the sense that we're scared, but that we don't believe in ourselves.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

I think I said we would finish 7th.

My main point pre-season was that trying to add Hall to a forward line already including Hahn, Johnson, Gia, Aker, Hill etc was a bad plan and I think I was right on that. I agree that after Aker was sacked and Hill permanently banished we were playing some pretty impressive footy - then we got hit by injuries to key players.

I thought we were pretty ordinary all last year, aside from a handful of games against mediocre opposition. Injuries or not - I think you weren't far off the mark mjp.

How do you us shaping up heading into this season?

[LostDoggy]

All things being equal I'm not sure 'mjp' could have predicted that we would run into the injury & illness issues that we did in 2010.

Leading into our rd 20 clash with Geelong we were pretty close to being flag favourites, but we got hit by a virus which by all reports hit us hard and then got clobbered by injuries to key players.

mjp predicted us to finish 5th or 6th from memory, but we were pretty much a top 4 team all season and with a clear run in the medical room we probably would have finished the season off a little better than what we did.

We were pretty ordinary Mantis, we bullied the teams that we should have and consistantly fell off the mark against genuine top 4 contenders. Our poor run of injuries and bad luck came late in the season and the we had already clearly shown by then that we simply were not up to it. The game against Melbourne in the rain saved us from what could of potentailly been a truly distasterous season.

[Mantis]

We were pretty ordinary Mantis, we bullied the teams that we should have and consistantly fell off the mark against genuine top 4 contenders. Our poor run of injuries and bad luck came late in the season and the we had already clearly shown by then that we simply were not up to it. The game against Melbourne in the rain saved us from what could of potentailly been a truly distasterous season.

Point 1. So how do you define the 'Rhode years' if last year was pretty ordinary?

Pont 2. We had? Leading into our rd 20 clash with Geelong we were 13-6 with 4 of those losses being under 2 goals. Personally I thought we were in a pretty strong position to challenge... you obviously didn't see it that way.

[LostDoggy]

Point 1. So how do you define the 'Rhode years' if last year was pretty ordinary?

Pont 2. We had? Leading into our rd 20 clash with Geelong we were 13-6 with 4 of those losses being under 2 goals. Personally I thought we were in a pretty strong position to challenge... you obviously didn't see it that way.

Last year we were premiership favourites, by that standard we were very ordinary.

We didn't beat any of the sides that mattered and haven't done so in a number of years.

We played scratchy football throughout and barely got it all together at the same time.

[the banker]

The effort in the Preliminary final was a truly courageous one, considering the physical condition of many key members of the team. We have the will, we definitely have the fight. Collingwood and St Kilda's defensive plans prevailed. If the young talent develops and Rocket and the coaching staff get the game plan tweeked to challenge the defensive press, we are a chance again. Luck with injuries is always defining at the serious end of the season. Like Tiger when he was Tiger, lets just get ourselves in a position to challenge in the final round, for us that is September/October action, and with a fit list, we can do it.

[w3design]

Liking the comments on the article- typical arrogant Pie fans.

[Sedat]

The effort in the Preliminary final was a truly courageous one.
Our issue in the last 3 years has not been our effort in the PF (all have been commendable), it has been our complete and utter failure to cope with the increased intensity of finals football in week 1. Our QF's (especially in 09 against a tired and sore opponent ripe for the plucking) have all been appalling, which has pushed us into the tough side of the PF draw every time.

[w3design]

Look I have to agree with an awful lot of what has been said up above.
I think that in a lot of ways we did have a pretty ordinary 2010. But then given we still got to the prelim.
surely that is a pretty basis for ' if we can get our act together the sky is the limit'.

I firmly believe most of the improvement we need must come from within, by that I mean we can not just rely on recruits to bring about our needed improvement. We need our younger/marginal players to really step up now.

The 2010 style increased pressure caused our 'precision game' to fall apart against the best in my opinion.
So it is up to Rocket and co. to find both an alternative plan, plus develop some kind of a forward structure, which to me seemed to be our major weakness last season.

[mjp]

How do you us shaping up heading into this season?

I was really confident at the end of last year that everything was in place for us to push forward - with the development of Grant (let's hope it continues) and Griffen into absolute top liners I believe we match up pretty well with every other side in the competition with regards to legitimate match-winners:

Lake
Cooney
Griffen
Grant
Hall

Our next level group are mostly on the up - it is only really the defensive runners (Gilbee and Hargrave) who seem to have been treading water/going backwards. That is why I have been watching the progress of Howard so closely - we really need him. I understand the coaches think that Schofield looks ready to go which would be an absolute bonus - we need to find a Harbrow replacement as well as a couple to share the load with Gilbee/Shaggy who will probably never again be what they were. Williams, Wood and Morris are obviously good players, but are basically defenders first who don't really offer a lot of run (though even Morris has improved a lot in this area and both of the other two show occasional glimpses).

Basically, I am excited. There will be a lot of competition for spots in areas that I have perceived we have been weak over the last two years - running players (with pace) who are prepared to carry the ball....the coaches are going to have their work cut out getting the mix right but compared to this time last year I am really thinking top 4 and grand-final.

[comrade]

I am really thinking top 4 and grand-final.

http://pictures.pichaus.com/4dc77f464878832516e4f2dc837eba0b24d76d20?AWSAccessKeyId=0K4R ZZKHSB5N2XYJWF02&Expires=1296560000&Signature=JbltB4xFlQGm4b%2FdY8yYr%2FV3bE4%3D

[Maddog37]

More tackling. More aggression at the man in general and great years from coons, grif, ward and Higgins and we are half way there IMO.

[AndrewP6]

http://pictures.pichaus.com/4dc77f464878832516e4f2dc837eba0b24d76d20?AWSAccessKeyId=0K4R ZZKHSB5N2XYJWF02&Expires=1296560000&Signature=JbltB4xFlQGm4b%2FdY8yYr%2FV3bE4%3D

Far out! I nearly died when I saw this post. I was expecting just a still image, and then he starts nodding!!! Freaked me right out. And I'm completely sober. I guess Jack does that to people!:)

[w3design]

Find my self agreeing again with a lot of what MJP is saying. Thought that toward the end of the season we saw a lot of positive signs from Griffo., Grant, Ward and Wood.

Now re our back half, I think Lake, Morris, Williams and Wood pretty much pick them selves. For run and creativity, I would make the other 2 Murphy and Griffin. I am taking it as a given that we are unlikely to see much of Shaggy early in the season.

As for Gilbee I would move him forward one line [ I shall not use the term 'wing' as that seems to give certain people serious indigestion for some reason]. I realise he is not your archetypal speedster, but his experience and precision kicking into the forward line from that much closer could help the forward group, particularly Bazza as he is so often double teamed.

[GVGjr]

I thought we were pretty ordinary all last year, aside from a handful of games against mediocre opposition. Injuries or not - I think you weren't far off the mark mjp.

How do you us shaping up heading into this season?

I'm not sure we were ordinary but in my opinion we never quite got in the groove.
For the better part of the year we were a dangerous side but not a convincing one.

[Before I Die]

I was really confident at the end of last year that everything was in place for us to push forward - with the development of Grant (let's hope it continues) and Griffen into absolute top liners I believe we match up pretty well with every other side in the competition with regards to legitimate match-winners:

Lake
Cooney
Griffen
Grant
Hall

Our next level group are mostly on the up - it is only really the defensive runners (Gilbee and Hargrave) who seem to have been treading water/going backwards. That is why I have been watching the progress of Howard so closely - we really need him. I understand the coaches think that Schofield looks ready to go which would be an absolute bonus - we need to find a Harbrow replacement as well as a couple to share the load with Gilbee/Shaggy who will probably never again be what they were. Williams, Wood and Morris are obviously good players, but are basically defenders first who don't really offer a lot of run (though even Morris has improved a lot in this area and both of the other two show occasional glimpses).

Basically, I am excited. There will be a lot of competition for spots in areas that I have perceived we have been weak over the last two years - running players (with pace) who are prepared to carry the ball....the coaches are going to have their work cut out getting the mix right but compared to this time last year I am really thinking top 4 and grand-final.

Not disagreeing with the overall post, but felt that Wood showed a lot of potential as a defensive runner and from what I read, believed that was also the view of the coaching staff.

[LostDoggy]

I was really confident at the end of last year that everything was in place for us to push forward - with the development of Grant (let's hope it continues) and Griffen into absolute top liners I believe we match up pretty well with every other side in the competition with regards to legitimate match-winners:

Lake
Cooney
Griffen
Grant
Hall

Our next level group are mostly on the up - it is only really the defensive runners (Gilbee and Hargrave) who seem to have been treading water/going backwards. That is why I have been watching the progress of Howard so closely - we really need him. I understand the coaches think that Schofield looks ready to go which would be an absolute bonus - we need to find a Harbrow replacement as well as a couple to share the load with Gilbee/Shaggy who will probably never again be what they were. Williams, Wood and Morris are obviously good players, but are basically defenders first who don't really offer a lot of run (though even Morris has improved a lot in this area and both of the other two show occasional glimpses).

Basically, I am excited. There will be a lot of competition for spots in areas that I have perceived we have been weak over the last two years - running players (with pace) who are prepared to carry the ball....the coaches are going to have their work cut out getting the mix right but compared to this time last year I am really thinking top 4 and grand-final.

I hope you're a little premature in writing off Gilbee. I believe he played overweight last year and from all reports he has fronted a lot lighter which I am hoping will assist him in returning to his high standards.

I see Wood and Murphy providing the run from down back and I expect Murphy to make cameo appearances at CHF in providing a mismatch by replacing Jones for short periods.

Ward and Higgins hopefully will be classified as match-winners and this two added to the list above will provide head-aches for the opposition. A couple of new players to have break-out years will be a bonus and there are a few in the mix including Jones, Howard, Cordy, Roughead, Wallis, Libba, Vezpremi, Sherman etc

Above all else we need to keep pace with the game strategies of the leading teams

[Mofra]

Not disagreeing with the overall post, but felt that Wood showed a lot of potential as a defensive runner and from what I read, believed that was also the view of the coaching staff.
It was a feature of his VFL Play, however he hasn't brought his full bag of tricks to AFL level (yet). On pure athleticism he is an exciting talent, but make take a little time to build the confidence to move from "kid who does a job" to "genuine rebounging weapon".
Still best 22 for me, but he needs more gametime to feel comfortable at the highest leavel and learn how the other guys play, when to run off etc.

[LostDoggy]

I'm not sure we were ordinary but in my opinion we never quite got in the groove.
For the better part of the year we were a dangerous side but not a convincing one.

Sometimes we were pretty ordinary, and yes I agree GVGjr, we never seemed to hit our straps, did we? When I said I agreed with Sheehan's article, I just meant that we have to believe that we aren't gawn and have missed our window, we have to strongly believe OUR TIME IS NOW!!!!

[Mantis]

It was a feature of his VFL Play, however he hasn't brought his full bag of tricks to AFL level (yet). On pure athleticism he is an exciting talent, but make take a little time to build the confidence to move from "kid who does a job" to "genuine rebounging weapon".

Still best 22 for me, but he needs more gametime to feel comfortable at the highest leavel and learn how the other guys play, when to run off etc.

His run & carry was certainly on show in the scratch match I viewed at training on Saturday. He made 2 or 3 very strong runs from defence which resulted in F50 entries so hopefully this can be a feature of his play as his comfort level improves.

[Mofra]

His run & carry was certainly on show in the scratch match I viewed at training on Saturday. He made 2 or 3 very strong runs from defence which resulted in F50 entries so hopefully this can be a feature of his play as his comfort level improves.
Very good news, if he bring this into the season proper it will help cover the loss of Harbrow no end. Sounds like it has been a focus of teh pre-season which should help him.

[mjp]

Not disagreeing with the overall post, but felt that Wood showed a lot of potential as a defensive runner and from what I read, believed that was also the view of the coaching staff.

Runs well with the ball - just doesn't get the ball much. Unless he moves from a 12 possession guy to a 22 possession guy he will never have the impact we are after.

[Cyberdoggie]

His run & carry was certainly on show in the scratch match I viewed at training on Saturday. He made 2 or 3 very strong runs from defence which resulted in F50 entries so hopefully this can be a feature of his play as his comfort level improves.

That's good to hear Mantis, i'd hate to see him limited to a very defensive role and not encouraged to run, as he can certainly do that well.

He looks like he should be fit enough this year to perform in the role, if he can get his confidence up early i think we'll see a big improvement from Wood this year.


How have you seen Gilbee going at training?

As MJP also mentioned i thought he really dropped off last year. Sure he has had some personal issues etc but i can't see how being overweight slightly can effect how you kick the ball. Not only was he often off target (especially kicking at goals), but his kicking seemed to lack penetration. If he loses this unique skill then it really drops him down the list as a footballer.

[Axe Man]

Now re our back half, I think Lake, Morris, Williams and Wood pretty much pick them selves. For run and creativity, I would make the other 2 Murphy and Griffin. I am taking it as a given that we are unlikely to see much of Shaggy early in the season.

You want to take our best performed midfielder from last season and best and fairest winner and put him in the backline?:confused:

Who do you propose will replace Griffen's run and creativity in the midfield?

[BornInDroopSt'54]

The effort in the Preliminary final was a truly courageous one, considering the physical condition of many key members of the team. We have the will, we definitely have the fight. Collingwood and St Kilda's defensive plans prevailed. If the young talent develops and Rocket and the coaching staff get the game plan tweeked to challenge the defensive press, we are a chance again. Luck with injuries is always defining at the serious end of the season. Like Tiger when he was Tiger, lets just get ourselves in a position to challenge in the final round, for us that is September/October action, and with a fit list, we can do it.

This is part of the art of Victory. Thus Spoke Zarathustra.

[Pedro Sanchez]

Great article from a neutral - sign him up to Woof!

[Bulldog Revolution]

Runs well with the ball - just doesn't get the ball much. Unless he moves from a 12 possession guy to a 22 possession guy he will never have the impact we are after.

Could we realistically expect that Wood might develop that much in 2011?

Do you think the coaching staff would be hoping that we have a more balanced rebounding backline with Murphy there full time and Gilbee and Hargrave hopefully bouncing back. Last year it was very reliant on Harbrow and Gilbee, but better when Murphy and Wood were introduced.

If anything Hargrave dropped off more markedly in 2010 after his best season for the club in 2009

And then Wood continuing to emerge alongside Williams

With Howard, and whoever else taking the more juinor role?

Will the new rules also see Griffen actually rotating off half back more?

I would still love another 20 year old Gilbee on the list

[Mantis]

I would still love another 20 year old Gilbee on the list

Isn't that what Tutt is supposed to be.

[bulldogsman]

Isn't that what Tutt is supposed to be.

Thought that was meant to be Howard.

[Bulldog Revolution]

Isn't that what Tutt is supposed to be.

Maybe he is, I've tended to think he is a bit smaller and probably wont spoil as well, Gilbee for his height has generally been a good spoiler

I've tended to view Tutt physically as a Leigh Montagna type,

Its an important pre-season and VFL season for Tutt. He doesn't have to dominate, but he has to show real improvement, but it would be good to see him settle in the backline at senior VFL level, with spells midfield

[Ghost Dog]

I don't think we could ever be Collingwood with the players we have.


Collingwood's list is not really that much superior to ours now. If so, I would like to know how. They have the discipline and the hunger, plus the crowd.
We can beat them on paper. It's all upstairs I reckon.

[Bulldog Joe]

Collingwood's list is not really that much superior to ours now. If so, I would like to know how. They have the discipline and the hunger, plus the crowd.
We can beat them on paper. It's all upstairs I reckon.

I have never believed the Collingwood list is superior. In fact it took the addition of Jolly and Ball to bring them to our standard.

What they had was a superb run with injury that gave them effectively a full list when it mattered. We never got near that in 2010.

[Ovatheboarder]

Collingwood's list is not really that much superior to ours now. If so, I would like to know how. They have the discipline and the hunger, plus the crowd.
We can beat them on paper. It's all upstairs I reckon.

Especially the last line

[BornInDroopSt'54]

Collingwood's list is not really that much superior to ours now. If so, I would like to know how. They have the discipline and the hunger, plus the crowd.
We can beat them on paper. It's all upstairs I reckon.

Agree 100%. It was very impressive how much consistency and improvement that club got out of its list, with Leigh Brown being a classic example. His kicking for goal and hunger for the contest improved out of sight and this was symptomatic of the rest of the list. That would do it for us too.

[Ghost Dog]

I have never believed the Collingwood list is superior. In fact it took the addition of Jolly and Ball to bring them to our standard.

What they had was a superb run with injury that gave them effectively a full list when it mattered. We never got near that in 2010.

Only this? Much as I despise their tactics, cite their Half backs and their use of blocks on man on the mark from behind. Typical collingwood ruthlessness. Harry O'Brien...have to clip his wings this season.

RE their injuries, I'm assume their pockets are so deep they can afford to clone their players by now.

[Remi Moses]

Raise the tackle count.
Hope Rocket is able to adapt and try a few new things.

Agree our tackling has to step up in a major way.I'm always reach for the worry beads when Sheehan jumps on our bandwagon:eek:

[Dry Rot]

RE their injuries, I'm assume their pockets are so deep they can afford to clone their players by now.

Their luck may turn on that this season.