Round #1 - Slaps and Sledges

[GVGjr]

I thought we should restart this again.

For those who aren't familiar:
A slap on the back for a job well done by 2 players. (not to be confused with the Woof Player Awards (http://www.woof.net.au/forum/showthread.php?t=9023))
This can be a passage of player or a spirited effort.

A sledge to a player that let down the team. Try and make this constructive and not overly critical.

[ledge]

Is this just bulldog players?

[LostDoggy]

Slap: Libba (Great debut)
Slap: Picken (Never stops trying)

Sledge: Boyd (No leadership whatsoever)
Sledge: Everybody else from the coaches down

[Remi Moses]

Sledge everyone
What a pathetic lilly limp effort.
So called leaders Pffft
The only positive is Tom Libba .
Everyone knew they'd come out at a million miles an hour,so we just shrivel up and go away!!

F***Ken pathetic

[Sedat]

Apart from Libba's debut, Hill off half back was a positive. Collective lack of defensive intensity from our midfield group the biggest in a long list of sledges.

It's only March - that's also a positive :o

[Maddog37]

Slaps. Ward and Picken hard as nails. Jones got to a few contests and has a future.


Sledges. Not enough hours left in the day to cover all the negatives. Gonna treat this as an aberration and move on.

[Sedat]

Jones got to a few contests and has a future.
Thought he was sub-par to be honest. Couldn't stick any of the marks that he flew for, and his foot skills are not yet up to the level required. Needs a spell at Willy to get some confidence.

[ReLoad]

slaps: Libba and Grant. Libba gave 110% today, and grant did not stop trying, i counted 12 leads made where he was ignored.

Sledge: Match committee going in with one ruckman versus Hille and Ryder.

[Ozza]

Thought he was sub-par to be honest. Couldn't stick any of the marks that he flew for, and his foot skills are not yet up to the level required.

I agree Sedat. I thought Jones was probably our worst performed today. Very disappointing - but hopefully he takes something out of the time he spent with Fletcher manning him.

[SlimPickens]

Sledge- the match committee. One ruckman against Hille and Ryder..... Mind boggling

[LostDoggy]

Sledge- the match committee. One ruckman against Hille and Ryder..... Mind boggling

Agree

Slap to Libba, just a good solid debut, one of the better players.

Sledge to Jones, still not sold on him don't think he offered enough at all, would of been happier to see Minson up there creating a contest :rolleyes:

Essendon fans will be camping out for grand final tickets tonight

[JohnGentStand]

agree with these posts
slaps - libba & merlin
sledge - selection & jones / plenty more sub -pars...

if we can be 50/50 @ round 10 and then bring our form forward ........look out!

[GVGjr]

Slap
Easton Wood for that great run and goal in the first quarter
Tom Libertore for the way he came on and made an impact

Sledge
Jarrad Grant for that missed set shot in the first quarter. C'mon son, we need you to nail them.

[Maddog37]

I agree Sedat. I thought Jones was probably our worst performed today. Very disappointing - but hopefully he takes something out of the time he spent with Fletcher manning him.

I maybe have lower expectations than most. What is he, 19? Playing the hardest position on the ground with Fletcher in the picture and your mid field is getting pumped.

I just thought he at least brought the ball to ground for our crumbers(even though we don't have any). He also kept trying all day when other more senior players looked like they just wanted to go home.

[the banker]

slap : Libba, Grant, (Ward)

sledge: MC, leadership group

[Bulldog Joe]

Sledge- the match committee. One ruckman against Hille and Ryder..... Mind boggling

Amen to that.

If they persist with that as a strategy they will wear Hudson and Williams.

Felt sorry for Tommy - Big enough job as the main tall defender and then asked to run himself into the ground as a ruckman.

It has now been tried in an actual match 3 times for 3 failures.

[LostDoggy]

Sledge: Match committee going in with one ruckman versus Hille and Ryder.

I'll excuse them a little for that one as it our first game with the new sub rule. Huddo was pretty poor today, I think the mc might have overated him.

[GVGjr]

sledge: MC, leadership group

Were you critical of the selections beforehand?

[Dazza]

Slaps - Libba jnr has a bright future. Grant took a few good grabs. Hill performed well.

Sledge - The midfield. We let Essendon dominate us without their best contested player around the stoppages. Worried about Boyd and cross. Seem far too slow albeit up against a very quick bombers side. If the game has gone past them I can't see the match committee making the tough call on either of them.

Defensive pressure. Non existent for large periods of the match.

Decision making. Have the players forgotten what a short kick is? Especially coming out of defence we just blazed away.




VERY VERY frustrating day.

[LostDoggy]

Slaps:

Libba
Grant, Ward, Murphy, Markovic.


Sledges:

The Midfield - Allowed 76 inside fifties and were smashed at contested possession after quarter time. Consistently failed to spread and allowed a young and inexperienced defense to be swamped by unmanned players surging into the Essendon fifty. When they did finally make it into the Bombers' backline they were too slow at moving back out, allowing three on one contests when we were trying to clear the ball from defense.

The Leadership Group - All except Murphy and Cooney (who ran out of puff) did not perform at the level required. With four players playing for the first time in our jumper, the need for a strong example to be set was great and the leaders did not deliver.

The Match Committee - Why would you use your centre half back as the second ruckman when the best full back in the league is on the sidelines and a first game player is the only other tall in your backline?

The Collingwood Football Club - Their success at moving the ball along the boundary line was the inspiration for our ridiculous and one dimensional ball movement in the first half.

The Coaching Staff - See above. It's not really Collingwood's fault. Forcing the ball along the boundary line played into Essendon's zone perfectly. It's ok to kick long to a contest or a throw in, but when your team is being smashed at contested footy it may be time to change track.

The forward line pressure that we spent all summer working on - non existent.

WOOF posters bagging Jones - He's a young key position player with potential. Sometimes he'll make mistakes and even Riewoldt showed on Thursday night that a forward has no chance when repeatedly hitting packs with three opponents on the boundary line. Jones should have had more time in the seniors last year to help him develop but we opted to play older guys who weren't performing instead. We can't do that again this year; he and Roughead must be automatic inclusions in the team this season or we'll be terribly exposed when Hall and Hudson retire.

Wood's injury - A great shame for the player and really bad for the team.

The umpires - Didn't change the result, but they were absolutely bloody awful. Probably added eighteen points to the Bomber's winning margin. Still, they did provide some laughs for us, if nothing else.

[always right]

Agree

Slap to Libba, just a good solid debut, one of the better players.

Sledge to Jones, still not sold on him don't think he offered enough at all, would of been happier to see Minson up there creating a contest :rolleyes:

Essendon fans will be camping out for grand final tickets tonight

Yeah the fleet footed Bomber defenders would have shaken in their boots seeing big Will head their way.

[jazzadogs]

Would have been just as frightening as the rest of our forward pressure.

I give a slap to Libba for a solid debut (first quarter was excellent, kept up his work around the clearances throughout), Markovic was also OK in his first game. Murph had a few good runs, Picken and Ward did their usual crash-and-bash.

Sledges:
- complete lack of forward pressure.
- blind kicking, and when they did try to hit a target it rarely went to their advantage, but instead sat up on their head, prime for spoiling. Probably came down to decision-making as well, picking out the right targets.
- almost complete lack of midfield pressure. Didn't see the final I50 figures, but around 3 qtr time it was 60-30. Horrendous.
- the decision to use Williams in the ruck was ridiculous. Hille was just about BOG, and no wonder. He and Ryder had both had good NAB Cup campaigns, we knew they were a dangerous combo, but we went with one ruck anyway. Christ.
- umpiring was average at best, both ways. Is there a new rule that you can sling people to the ground after they've disposed of the ball?


Just a bad day at the footy really. So many things that I expected the boys to do, they just didn't.

[Greystache]

Slaps:

Libba, Hill, Grant, Markovic

Sledges:

Leadership group- Boyd, Cooney, Cross, Gia, Griffen, almost no contribution and let their opponents run rampant.

[comrade]

Jones can't play next week - he was horrible and his trademark defensive efforts were non-existent

Replace him with a ruckman.

Massive sledge to our kick out strategy. What the hell were we trying to achieve by bombing it to the same spot over and over?

[ratsmac]

slaps - Libba, Murphy, Ward, Picken, Markovic, all these put in all day.

Sledges - The rest of the mob. Decision make was terrible all day, even in the first quarter there were very worrying signs that I thought were just round one nerves - those nerves never left.

The umpires were wonderful for the bombers, never missed a free kick. For us on the other hand turn a blind eye all day. Even pinched a goal of us. We were still soundly beaten in every position on the field, umps were just salt in the wounds.

Special sledge to EFFORT for not showing up, well in red white and blue anyway.


Totally embarrassing...

[LostDoggy]

Yeah the fleet footed Bomber defenders would have shaken in their boots seeing big Will head their way.

Not the point about them being shaken in the boots just think he would have provided a contest.

[AndrewP6]

Welcome back to this thread, but jeez it's hard today.

Slaps: Libba, great signs on debut (embarrassing for the rest that he was arguably our best). Slaps to DJ, who I thought ran hard, tried to take people on and create something.

Sledges: Most of the rest. Abysmal.

Special sledge reserved for the Essendon umpires - no excuse, but they continue on their merry, hapless way.

[the banker]

GVRjn,


While not "critical" of selections I was bewildered by the no Minson/Roughead or even Barlow option. Back structure looked vulnerable without Lake , so why would you stretch a developing player like Williams and rob the back six at the same time? I would have rather them got Tommy concentrating on taking a leading role down back. Stack's selection I was not excited by but willing to wait and see. Hudson is not a 26 yo athlete, but an ageing warhorse. I think they just stretched the entire team with this structural selection. At times during the game we were a rabble. I think the selction had a domino effect with the new players as well, the team seemed very unsettled and at times confused and lacking assuredness. Mine is more a hindsight criticism - is that allowed?

[Maddog37]

It is not only allowed but s the duty of Internet forum posters!!

[Before I Die]

The Coaching Staff - See above. It's not really Collingwood's fault. Forcing the ball along the boundary line played into Essendon's zone perfectly. It's ok to kick long to a contest or a throw in, but when your team is being smashed at contested footy it may be time to change track.


I am an Eade fan and I am certainly not calling for his head, but today I am giving one almighty SLEDGE to the Coaching Panel. As a group they have had all Summer to plan and with Essesndon's extended run in the NAB Cup, plenty of time to study the opposition. Today they got it completely wrong. Our defensive structures, our forward structures, our midfield structures and our overall game plan were all completely ineffectual. I can't accept that it was simply poor execution or that the return of injured players will make all that difference. What I am doing is holding my breath and seeing what happens next.

[Maddog37]

Essendon: Watson, Hille, Hocking, Stanton, Jetta, Melksham, Ryder, Heppell
Western Bulldogs: Hudson, Higgins, Ward, Picken, Markovic



Best players from dogs web page.

[Twodogs]

Western Bulldogs: Hudson, Higgins, Ward, Picken, Markovic

Best players from dogs web page.


Higgins? Shaun Higgins? The one who plays for us? Wearing #7


In the best?


I didnt think he was very good myself.

[G-Mo77]

Slaps.

Libba. What can I say. I'm sold on this kid I'm finally going to get a number on the back of my jumper and it will be #21. It says a lot for the rest of the midfield that a first gamer was our leading contested possession getter. (That was last scoreboard check when I wa sthere)

Grant. I thought he tried his guts out. When the ball hit the deck he always made a good second effort.

Hill I thougth was pretty good as well. I'm known to knock him pretty heavily and probably put him under the microscope but I really couldn't fault much of his game today.

Wood was also a positive across the backline. Gave us some much needed run.

Hudson fought well in the ruck by himself.

I'm not going to sledge, far too many unfortunately.

[LostDoggy]

Best players from dogs web page.




Then the dogs' web page gets a sledge too.

Higgins was in no way near our best.

[LostDoggy]

slaps - J grant good hands, actually held on to marks
Libba - good signs
Ward, Picken tried hard

Sledges- midfield accountability, atrocious, decision making-awful, team selection-sherman a sub?? injury to E wood, topped of the crap day it was! :(

[SonofScray]

SLAP:

Libba, got his hands on the footy enough for a kid on debut. Great to see him bring that ability to the top level. Just butchered it a few too many times for my liking, he probably rushed a lot of his disposals.

Grant, with limited supply he provided many strong contests and took a handful of very good grabs. In terms of receiving the ball he'd have been our best player over the day. Needed to kick a few more.

Cal Ward, pressured hard and put in a very physical shift. Made a few errors which were costly but his effort did not waiver.

SLEDGE:

Liam Jones, just didn't put his best foot forward. Dropped a few sitters and lacked any real intent with his defensive efforts. He'll need to improve rapidly if he is to keep his spot.

Selection panel, Ryder has a good track record against us, Hille does as well. Regardless of Hille's injury status we needed to go in with better ruck options than Huddo and whichever KPP was available at the time. By all reports that approach failed miserably in Ballarat and we saw how it hurt us today. Wilbur or Roughead to replace Jones for mine. I just can't see the Huddo/Williams combo working.

Fumbles, far too many today at crucial moments. Cooney wasn't sharp below his knees at all and across the board we just were not clean with the ball. It killed us.

Essendon, because I despise that Club and the people that follow it.

[LostDoggy]

I agree Sedat. I thought Jones was probably our worst performed today. Very disappointing - but hopefully he takes something out of the time he spent with Fletcher manning him.

Worst performed is pretty harsh. I would put some of the more experienced guys in front of Jones. He is playing one of the toughest positions on the field, playing on a seasoned professional in Fletcher, leading up towards guys bombing it into him, and then as soon as the ball hit the ground, he was always out-numbered as the opposition was working far harder to get to the contest that our guys were.
He needs game time and to get some decent service.
He is an easy target following a loss like that, but i think singling him out as being below par is a touch unfair.

[Bulldog Joe]

GVRjn,


While not "critical" of selections I was bewildered by the no Minson/Roughead or even Barlow option. Back structure looked vulnerable without Lake , so why would you stretch a developing player like Williams and rob the back six at the same time? I would have rather them got Tommy concentrating on taking a leading role down back. Stack's selection I was not excited by but willing to wait and see. Hudson is not a 26 yo athlete, but an ageing warhorse. I think they just stretched the entire team with this structural selection. At times during the game we were a rabble. I think the selction had a domino effect with the new players as well, the team seemed very unsettled and at times confused and lacking assuredness. Mine is more a hindsight criticism - is that allowed?

Absolutely agree about how bad that strategy was and you have identified the domino effect it caused.

While yours may be a hindsight criticism, I did post my objection prior to the game.

[always right]

As much as i agree that the decision to have Hudson go one-out against Hille and Ryder, it didn't have any effect on our inability to win contested ball. We were never going to outrun Essendon but I couldn't believe how esily they won the ball around the stoppages.

On a totally unrelated matter can anyone explain why someone with Cooney's pace and ability constantly kicks to targets out wide rather than take the defenders on and kick to the open goal?

[LostDoggy]

Essendon: Watson, Hille, Hocking, Stanton, Jetta, Melksham, Ryder, Heppell
Western Bulldogs: Hudson, Higgins, Ward, Picken, Markovic



Best players from dogs web page.

OMG I'd better watch the replay coz I can't remember a Higgins playing for us. are you sure he wasn't in Essendons best 38 :rolleyes:

[LostDoggy]

The umpires - Didn't change the result, but they were absolutely bloody awful. Probably added eighteen points to the Bomber's winning margin. Still, they did provide some laughs for us, if nothing else.

Totally agree. 2 goals they gave to bombers and 2 frees we should've got in the 50m arc. Didn't affect the end result, but not a good day for the umpires

[comrade]

OMG I'd better watch the replay coz I can't remember a Higgins playing for us. are you sure he wasn't in Essendons best 38 :rolleyes:

Higgins played and wasn't close to being one of our worst.

[LostDoggy]

Slaps:
Josh Hill, played very well today, hopefully this is a season of real improvement.
Murphy, please, please, please say fit for a full season.
Libba, showed signs that he will be an AFL player, still a lot of improvement to come.
Our backline, thought it held up as best it could, the ball was coming in that often.

Sledges:
Ward, if you're going to get the ball, use it better. 7 clangers in a game of football, just isn't acceptable.
Our midfield, need to get the hands on the pill more & use it better, we seemed to be dominated at the stoppages also.

[bornadog]

Higgins played and wasn't close to being one of our worst.

He wasn't too bad today, considering the ball didn't get into our half of the ground very often. Still picked up 22 posessions, 8 marks, a goal and inside 50 - 4 times.

[soupman]

Slaps:

-Robert Murphy. For the entire match Murphy was almost the only player who consistently tried to run and create and force something to happen.
-Jarrad Grant. Held contested marks, looked to create and just kept working hard for the entire match.
-Tom Liberatore. Looks very impressive. Based on that come round 1 next year I expect him to be well entrenched in our best 22.

Sledges:
-Too many Bulldogs.
-The umpiring.

On the umpiring, is it just me or has the interpretation for holding the ball changed? It seemed today that we got pinged several times despite clearly having no prior opportunity, and whilst the Cooney one could arguably be because he wasn't trying to get rid of it (I'm pretty sure he was though, there were about 4 dogs to 1 Bomber there), the rest I have no idea. The one where Picken grabbed the ball and got tackled to the ground imediately was incredibly confusing.

Also the in the back in Monfries favour was shocking and I still don't know what the goalsquare free was paid for.

[Sedat]

Special sledge to Callan Ward's George Michael inspired (circa 'Careless Whisper') coiffured mop. All he needed was some designer stubble and a crucifix earring and he would have completed the set.

[Ozza]

Worst performed is pretty harsh. I would put some of the more experienced guys in front of Jones. He is playing one of the toughest positions on the field, playing on a seasoned professional in Fletcher, leading up towards guys bombing it into him, and then as soon as the ball hit the ground, he was always out-numbered as the opposition was working far harder to get to the contest that our guys were.
He needs game time and to get some decent service.
He is an easy target following a loss like that, but i think singling him out as being below par is a touch unfair.


Yes, I completely agree that he is a kid playing a tough possie, and that we should expect more from our more senior players. And I'm not potting the kid - or saying he can't play or won't make it.

An earlier poster noted his performance as good - and I disagreed - thats all. I think if we take it purely on face value - he contributed the least and had a poor day.

I'm very very hopeful he will be a good player. I'm very confident he will make it. I just think he lowered his colours today and didn't get involved. Its really not an attack on him - he had a bad day.

[Mofra]

Slap:
Markovic. I was actually very happy with his game, he is nowhere near as slow as his reputation suggests, and keeping Hurley to 2 goals whilst our midfield was decimated was a fantastic effort for a first gamer.
Williams. Took on a rampaging Ryder/Hille and rucked against an avalanche, gets an A for effort.

Sledge:
Entire midfield group. We were the no 1 contested ball side last year, something Eade would have noted coming into the game and worked the gameplan accordingly.
I don't care if we are underdone/trying to peak later in the year - our midfield is supposed to win game on grunt not class, and we were clearly "out-grunted" yesterday.

[Daughter of the West]

Slaps:

-Robert Murphy. For the entire match Murphy was almost the only player who consistently tried to run and create and force something to happen.
-Jarrad Grant. Held contested marks, looked to create and just kept working hard for the entire match.
-Tom Liberatore. Looks very impressive. Based on that come round 1 next year I expect him to be well entrenched in our best 22.


Agreed

Sledges:

Our kick ins. Why, time, time, time and time again, did we bomb long, to a contest that always ended up being three on one, not in our favour? Is it just me, or did everyone kicking in have a look of blind panic as they were setting up?

[LostDoggy]

Slap:
Markovic. I was actually very happy with his game, he is nowhere near as slow as his reputation suggests, and keeping Hurley to 2 goals whilst our midfield was decimated was a fantastic effort for a first gamer.
Williams. Took on a rampaging Ryder/Hille and rucked against an avalanche, gets an A for effort.

Sledge:
Entire midfield group. We were the no 1 contested ball side last year, something Eade would have noted coming into the game and worked the gameplan accordingly.
I don't care if we are underdone/trying to peak later in the year - our midfield is supposed to win game on grunt not class, and we were clearly "out-grunted" yesterday.

Anyone know where i can find stats on that?

[LostDoggy]

I maybe have lower expectations than most. What is he, 19? Playing the hardest position on the ground with Fletcher in the picture and your mid field is getting pumped.

I just thought he at least brought the ball to ground for our crumbers(even though we don't have any). He also kept trying all day when other more senior players looked like they just wanted to go home.

Fletcher showed again what an out-and-out champion he is. He's been playing AFL longer than some of these boys have been born and is still a danger to forwards. Why we insisted on kicking it to him I'll never know… Clapped him off the ground when he came off in the last quarter, mucho respecto.

Slaps: Hill's effort, Libba's game (bottom of the packs, just like the old man), Markovic, Murphy.
Sledges: Match committee, and continually kicking to a contest on the boundary when we were getting smashed there. Doing the same thing again and again, and expecting different results, is the definition of insanity. Every time we tried taking it through the corridor, bad decisions notwithstanding, we did a lot better.

WE'RE NOT BLOODY COLLINGWOOD ROCKET!

[Desipura]

He wasn't too bad today, considering the ball didn't get into our half of the ground very often. Still picked up 22 posessions, 8 marks, a goal and inside 50 - 4 times.

So based on stats you thought Boyd with 24 was one of our best? What if Higgins got most of his possies when the game was over, does that make a difference?

[LostDoggy]

Fletcher showed again what an out-and-out champion he is. He's been playing AFL longer than some of these boys have been born and is still a danger to forwards. Why we insisted on kicking it to him I'll never know… Clapped him off the ground when he came off in the last quarter, mucho respecto.

Slaps: Hill's effort, Libba's game (bottom of the packs, just like the old man), Markovic, Murphy.
Sledges: Match committee, and continually kicking to a contest on the boundary when we were getting smashed there. Doing the same thing again and again, and expecting different results, is the definition of insanity. Every time we tried taking it through the corridor, bad decisions notwithstanding, we did a lot better.

WE'RE NOT BLOODY COLLINGWOOD ROCKET!

And never will be - they're a few classes above us - and based on yesterdays performance, the Dons have now motored on by. Really disappointed and hope it was just "another" aberration. (We seem to have a lot of aberrations at the dogs!)

Slaps: Hill, Liberatore (giddyup, great first game), Murphy

Sledges: Onball brigade, MC.

[Mofra]

Anyone know where i can find stats on that?
I think http://www.pro-stats.com.au/ will give stats if you sign up

[bornadog]

Anyone know where i can find stats on that?

2010

8th in contested possessions
1st in Clearances
1st in first possession
3rd in effective disposals

[LostDoggy]

Sledge Foxel and my eyes, for feeding that puss into my brain yesterday.

Slap James Boags, he always makes those games more tolerable.

Callan Ward's Bouffant! Best head in the AFL, move over Nic Nat!

[G-Mo77]

Callan Ward's Bouffant! Best head in the AFL, move over Nic Nat!

He looks like an unshorn sheep.

[Desipura]

Absolutely agree about how bad that strategy was and you have identified the domino effect it caused.

While yours may be a hindsight criticism, I did post my objection prior to the game.

BJ you were not the only one who was surprised that we did not go in with a 2nd ruckman, I thought Barlow was a certainty given his versatility.

[LostDoggy]

He looks like an unshorn sheep.

How good is it!
Imagine if you could roll that 'do' in with Benny's beard? It would be some sort of hair fueled adonis treat!

[Sockeye Salmon]

Sledge Foxel and my eyes, for feeding that puss into my brain yesterday.

Slap James Boags, he always makes those games more tolerable.

Callan Ward's Bouffant! Best head in the AFL, move over Nic Nat!

If Ward grew a mo he would look like Peter Welsh circa 1975.

[BulldogBelle]

Slaps
Jones for trying all day (see also sledges below).
Grant for playing like a winner (see also sledges below).
Hill, Murphy and Higgins showing a bit of quality play.
Markovic for a reasonably good debut.
Liberatore for a great debut.

Sledges
Jones for dropping all those marks.
Grant for not kicking those 3 goals.
Umpires for giving frees to Essendon when they were not there.
Goal umpire for not allowing Gia's goal that when shown on the replay was clearly there.
MC for making the team rely on just one ruckman and upsetting the team by using Williams, Hall, Jones and Boyd as ruckmen.

[ratsmac]

Slaps
Jones for trying all day (see also sledges below).
Grant for playing like a winner (see also sledges below).
Hill, Murphy and Higgins showing a bit of quality play.
Markovic for a reasonably good debut.
Liberatore for a great debut.

Sledges
Jones for dropping all those marks.
Grant for not kicking those 3 goals.
Umpires for giving frees to Essendon when they were not there.
Goal umpire for not allowing Gia's goal that when shown on the replay was clearly there.
MC for making the team rely on just one ruckman and upsetting the team by using Williams, Hall, Jones and Boyd as ruckmen.

Yep, all of this

[Mantis]

Slaps
Liberatore for a great debut.



After a very good first qtr I thought Libba was poor.

What made his debut great?

[ratsmac]

After a very good first qtr I thought Libba was poor.

What made his debut great?

I think I agree with you, but it was his first game and no senior players were of any support for him. He blazed away with just kicking bombs into the waiting essendon arms a lot of times, but hey, after he would win the contested footy, which he done quite well, he would look up and there were no bulldog players running for him.
I know what you mean, he wasn't 'great', but on a grey stormy day, he was a ray of sunshine.

[Desipura]

After a very good first qtr I thought Libba was poor.

What made his debut great?
7 clearances in the first qtr when things were tight was a great effort.
The game was over in the 3rd (really by half time) so he still was very good

[strebla]

Slaps
Hill -thought his work down back kept us alive
Markovic -great job worked hard all day
Williams - was asked to lead the backline did it all day
Libba-good debut needs work on disposal
Grant - tried all day

Sledges
I am not really a sledger but I thought our leaders were as poor as I have ever seen at the club Murphy busted his arse all day but a certain player had better start putting his body on the line for this club because I am running out of patience!!!!

[The Coon Dog]

but a certain player had better start putting his body on the line for this club because I am running out of patience!!!!

The same certain player who's a habitual scapegoat? The one who sets up more goals than anyone in the league, the one, who but for a goal umpiring mistake would have kicked 3 goals on Sunday?

[strebla]

The same certain player who's a habitual scapegoat? The one who sets up more goals than anyone in the league, the one, who but for a goal umpiring mistake would have kicked 3 goals on Sunday?

Yes Coon Dog THAT player I watched the game again in the cold light of day and was just as disapointed as I was on Sunday.He was not the only leader at the club to have a shocker either BTW but he really let himself and the supporters down in MY opinion FWIW I have always liked him and have never bagged him he just really pissed me off on Sunday (he wasn't the only one either).

[Mofra]

The same certain player who's a habitual scapegoat?
You're surprised? Richmond supporters show more class than us sometimes.

[Greystache]

The same certain player who's a habitual scapegoat? The one who sets up more goals than anyone in the league, the one, who but for a goal umpiring mistake would have kicked 3 goals on Sunday?

Essendon clearly targeted that player on Sunday, they know he prefers to hang back from a contest and receive a clearance from a team mate, even if that team mate is outnumbered. His direct opponent specifically left him to go third man up against a marking forward and it was very effective, they also directed a lot of rebound through his direct opponent (usually Dempsey) to expose him defensively. There was worrying signs on Sunday for him, it will be interesting to see if teams are going to look to target him this season. Will opportunistic goals outweigh structural weaknesses?

[bornadog]

After a very good first qtr I thought Libba was poor.

What made his debut great?

Not many 18 year olds pick up that many possessions and especially clearances in their first game.

Yes he died in the second half but hey he doesn't have the motor yet. One area he has to improve on and that is don't slam the ball on to your foot and kick it to just anyone, find a target.

[Mofra]

Yes he died in the second half but hey he doesn't have the motor yet. One area he has to improve on and that is don't slam the ball on to your foot and kick it to just anyone, find a target.
It's not that easy at the bottom of a pack - a quick clearing kick followed by a chase can normally result in an inside 50.
We had 35 clearances for the match, and Libba had 7 of them (most/all to quarter time). The kid's a machine.

[bornadog]

It's not that easy at the bottom of a pack - a quick clearing kick followed by a chase can normally result in an inside 50.
We had 35 clearances for the match, and Libba had 7 of them (most/all to quarter time). The kid's a machine.

Actually he had 8 clearances and 11 contested possessions, not bad at 18.

[The Pie Man]

Actually he had 8 clearances and 11 contested possessions, not bad at 18.

And 19 touches for the game when the most anyone on our list could muster were mid-twenties on the day.

[Greystache]

Not many 18 year olds pick up that many possessions and especially clearances in their first game.

Yes he died in the second half but hey he doesn't have the motor yet. One area he has to improve on and that is don't slam the ball on to your foot and kick it to just anyone, find a target.

Against North Melbourne in Ballarat he was actually really good in this area. A couple of times he got the ball in traffic and kicked a dinky little chip 20m and found a team mate in open space and they were away. He bombed away on Sunday, but given our total lack of spread there wasn't too many other options. I think it'll take him a few weeks to adjust to the speed, but I don't think it will be a weakness.

[Go_Dogs]

Against North Melbourne in Ballarat he was actually really good in this area. A couple of times he got the ball in traffic and kicked a dinky little chip 20m and found a team mate in open space and they were away. He bombed away on Sunday, but given our total lack of spread there wasn't too many other options. I think it'll take him a few weeks to adjust to the speed, but I don't think it will be a weakness.

Agree with that. He's going to be a seriously good player.

[LostDoggy]

Essendon clearly targeted that player on Sunday, they know he prefers to hang back from a contest and receive a clearance from a team mate, even if that team mate is outnumbered. His direct opponent specifically left him to go third man up against a marking forward and it was very effective, they also directed a lot of rebound through his direct opponent (usually Dempsey) to expose him defensively. There was worrying signs on Sunday for him, it will be interesting to see if teams are going to look to target him this season. Will opportunistic goals outweigh structural weaknesses?



An accurate post, Greystache. That sums up his game on Sunday well.

I'm not too worried though. Outside players always end up looking the worst when the inside players get smashed. It's true that he was caught downhill on too many occasions, but there were fifteen guys out there who, through a combination of poor structure, work ethic and fitness, were caught repeatedly out of position.

We started the year with a train wreck but we can recover. It will take until Round 5 to develop an understanding of where an individual's form is at. If Gia's form then is the same as it was on Sunday then he will be visiting Williamstown (regardless of a couple of goals), but the same is true for a lot of his teammates, many of whom are also in our Leadership Group.

I suspect that the team will improve across the board and that Gia's contributions will improve with them.

It seems like the Giansiracusa debate has been popping up all over WOOF for the past month. Some posters are really quite passionate about it (Mofra's supercilious nonsense about us having less class than Richmond supporters comes to mind) but I am really not.

Is he in our best 22? Absolutely.

When he's in form, is he any good? Absolutely. In fact he's much better than that.

Is he a superstar? Nope. He's just a good forward flanker. An excellent decision maker with good skills.

Is he always in form? No. He's a form player. We've got a few of them on our list.

Is he getting more consistent? Yes.

When he's out of form is criticism of him justified? Sure. When his work rate drops off it is very noticeable.

Has his output in finals been satisfactory? No, not yet. If he could go through the 2011 finals series like Bob Murphy did in 2010 then it would be very good for him and even better for us.

Is he soft? He's not Liam Picken, but he doesn't shirk a contest when it's his time to go. He's an outside player so fans will always be more inclined to speculate on his hardness but teams need balance; a team full of Daniel Crosses would lose just as badly as a team full of Daniel Giansiracusas. He does, however, play in one of the worst defensively minded forward lines in the AFL, so he needs to be more accountable this year.

Is he the adopted son of Rodney Eade? It's a chance. My one problem with Gia isn't his fault at all. Over the years when his form has waned he has never been required to find form at Williamstown (but Rocket does play his favourites to our detriment) and his Best and Fairest result last year was clearly too high. He must be a bloody good guy around the club to have that much respect, but I wonder whether he'd have more respect from his detractors if he was treated the same as others by the Coach?

[Desipura]

The same certain player who's a habitual scapegoat? The one who sets up more goals than anyone in the league, the one, who but for a goal umpiring mistake would have kicked 3 goals on Sunday?

I'm not having a go, just wondering what did his opponent do?

[BulldogBelle]

After a very good first qtr I thought Libba was poor.

What made his debut great?

Oh deary me, deary, deary me.

His debut first quarter was great. He did OK for the rest of the game. I generally watch the replay of each game about 3 to 4 times. Its difficult to understand how people didn't notice Higgins. Suffered through two ...

Wait on, I just woke up - you are just having a dig!

Crafty devil you.:)

[LostDoggy]

Essendon clearly targeted that player on Sunday, they know he prefers to hang back from a contest and receive a clearance from a team mate, even if that team mate is outnumbered. His direct opponent specifically left him to go third man up against a marking forward and it was very effective, they also directed a lot of rebound through his direct opponent (usually Dempsey) to expose him defensively. There was worrying signs on Sunday for him, it will be interesting to see if teams are going to look to target him this season. Will opportunistic goals outweigh structural weaknesses?

Slap - Libba, Markovic, Grant

Slap - Didj did a couple of good things also. Jones tried but seems to need at least another year. Do we persist or play Roughead? Tough call...

Sledge - the entire midfield (except libba/ward in parts) who also prefered to hang back from the contest and recieve a cleareace from a team mate per above. Do we have any good inside players? Boyd and Cross were horribly slow.

Sledge - WTF happened to tackling and shepparding? Send in Skinner for forward pressure alone! Again - might help player above...

Sledge - Trainers who I've seen consistently allowing the players to kick sloppy returns to them when practicing marking at WO. Every kick needs to be directed at a target in practice as we are getting increasingly sloppy on game day.

:confused:

[Ozza]

Essendon clearly targeted that player on Sunday, they know he prefers to hang back from a contest and receive a clearance from a team mate, even if that team mate is outnumbered. His direct opponent specifically left him to go third man up against a marking forward and it was very effective, they also directed a lot of rebound through his direct opponent (usually Dempsey) to expose him defensively. There was worrying signs on Sunday for him, it will be interesting to see if teams are going to look to target him this season. Will opportunistic goals outweigh structural weaknesses?

Would you prefer Gia to have gone up as well? One of our main problems on the weekend was that we had two or three players fly in contests and nobody at ground level.

When we only have 35 inside 50s...and Gia is playing forward for the entire day...playing in the forward pocket can be a tough job. The fact that he found 2 goals (and really 3 but for an umpiring mistake) says to me that he wasn't THAT bad considering the unfavourable conditions for Bulldog forwards.

I understand the points about Dempsey getting off him a few times - but am not that convinced he was 'clearly targeted'.

[Greystache]

Would you prefer Gia to have gone up as well? One of our main problems on the weekend was that we had two or three players fly in contests and nobody at ground level.

When we only have 35 inside 50s...and Gia is playing forward for the entire day...playing in the forward pocket can be a tough job. The fact that he found 2 goals (and really 3 but for an umpiring mistake) says to me that he wasn't THAT bad considering the unfavourable conditions for Bulldog forwards.

I understand the points about Dempsey getting off him a few times - but am not that convinced he was 'clearly targeted'.

Yes, he should have on occasion if for no other reason than to make him less predictable. The moment the ball went in the air his opponent knew he had free reign to go up and clear. He's a permanent forward, I can't believe we wouldn't rehearse Hall or Jones bodying their opponent slightly away from the ball to allow a smaller target a free run at it, yet I've never seen it done with Gia.

I watch Essendon a lot and I'm certain they targeted him, because he was seen as predictable and exploitable. I'm certain Hird and Thompson would've said before the game if he happens to poach a couple of goals but his opponent can give us an extra defender to help out on Hall, and we can rebound through them, then it's a win for us.

We were horrible across the board so it's not as if it cost us the game, I just fear we've got a number of very predictable and exploitable senior players, (Cross, Boyd, Gia) and I'm not sure how much we're going to do about it.

[Desipura]

Yes, he should have on occasion if for no other reason than to make him less predictable. The moment the ball went in the air his opponent knew he had free reign to go up and clear. He's a permanent forward, I can't believe we wouldn't rehearse Hall or Jones bodying their opponent slightly away from the ball to allow a smaller target a free run at it, yet I've never seen it done with Gia.

I watch Essendon a lot and I'm certain they targeted him, because he was seen as predictable and exploitable. I'm certain Hird and Thompson would've said before the game if he happens to poach a couple of goals but his opponent can give us an extra defender to help out on Hall, and we can rebound through them, then it's a win for us.

We were horrible across the board so it's not as if it cost us the game, I just fear we've got a number of very predictable and exploitable senior players, (Cross, Boyd, Gia) and I'm not sure how much we're going to do about it.

The pies definitely targeted Gia by playing Shaw on him, ran off Gia on many occasions to set up play. The opposition will gladly let Gia have a goal or 2 compared to the number of rebounds Shaw gave them that day.
It's not just about how many goals you kick(unless it's a bag)

[Ghost Dog]

An accurate post, Greystache. That sums up his game on Sunday well.

I'm not too worried though. Outside players always end up looking the worst when the inside players get smashed. It's true that he was caught downhill on too many occasions, but there were fifteen guys out there who, through a combination of poor structure, work ethic and fitness, were caught repeatedly out of position.

We started the year with a train wreck but we can recover. It will take until Round 5 to develop an understanding of where an individual's form is at. If Gia's form then is the same as it was on Sunday then he will be visiting Williamstown (regardless of a couple of goals), but the same is true for a lot of his teammates, many of whom are also in our Leadership Group.

I suspect that the team will improve across the board and that Gia's contributions will improve with them.

It seems like the Giansiracusa debate has been popping up all over WOOF for the past month. Some posters are really quite passionate about it (Mofra's supercilious nonsense about us having less class than Richmond supporters comes to mind) but I am really not.

Is he in our best 22? Absolutely.

When he's in form, is he any good? Absolutely. In fact he's much better than that.

Is he a superstar? Nope. He's just a good forward flanker. An excellent decision maker with good skills.

Is he always in form? No. He's a form player. We've got a few of them on our list.

Is he getting more consistent? Yes.

When he's out of form is criticism of him justified? Sure. When his work rate drops off it is very noticeable.

Has his output in finals been satisfactory? No, not yet. If he could go through the 2011 finals series like Bob Murphy did in 2010 then it would be very good for him and even better for us.

Is he soft? He's not Liam Picken, but he doesn't shirk a contest when it's his time to go. He's an outside player so fans will always be more inclined to speculate on his hardness but teams need balance; a team full of Daniel Crosses would lose just as badly as a team full of Daniel Giansiracusas. He does, however, play in one of the worst defensively minded forward lines in the AFL, so he needs to be more accountable this year.

Is he the adopted son of Rodney Eade? It's a chance. My one problem with Gia isn't his fault at all. Over the years when his form has waned he has never been required to find form at Williamstown (but Rocket does play his favourites to our detriment) and his Best and Fairest result last year was clearly too high. He must be a bloody good guy around the club to have that much respect, but I wonder whether he'd have more respect from his detractors if he was treated the same as others by the Coach?

Agree with all of above. It was such a convincing loss however that it comes down to this. Gia, as you posted, belongs in our best 22, but he just doesn't actually his hands on the ball enough to make the most of his skills.

[Ghost Dog]

I just fear we've got a number of very predictable and exploitable senior players, (Cross, Boyd, Gia) and I'm not sure how much we're going to do about it.

^^ This

[Mofra]

It seems like the Giansiracusa debate has been popping up all over WOOF for the past month. Some posters are really quite passionate about it (Mofra's supercilious nonsense about us having less class than Richmond supporters comes to mind) but I am really not.
You can call it "superfluous nonsence" but he has been unfairly potted for years on this forum - if you have a problem with someone standing up for a player who is the nominated scapegoat, so be it.

[ratsmac]

We were horrible across the board so it's not as if it cost us the game, I just fear we've got a number of very predictable and exploitable senior players, (Cross, Boyd, Gia) and I'm not sure how much we're going to do about it.

Agreed, but what can be done about it. Do we have the depth to drop any of these out of the 22. No, I don't think so right now. Well you can't exactly drop Boyd now can we. Although I feel that do think he is trying to be a player that he's not. We need him to get the ball out to the outside runners (like Gia) and put blocks and shephards on to clear the path for these fast running good ball user types, but he seems to be trying to do it all himself. He must stay within his limitations. He's very good at what he does best.

Cross may be slow but we need him. He can be unaccountable sometimes, but he wins a lot of the footy. He just needs to work on his disposal as usual.

Well Gia just needs to work harder and the rest will follow. He a very smart footballer that can be lazy at times.

Last Sunday was a debacle, so lets hope we move on from that. And I think that if Eade has too long to prepare for a game he stuffs up the game plan too. So we have to get better this week.

[Sockeye Salmon]

You can call it "superfluous nonsence" but he has been unfairly potted for years on this forum - if you have a problem with someone standing up for a player who is the nominated scapegoat, so be it.

Mofra is spot on the money. Our supporters are probably the most disloyal in the league.

[Ghost Dog]

Mofra is spot on the money. Our supporters are probably the most disloyal in the league.

?? Just because people are overly critical of one player?
Gia deserves a cheer and he'll come good. Any player like him, with his professional attitude, will be burning to get back on the park after last weeks drubbing.

[Greystache]

Mofra is spot on the money. Our supporters are probably the most disloyal in the league.

:confused:

A team with one premiership, who's never finished on top of the ladder, that hasn't made a grand final in 50 years, and in fact hasn't even beaten a contender in a final in that time yet still had 35,000 paid up members last year has the most disloyal supporters in the league???

I can't even begin to work that one out.

Barring Freo every club in the AFL has played in a grand final bar the Bulldogs in the past 30 years, and excluding Richmond the past 15 years. The fact we still have so many supporters is a testament to the loyalty our supporters show.

[LostDoggy]

?? Just because people are overly critical of one player?


Try a few more than one. Stack was blamed on Sunday.

[Maddog37]

Mofra is spot on the money. Our supporters are probably the most disloyal in the league.



That is insulting. Prove it.

[LostDoggy]

It seems like the Giansiracusa debate has been popping up all over WOOF for the past month. Some posters are really quite passionate about it (Mofra's supercilious nonsense about us having less class than Richmond supporters comes to mind) but I am really not.







You can call it "superfluous nonsence" but he has been unfairly potted for years on this forum - if you have a problem with someone standing up for a player who is the nominated scapegoat, so be it.




If I have a problem Mofra, it is with you misconstruing my post.


Supercilious means behaving as though one thinks he is superior to others. The suggestion that those who disagree with you on a player's worth means that, as an entire supporter base, we are worse than Richmond supporters (or the worst in the AFL for God's sake) is, in my opinion, an excellent example of superciliousness. How dare they not be as righteous as you? I think that that's nonsense.

Superfluous means unnecessary. I'd never be so rude as to suggest that an opinion on WOOF is unnecessary or unwanted (even those opinions that I strongly disagree with on topics I think are of more importance than the Giansiracusa debate). I like reading about issues from different perspectives.


I've no problem at all with you writing to defend a player; I just didn't care for the manner in which you chose to do it. But like I said in my original post, this issue does seem to arouse the passions in some people.

[LostDoggy]

:confused:

A team with one premiership, who's never finished on top of the ladder, that hasn't made a grand final in 50 years, and in fact hasn't even beaten a contender in a final in that time yet still had 35,000 paid up members last year has the most disloyal supporters in the league???

I can't even begin to work that one out.

Barring Freo every club in the AFL has played in a grand final bar the Bulldogs in the past 30 years, and excluding Richmond the past 15 years. The fact we still have so many supporters is a testament to the loyalty our supporters show.


Well said.

[EasternWest]

Try a few more than one. Stack was blamed on Sunday.

Who blamed Stack? Most people critical of Stack made it clear that he was in no way responsible for the loss. Way to make something up.

[ratsmac]

Who blamed Stack? Most people critical of Stack made it clear that he was in no way responsible for the loss. Way to make something up.

Nah it was definitely Stack's fault we lost on Sunday.

[bornadog]

Nah it was definitely Stack's fault we lost on Sunday.

Stack, Hargrave and Gia's fault, oh wait Eageleton must have had something to do with it:D

[AndrewP6]

Stack, Hargrave and Gia's fault, oh wait Eageleton must have had something to do with it:D

I'm blaming Judas and Wallet.

[Mantis]

Stack, Hargrave and Gia's fault, oh wait Eageleton must have had something to do with it:D

Who's fault was it?

[LostDoggy]

The midfields...

[LostDoggy]

Who blamed Stack? Most people critical of Stack made it clear that he was in no way responsible for the loss. Way to make something up.

Have a look at the match thread, one of the first players mentioned. No one has said any one player was responsilble, thats not the argument. Instead of accusing people of making stuff up maybe check yourself next time.

[Mofra]

If I have a problem Mofra, it is with you misconstruing my post.


Supercilious means behaving as though one thinks he is superior to others. The suggestion that those who disagree with you on a player's worth means that, as an entire supporter base, we are worse than Richmond supporters (or the worst in the AFL for God's sake) is, in my opinion, an excellent example of superciliousness. How dare they not be as righteous as you? I think that that's nonsense.

Superfluous means unnecessary. I'd never be so rude as to suggest that an opinion on WOOF is unnecessary or unwanted (even those opinions that I strongly disagree with on topics I think are of more importance than the Giansiracusa debate). I like reading about issues from different perspectives.

I've no problem at all with you writing to defend a player; I just didn't care for the manner in which you chose to do it. But like I said in my original post, this issue does seem to arouse the passions in some people.
I apologise for the misconstruing of your original sentiment, but in no way do I think the criticism targeted towards Gia over the years on this forum is anywhere near balanced.
Balanced opinion is fine, but I will stand up for any player if they are the target of a witchhunt.

Do you honestly think he gets a fair run of opinion compared to other players?

Fact is, there are a few players who are unfairly targeted in any loss, either online or at the game and I do not recall any other club holding such vitriol towards one of their own. Tambling at Richmond and RoJo at WCE come close, but I think we edge them out.

In any case, if you believe you would "never be so rude as to suggest that an opinion on WOOF is unnecessary or unwanted", why are you taking offence at my opinion?

[EasternWest]

Try a few more than one. Stack was blamed on Sunday.


Have a look at the match thread, one of the first players mentioned. No one has said any one player was responsilble, thats not the argument. Instead of accusing people of making stuff up maybe check yourself next time.

Sorry I misread the part where you said "Stack was blamed on Sunday". Then you contradict yourself by saying "no one said any one player was responsible".

So which one is it? Maybe you should check yourself? I stand by my original statement.

[the banker]

Mofra is spot on the money. Our supporters are probably the most disloyal in the league.

Is thsi statement disloyal?

[LostDoggy]

Sorry I misread the part where you said "Stack was blamed on Sunday". Then you contradict yourself by saying "no one said any one player was responsible".

So which one is it? Maybe you should check yourself? I stand by my original statement.

? You came out with the 'responsible for the loss' stuff not me.
We are talking about over criticised players

[EasternWest]

? You came out with the 'responsible for the loss' stuff not me.
We are talking about over criticised players

Eh, those two quotes are yours. Other people can figure out if they think "blamed" and "responsible" are different. It's semantics to me.

I stand by my original statement.

[LostDoggy]

Eh, those two quotes are yours. Other people can figure out if they think "blamed" and "responsible" are different. It's semantics to me.

I stand by my original statement.

No worries you read it the way you want.

[EasternWest]

No worries you read it the way you want.

And you too read it the way you want. You always do anyway.

[LostDoggy]

And you too read it the way you want. You always do anyway.

If you are saying I wrote it and then I know what I wanted to say.
I know you like to troll so maybe you should take the advice you were given last time you did it.

[EasternWest]

If you are saying I wrote it and then I know what I wanted to say.
I know you like to troll so maybe you should take the advice you were given last time you did it.

I dont even understand the first sentence.

As to the second, well, that's been squared away with the people that matter; ie not you.

I'm done here.

[Desipura]

Mofra is spot on the money. Our supporters are probably the most disloyal in the league.

Thats nonsense, our supporters are the most sensitive. Constructive opinions are given yet some take that as having a pot shot.

[Ghost Dog]

thats nonsense, our supporters are the most sensitive. Constructive opinions are given yet some take that as having a pot shot.

this ^^

[LostDoggy]

In any case, if you believe you would "never be so rude as to suggest that an opinion on WOOF is unnecessary or unwanted", why are you taking offence at my opinion?




Just because I think everyone is entitled to post their opinions doesn't mean I have to agree with them, does it?

And just because I thought your post was rubbish doesn't mean it offended me in any way.


Back to Gia, when he plays well he deserves praise and well he plays poorly he deserves criticism. Do some among us see only his errors and never his good moments? Absolutely. Do some among us perform the role of Defenders of the Faith and defend him despite justified criticism? Absolutely.

Does either group here on WOOF justify sweeping statements about our entire support group? I wouldn't have thought so.

To suggest that he is the most criticised player by his own supporter group in the AFL is laughable. It's a big league out there; you may not have noticed, but Gia has quite a few fans. If you sat with fans of another club each week and post on their forums you might have formed exactly the same opinion about them.

[Greystache]

To suggest that he is the most criticised player by his own supporter group in the AFL is laughable. It's a big league out there; you may not have noticed, but Gia has quite a few fans. If you sat with fans of another club each week and post on their forums you might have formed exactly the same opinion about them.

Absolutely. I sit with Essendon supporters regularly and the abuse they give to Stanton week after week pales anything Giansiracusa cops into insignificance. Yet compared to Adam McPhee, Stanton is practically a crowd favourite.

Tom Murphy at Hawthorn- Gia x5

Jarrod Oakley-Nichols at Richmond- Gia X50

[LostDoggy]

Jordan Russell at Carlton used to cop it terribly. Most Blues supporters I know would have gladly run over him with a car a couple of years ago.

He's done very well to move from universally hated to mildly disliked.

[LostDoggy]

Absolutely. I sit with Essendon supporters regularly and the abuse they give to Stanton week after week pales anything Giansiracusa cops into insignificance. Yet compared to Adam McPhee, Stanton is practically a crowd favourite.

Tom Murphy at Hawthorn- Gia x5

Jarrod Oakley-Nichols at Richmond- Gia X50

Sorry but Gia is easily better than all of those

[Greystache]

Sorry but Gia is easily better than all of those

So what?

Is is abusing one of your teams players week after week ok so long as you don't rate them? Which way do you want it?

[LostDoggy]

So what?

Is is abusing one of your teams players week after week ok so long as you don't rate them? Which way do you want it?
No Abusing any of your own players is bad and doing to one thats actually good (almost 200 game) player is even worse.

[Greystache]

No Abusing any of your own players is bad and doing to one thats actually good (almost 200 game) player is even worse.

Also McPhee had won a B&F and been All Australian, Gia's done neither. (meant to put that in the previous post)

[LostDoggy]

Also McPhee had won a B&F and been All Australian, Gia's done neither. (meant to put that in the previous post)
Never sure how McPhee got AA, he won the B&F when they were crap and I doubt they were bagging him at the time anyway.

[mjp]

Never sure how McPhee got AA, he won the B&F when they were crap and I doubt they were bagging him at the time anyway.

Freo supporters hate him as well, but he was very important in them winning last Saturday night.

[Ghost Dog]

Jordan Russell at Carlton used to cop it terribly. Most Blues supporters I know would have gladly run over him with a car a couple of years ago.

He's done very well to move from universally hated to mildly disliked.

Andrew Walker says hello.
Few Blues fans very disappointed we didn't pick him up.

[Mofra]

No Abusing any of your own players is bad and doing to one thats actually good (almost 200 game) player is even worse.
Nail. Hammer. Head.

I hate hearing our own players being abuse by our own "supporters", and if that abuse appears to border on witchhunt status I wont apologise for expressing that sentiment.

I guess we all have different ways of barracking - some cheer, some abuse. Life goes on.