Enough.

[mjp]

Rant warning.

Are we supporters or aren't we?

We have played ONE game - ONE - and I have read in multiple posts that basically everyone in our leadership group needs to be banished to Williamstown never to be seen again, that the players are simply not up to it and that they never were. And the coaches are all either dumb or incompetent.

Before we all get carried away, it is still MARCH. The players we were planning to see us through the season - and yes, I am talking about Hudson, Cross, Boyd and Gia - did not perform well against Essendon. But we are talking about a couple of regular top 5 finishers in the B&F, our best contested ball winning ruckman in my memory and the competition leader in goal assists in 2010. Can we all just settle down for a second and back our team in? Can we back the leaders of the group to turn it around?

Further, the members of the MC are apparently all stupid and unable to:
- Pick a side
- Establish a game style
- Implement that game style.

Well, that might be so but we have finished in the top 4 for the last few years so they might not be all that bad. Let's give them the benefit of the doubt for just a minute or two and see what they come up with.

I am all for debating the team and the players and the selection policy and whatever, but continually bagging our leaders, calling for Boyd (one game as captain - ONE) to be dropped, for Cross to be dropped, for Gia to be dropped whilst at the same time asking for Skinner/Schofield/Wallis/Dalhous etc to be promoted....give me a break. It simply is not going to happen. Firstly, only dreamers pick kids. Secondly, even dreamers would want them to play a couple of senior games of VFL footy first. Thirdly, it is only MARCH and we have played one game. Calling for the captain to be dropped after one week is just agitating without purpose.

I know there is no disappointment without expectation - and that is why we are all disappointed...but a heap of us picked Essendon to inflict our first loss of the year in the time capsule thread...so why all the hand-wringing now???

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Amen to that.

The point of differene between this place and others, was that here collectively, stimulating debate here was the norm, even when we were performing bad.

I really would find it disheartening were this to be replaced by keyboard hero bagging of players, cheap shots, inane and constant venting and hyperbole.
Leave that to be the exclusive domain of other forums.

[Scraggers]

Rant warning.

Are we supporters or aren't we?

We have played ONE game - ONE - and I have read in multiple posts that basically everyone in our leadership group needs to be banished to Williamstown never to be seen again, that the players are simply not up to it and that they never were. And the coaches are all either dumb or incompetent.

Before we all get carried away, it is still MARCH. The players we were planning to see us through the season - and yes, I am talking about Hudson, Cross, Boyd and Gia - did not perform well against Essendon. But we are talking about a couple of regular top 5 finishers in the B&F, our best contested ball winning ruckman in my memory and the competition leader in goal assists in 2010. Can we all just settle down for a second and back our team in? Can we back the leaders of the group to turn it around?

Further, the members of the MC are apparently all stupid and unable to:
- Pick a side
- Establish a game style
- Implement that game style.

Well, that might be so but we have finished in the top 4 for the last few years so they might not be all that bad. Let's give them the benefit of the doubt for just a minute or two and see what they come up with.

I am all for debating the team and the players and the selection policy and whatever, but continually bagging our leaders, calling for Boyd (one game as captain - ONE) to be dropped, for Cross to be dropped, for Gia to be dropped whilst at the same time asking for Skinner/Schofield/Wallis/Dalhous etc to be promoted....give me a break. It simply is not going to happen. Firstly, only dreamers pick kids. Secondly, even dreamers would want them to play a couple of senior games of VFL footy first. Thirdly, it is only MARCH and we have played one game. Calling for the captain to be dropped after one week is just agitating without purpose.

I know there is no disappointment without expectation - and that is why we are all disappointed...but a heap of us picked Essendon to inflict our first loss of the year in the time capsule thread...so why all the hand-wringing now???

Thank God !!! Well said MJP !!!

[GVGjr]

Well said MJP

[Mantis]

I know there is no disappointment without expectation - and that is why we are all disappointed...but a heap of us picked Essendon to inflict our first loss of the year in the time capsule thread...so why all the hand-wringing now???

Even so I doubt many of those expected us to be totally outplayed in said game.

An 'honourable' loss in which we showed some good signs would not have created such an outcry on this forum.

[Sockeye Salmon]

You're just accepting mediocrity

[Remi Moses]

Salient points as the hysteria on Round 1 is over the top.
However as we are reminded that Football is a business and as stakeholders we are entitled to question the effort last week of the side. Members have been hearing about improvement in areas we were poor last season and to be honest last week was an utter embarrassment!
Fingers crossed we will improve dramatically

[Remi Moses]

Even so I doubt many of those expected us to be totally outplayed in said game.

An 'honourable' loss in which we showed some good signs would not have created such an outcry on this forum.

How could anyone not be critical of last weeks lamentable effort?

[anfo27]

I'm not upset over 1 game mjp. I'm upset over our finish to the year last season and us just putting it down to rubbish excuses like injuries or illness, like who doesn't have injuries at that time of year. Then all the talk about injecting speed & finally embracing tackling over the pre season and come out and show they we have learnt nothing from our mistakes. We should have been smashed by 100 points to a side that finished bottom 4 that is playing Collingwoods swarm style football.
I don't think we are over reacting.

[LostDoggy]

While I do believe some comments to be a bit harsh, everyone has a right to voice their opinion, if you don't agree with whats said, ignore it. I,m sure that the criticism expressed came from the build up to this season, last year hampered by injury we still made the finals, in the off season the board, the management, the Club were strong in the belief that we can push for a flag. Enter 2011, players still recovering from surgery/ injuries but the positivity is still there, some new recruits, some good draft picks. We eased our way into the trial games, the NAB Cup, no real dramas , no real problems, the positivity is still there. Round 1 , new Captain, one or two new faces, thrashed by 55 points. For a diehard supporter to watch it all unfold the way it did , it's quite natural to express a high level of frustration, as this Forum is one way to express that frustration, it was only to be expected that we would see a wide range of opinions , as I said before, if you don't like it , ignore it. Now for Round 2, improvement ?, there damn well better be ! ;)

.

[LostDoggy]

One thing that I've noticed about the Bombers over the last couple of seasons, is that if you are not physically ready to run hard then your in trouble. I'm not saying they are fast its just for some reason I feel if your not on your toes they can trouble slower midfields. Im relaxed I just think we gambled with our fitness and Im not really expecting much until after the Bye.

[Throughandthrough]

Reading the OP i am glad I ignored this site all week.
PS did we lose in round 1 last season?

[choconmientay]

I wholeheartedly agree with what mjp said. I was so disappointed last week but had to remind myself to just keep it quite and just sucked it up. It was hard to bear all the laughter at work though.

[Remi Moses]

Reading the OP i am glad I ignored this site all week.
PS did we lose in round 1 last season?

In fairness it was the way we lost that has annoyed everyone
I'd hazard to guess that Collingwood are a slightly better outfit than Essendon.
Personally I give credit where it's due,but I'll also bake the players when they give us that pile of poo of last week!

[Mofra]

Reading the OP i am glad I ignored this site all week.
PS did we lose in round 1 last season?
Yes we did, as did Geelong in 2007 after a bunch of prelim finishes ;)


Very well said mjp. Summed up the situation perfectly.

[Maddog37]

Fair points but when do we say "enough" to embarrassing performances like last Sunday, the final against the Pies and the Cats game last year. You could nearly throw in the Swans game except for the injury excuses.

That is three of our last six or seven games that we not only lost but showed very little application or intent. Surely we can discuss and express our opinions about what we feel is wrong or is everything just peachy and we are happy with these type of worrying efforts?

[anfo27]

Reading the OP i am glad I ignored this site all week.
PS did we lose in round 1 last season?

did we get our arses handed to us in September again?

[SonofScray]

The backlash will get nastier. The fans I am sure at some level are feeling some anxiety around whether or not we've missed the boat and are staring down another trip to struggle town as a team like Essendon, who we have had the measure of for a while has our way with us on their way up. Its not a great prospect.

There will be massive amounts of frustration expressed if we fall away badly this season, even more so if teams that are coming up take out a flag before us. I've got a really bad feeling that is where things are headed and it is going to sting a bit. On the flipside, I agree with most of your sentiments that it is too early to tell and there is every chance we'll keep knocking on the door of a GF berth.

[bornadog]

Enjoyed your post MJP, as its exactly how I feel as well.

Of course we are all disappointed with the result last week, but hey its the first game not the last for the year.

[Throughandthrough]

For those people that regularly vent at the players either at the match or via the web, do you think it helps the team improve in any way?

If you had an underperfoming day at your job, for what ever reason, would it make you work harder the next day if all your clients lined up at the door when you knocked off for the day and told you that you were pathetic?

[LostDoggy]

Thought police at it again. Do those that don't vent feel that they're/they've helped the team? Agree with those who aren't the happy clappers. Round One but i wont smile in the face of a mauling.

[Topdog]

Thought police at it again. Do those that don't vent feel that they're/they've helped the team? Agree with those who aren't the happy clappers. Round One but i wont smile in the face of a mauling.

Can you not still discuss something rationally though? Calls to promote kids who would get physically mauled and drop our captain after 1 game are nothing more than the ramblings of someone not thinking.

[Sockeye Salmon]

In fairness it was the way we lost that has annoyed everyone
I'd hazard to guess that Collingwood are a slightly better outfit than Essendon.
Personally I give credit where it's due,but I'll also bake the players when they give us that pile of poo of last week!

No it wasn't. We lose by a point and it's the same.

Lose = everyone's a dud who should be delisted
Win = everyone's a superstar and we'll probably win the next 5 premierships

[The Pie Man]

mjp, your post is another example of why I love this site.

I agree that calling for the skips head after one game and calling for Cross & Gia* to be dropped is incredibly harsh and counter productive. I do however think the next 8-12 weeks will be crucial to see what they've got left (not so much Boyd, more the other two) to contribute for the remainder of their career.

Round One is early days - there's more opportunities for them to display that my concerns are baseless, and I'll emotionally back them in

* Just want to put on record that I'm not part of the Gia hate club - I remember his contribution in the 09 prelim with great pride (despite that miss) and believe he's had a great career to date

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Thought police at it again. Do those that don't vent feel that they're/they've helped the team? Agree with those who aren't the happy clappers. Round One but i wont smile in the face of a mauling.

Thought police my arse.
Go back and re-read the game day thread. It is possible to be both critical yet interesting at the same time.However, much of what was in that thread was just nothing but people making ridiculous and hyperbolic comments that were not in any shape or form contributing to a decent discussion. It became almost impossible to have a discussion about the actual game on what was a game day thread, due to the distractions of the smart arse comments.

If you think being trying to promote reasonable and measured criticism in a discussion forum is for the happy clappers, then feel free to go to another forum where the majority of people have similar delusions.

The main reason I stopped visiting the other forum was that it just became the norm there for threads to descend into name calling and constant player bagging. It's hard to actually have a critical discussion in that kind of environment.

[Mantis]

No it wasn't. We lose by a point and it's the same.

Lose = everyone's a dud who should be delisted
Win = everyone's a superstar and we'll probably win the next 5 premierships

That's an extremely simplistic take SS. Most supporters with better judgement don't think that way.

What's the old saying... 'It isn't if you win or lose, it's how you play the game'.

Last week we didn't play and that is why every one is down in the dumps.

[LostDoggy]

Rant warning.

Are we supporters or aren't we?

We have played ONE game - ONE - and I have read in multiple posts that basically everyone in our leadership group needs to be banished to Williamstown never to be seen again, that the players are simply not up to it and that they never were. And the coaches are all either dumb or incompetent.

Before we all get carried away, it is still MARCH. The players we were planning to see us through the season - and yes, I am talking about Hudson, Cross, Boyd and Gia - did not perform well against Essendon. But we are talking about a couple of regular top 5 finishers in the B&F, our best contested ball winning ruckman in my memory and the competition leader in goal assists in 2010. Can we all just settle down for a second and back our team in? Can we back the leaders of the group to turn it around?

Further, the members of the MC are apparently all stupid and unable to:
- Pick a side
- Establish a game style
- Implement that game style.

Well, that might be so but we have finished in the top 4 for the last few years so they might not be all that bad. Let's give them the benefit of the doubt for just a minute or two and see what they come up with.

I am all for debating the team and the players and the selection policy and whatever, but continually bagging our leaders, calling for Boyd (one game as captain - ONE) to be dropped, for Cross to be dropped, for Gia to be dropped whilst at the same time asking for Skinner/Schofield/Wallis/Dalhous etc to be promoted....give me a break. It simply is not going to happen. Firstly, only dreamers pick kids. Secondly, even dreamers would want them to play a couple of senior games of VFL footy first. Thirdly, it is only MARCH and we have played one game. Calling for the captain to be dropped after one week is just agitating without purpose.

I know there is no disappointment without expectation - and that is why we are all disappointed...but a heap of us picked Essendon to inflict our first loss of the year in the time capsule thread...so why all the hand-wringing now???

Well said.

[Desipura]

Rant warning.

Are we supporters or aren't we?

We have played ONE game - ONE - and I have read in multiple posts that basically everyone in our leadership group needs to be banished to Williamstown never to be seen again, that the players are simply not up to it and that they never were. And the coaches are all either dumb or incompetent.

Before we all get carried away, it is still MARCH. The players we were planning to see us through the season - and yes, I am talking about Hudson, Cross, Boyd and Gia - did not perform well against Essendon. But we are talking about a couple of regular top 5 finishers in the B&F, our best contested ball winning ruckman in my memory and the competition leader in goal assists in 2010. Can we all just settle down for a second and back our team in? Can we back the leaders of the group to turn it around?

Well, that might be so but we have finished in the top 4 for the last few years so they might not be all that bad. Let's give them the benefit of the doubt for just a minute or two and see what they come up with.

I am all for debating the team and the players and the selection policy and whatever, but continually bagging our leaders, calling for Boyd (one game as captain - ONE) to be dropped, for Cross to be dropped, for Gia to be dropped whilst at the same time asking for Skinner/Schofield/Wallis/Dalhous etc to be promoted....give me a break. It simply is not going to happen. Firstly, only dreamers pick kids. Secondly, even dreamers would want them to play a couple of senior games of VFL footy first. Thirdly, it is only MARCH and we have played one game. Calling for the captain to be dropped after one week is just agitating without purpose.

I know there is no disappointment without expectation - and that is why we are all disappointed...but a heap of us picked Essendon to inflict our first loss of the year in the time capsule thread...so why all the hand-wringing now???

I had my doubts that we were going to beat Essendon however when they went on their rampage, we did not go defensive, we should be able to do this rather than cop a hiding. Sure having 3 backman out does not help, we should still be able to stem the flow.

Regarding dreamers picking kids, Malthouse plucked a young Blair and played him in a grand final, the end result is for all to see.
In fact, Malthouse knew his current crop could not take him all the way hence why he made the tough calls on the following players:

Josh Fraser - 200 game player
Shane O'Bree - 246 games
T Lockyer - 227 games
L Davis 204 games (dropped for the 2nd grand final)

I think a high number of supporters idolise our players (tends to happen with clubs that have not had much success) when in actual fact whilst they have been great servants, they have failed in the last 3 prelims, why is it going to change this year?

I thought the likes of Cooney, Griffen, Grant, Wardy and Roughy will help us take that next step however we need everyone including the abovementioned to sacrifice their game for the betterment of the team, that is not happening yet. I will watch with interest when we play the likes of Collingwood, Hawthorn, Geelong & St Kilda to see if anything has changed.

Dont agree with your argument about how certain players have won individual awards, the one stat you did not produce was 16th in tackles in the forward 50.
I do not want all our leaders dropped, I want players that are prepared to chase, tackle, run with the ball as well as put pressure on the opposition when they have the ball.

[mjp]

Regarding dreamers picking kids, Malthouse plucked a young Blair and played him in a grand final, the end result is for all to see.
In fact, Malthouse knew his current crop could not take him all the way hence why he made the tough calls on the following players:


I love the Blair example. But remind me again Desi - how many games did Blair play in his first year with Collingwood (in 2009). NONE.

Every side - including ours - picks young players, but you still need an experienced core around them. Around Blair, Collingwood have Swan, Didak, Pendlebury, Thomas etc etc, just like we need the likes of Boyd, Cross, Cooney etc around Liberatore.

Back to my original point though...I am not happy about the performance or the result, but I simply don't understand the calls for the heads of our leaders after one game. And I never will.

[Mantis]

Back to my original point though...I am not happy about the performance or the result, but I simply don't understand the calls for the heads of our leaders after one game. And I never will.

To be fair to others the heads of these players have been called for in years gone by too.

And it isn't like the problems we saw on Sunday haven't been seen before as it was almost a carbon copy of what we saw over the last 6 weeks of the 2010 season.... It all adds up.

[Greystache]

To be fair to others the heads of these players have been called for in years gone by too.

And it isn't like the problems we saw on Sunday haven't been seen before as it was almost a carbon copy of what we saw over the last 6 weeks of the 2010 season.... It all adds up.

+1

The questions being raised (by some) are the same questions that were being raised 6 months ago. The frustration for some is it seemed we rolled straight the prelim final 2010 into round 1 of 2011 without any concernable difference to our perceived weaknesses.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

To be fair to others the heads of these players have been called for in years gone by too.

And it isn't like the problems we saw on Sunday haven't been seen before as it was almost a carbon copy of what we saw over the last 6 weeks of the 2010 season.... It all adds up.

This.

Particularly the bolded, which is why I can't understand anyone 'sticking' behind the leaders.

[LostDoggy]

When the leaders actually win a Grandfinal I will stick with them. Until then we must keep finding at-least 4 players a year to keep improving.

[LostDoggy]

Come on guys.
This website has to be taken with a grain of salt. Don't get wrapped up in peoples emotion.
Thats the beauty of this forum, it allows us to vent, to be heard, to express ourself. To get offended or upset over someones opinion would be our fault not theirs. I've been slammed for stuff I say and I couldn't care one bit.
I'd like to give the majority of WOOFers credit to have a good enough BS filter to handle anything that is posted on this website and not require a thread like this one.

[Ghost Dog]

To be fair to others the heads of these players have been called for in years gone by too.

And it isn't like the problems we saw on Sunday haven't been seen before as it was almost a carbon copy of what we saw over the last 6 weeks of the 2010 season.... It all adds up.

Be that as it may, bronx cheers - or our own players being the subject of abuse from our fans. this I do not like, no matter where a player is at. Nature of the internet makes cheap shots pretty easy so just have to ignore some posts rather than fight negativity with more negativity.

Picked Essendon to win. Didn't think we would be beaten so badly
but hey, it's a sport and sometimes good teams get thumped.
It happened to Geelong once against collingwood I seem to recall in 2009?

Calling for players heads may be an overreaction but the fans are pretty frustrated with the team's tackling and very basic aspects of the game. I can see an issue in that if Boyd continues to disappoint, it won't be possible to get him back to Willy to find form.

[Remi Moses]

That's an extremely simplistic take SS. Most supporters with better judgement don't think that way.

What's the old saying... 'It isn't if you win or lose, it's how you play the game'.

Last week we didn't play and that is why every one is down in the dumps.

Beat me to it! I think most would say they're coming a million miles an hour and we're slowly building into the season.One forward tackle says it all really

[Desipura]

I love the Blair example. But remind me again Desi - how many games did Blair play in his first year with Collingwood (in 2009). NONE.

Every side - including ours - picks young players, but you still need an experienced core around them. Around Blair, Collingwood have Swan, Didak, Pendlebury, Thomas etc etc, just like we need the likes of Boyd, Cross, Cooney etc around Liberatore.

Back to my original point though...I am not happy about the performance or the result, but I simply don't understand the calls for the heads of our leaders after one game. And I never will.

We also have a number of experienced players so if one or two cannot sacrifice their game for the team, they should make way.
It may give the opportunity for a Higgins to step up or a Grant to be groomed as a leader.
You have to ask questions when the leaders continually fail to have an impact against top sides.
You can't keep doing the sane things and expecting the same result.

[Remi Moses]

Come on guys.
This website has to be taken with a grain of salt. Don't get wrapped up in peoples emotion.
Thats the beauty of this forum, it allows us to vent, to be heard, to express ourself. To get offended or upset over someones opinion would be our fault not theirs. I've been slammed for stuff I say and I couldn't care one bit.
I'd like to give the majority of WOOFers credit to have a good enough BS filter to handle anything that is posted on this website and not require a thread like this one.

This site is light weight and gentile compared to other web sites.We're nowhere near Big Footy, that is puerile childish drivel there!

[Ghost Dog]

Come on guys.
This website has to be taken with a grain of salt. Don't get wrapped up in peoples emotion.
Thats the beauty of this forum, it allows us to vent, to be heard, to express ourself. To get offended or upset over someones opinion would be our fault not theirs. I've been slammed for stuff I say and I couldn't care one bit.
I'd like to give the majority of WOOFers credit to have a good enough BS filter to handle anything that is posted on this website and not require a thread like this one.

^_^ Like.

[LostDoggy]

We also have a number of experienced players so if one or two cannot sacrifice their game for the team, they should make way.
It may give the opportunity for a Higgins to step up or a Grant to be groomed as a leader.
You have to ask questions when the leaders continually fail to have an impact against top sides.
You can't keep doing the sane things and expecting the same result.

A true leader doesn't need someone to stand aside for them to take the lead. That's the whole point of being a leader. The leaders we have — Gia, Boyd, Cross, Murphy, Morris, Cooney — these are those blokes, who take the lead, and that's why they're in the leadership group. It's not a group of blokes Rocket likes to have coffee with, but the guys everyone turns to inside the club.

[mjp]

I'd like to give the majority of WOOFers credit to have a good enough BS filter to handle anything that is posted on this website and not require a thread like this one.

Unfortunately from where I sit it is required. And I guess that means I am just getting too old or too slow or maybe I am just not quite as convinced of my own footy infalibility as a lot of other people seemingly are...

Once I could come on here and talk with supporters about the 'Dogs - pretty much the only thing in the world that I love unconditionally. I just can't seem to do that any more for the reasons stated in the opening post. That's life I guess.

[LostDoggy]

First post I think agree with you mjp :P

But, I still have doubts on what will happen in a few weeks when we play Collingwood. We should be 2-3 wins by the time we meet them and the buzz will sort of be around us again. And hopefully we can show something against Collingwood. Every year I think we will, but I think the whole league is a few steps behind Collingwood this year.

[Desipura]

A true leader doesn't need someone to stand aside for them to take the lead. That's the whole point of being a leader. The leaders we have — Gia, Boyd, Cross, Murphy, Morris, Cooney — these are those blokes, who take the lead, and that's why they're in the leadership group. It's not a group of blokes Rocket likes to have coffee with, but the guys everyone turns to inside the club.

A true leader or leaders need to stand up when the chips are down and say enough is enough, we WIll beat the top sides and win a grand final. They need to thrive under pressure

[Ghost Dog]

A lot of coaches are going to take heart from and point to the Tigers draw last night and say ' This is the reward that can come from effort' . True, While Hays was out, so was Jack Reiwoldt. Minnows like Nahas who wouldn't even make the best 22 in our side, showed extraordinary effort for Richmond, a team that very few would have picked.

Dogs Seem to have the skill - just need that little bit more success in the tight clinches and confidence + YOUTHFUL ENTHUSIASM LIBBBAAA
GO DOGS

[the banker]

This thread is very much about what we stand for and who is carrying the responsibilty for on field team performance.

We have seen the leadership vacuum developing for a few years. In super pressure games we have lacked the inspirational leadership. Boyd will be earnest and dedicated, but he will have to dig deep and find an inspirational defensive side to truly succeed IMHO. I thought the extra responsibility may have been the making of Cooney and rounded him out as a person and a player?

Do we have a potential Kirk, Brown, Voss, Buckley, Hird or even Nick Maxwell in our group? They created the winning team culture through personailty, character and example. Add charisma to that and also on field heroics.

Who are our inspirational players, that while not having the captain title can nonetheless set the standard and lift the team to historic achievements? Cooney, Griffen, Picken, ... potentially who?

[Ghost Dog]

This thread is very much about what we stand for and who is carrying the responsibilty for on field team performance.

We have seen the leadership vacuum developing for a few years. In super pressure games we have lacked the inspirational leadership. Boyd will be earnest and dedicated, but he will have to dig deep and find an inspirational defensive side to truly succeed IMHO. I thought the extra responsibility may have been the making of Cooney and rounded him out as a person and a player?

Do we have a potential Kirk, Brown, Voss, Buckley, Hird or even Nick Maxwell in our group? They created the winning team culture through personailty, character and example. Add charisma to that and also on field heroics.

Who are our inspirational players, that while not having the captain title can nonetheless set the standard and lift the team to historic achievements? Cooney, Griffen, Picken, ... potentially who?

Interesting article by Paul Roos today in the Hun. Too lazy to go out to the car to get the paper for the direct quote, but something along the lines of " Never build your plan around personnel. The game plan comes first and any players who cant implement it have no room in the team." Fans often demand the stars pull us out of the poo, but at the end of the day, the planning or faults with it in rnd 1, with similarities to previous seasons are what some are debating

[Mofra]

This site is light weight and gentile compared to other web sites.We're nowhere near Big Footy, that is puerile childish drivel there!
True, but I think some of the sentiment expressed here is due to the fear that Woof is sadly drifting closer to the hysterical reactions and character assassinations that often seem par for the course on other websites.

Standing up for the players character, asking for a sense of balance in criticism or asking supporters to support the team now seems to attract the tired old cliches of "rose coloured glasses" or "acceptance of mediocrity".

We all barrack for the same team FFS!

[anfo27]

I don't understand all this talk about posters going too far with negative opinions. I'm a paid up bulldogs for life gold member and pay $500 a year to the team I love to death. I think i have every right to voice my displeasure & concerns at our game plan or lack there of or players who I feel are not up to the task or have had the game pass them by. I don't have a problem with posters like mjp and others who will question my thoughts about this as they don't agree, thats great and thats what this forum is about IMO.
I just find it a bit unfair in posters asking us to stop having an opinion, sure some posters can go over the top but by and large we don't.

[GVGjr]

I just find it a bit unfair in posters asking us to stop having an opinion, sure some posters can go over the top but by and large we don't.

I don't think anyone is saying that people shouldn't have an opinion but I think most would appreciate a little bit more respect being directed towards the players.

I always find it funny at the football listening to our supporters bag players during a loss. They go hell for leather themselves but if an opposition supporter said the same thing they would jump in and defend the player or the team.

[LostDoggy]

MJP's learned comments can coexist with the feeble. I have no problem with either, and in fact enjoy both because my football knowledge is not so great as to be only content with the educated analysis. But the calls for dropping players after only one round, whilst providing some welcome show of emotion, must not be allowed to thrive at the expense of real analysis. For, without analysis, this site would offer very little.

[LongWait]

Maybe some of the more extreme opinions are born of the frustration that in the first four rounds of footy we have only one meaningfull game. We know how that turned out. Games against Brisbane and Gold Coast should be gimme's and then we have the bye.

The first month of the season feels like a complete waste already.

[LostDoggy]

Maybe some of the more extreme opinions are born of the frustration that in the first four rounds of footy we have only one meaningfull game. We know how that turned out. Games against Brisbane and Gold Coast should be gimme's and then we have the bye.

The first month of the season feels like a complete waste already.

1 game = 1 month?
I would have thought all games are meaningfull if they are for premiership points.

[The Underdog]

1 game = 1 month?
I would have thought all games are meaningfull if they are for premiership points.

If we lose today or next week I bet people will find plenty of meaning

[LongWait]

1 game = 1 month?
I would have thought all games are meaningfull if they are for premiership points.

I said that games against Brisbane and Gold Coast should be gimme's. Do you disagree?

[LostDoggy]

I said that games against Brisbane and Gold Coast should be gimme's. Do you disagree?

Should be. Doesn't mean they are insignificant. We start each game at 0. Prior to the pre season many would have thought Essendon was a gimme.

[Topdog]

A true leader or leaders need to stand up when the chips are down and say enough is enough, we WIll beat the top sides and win a grand final. They need to thrive under pressure

So there is only 1 team that has leaders every year?

[the banker]

Interesting article by Paul Roos today in the Hun. Too lazy to go out to the car to get the paper for the direct quote, but something along the lines of " Never build your plan around personnel. The game plan comes first and any players who cant implement it have no room in the team." Fans often demand the stars pull us out of the poo, but at the end of the day, the planning or faults with it in rnd 1, with similarities to previous seasons are what some are debating

Respect everything Paul Roos has to say. He created a fabulous leadership group at the Swans. While their game plan was obviously strong and successful the ability of individuals to stand up on the field was supreme. Never a question of not doing it for The Bloods.

[ledge]

I try not to comment for a couple of days after a loss, that way I find I look at the game with less emotion and more construction.
I think all players try their best but have off days or opposition players that are better than them, its more how the team or the coach handles it that I find frustrating,
I question positions or moves than a certain player,
We all have players we arent keen on but we have all been on their bandwagon when they have done something good.