Does war and footy mix? ANZAC day footy

[Ghost Dog]

On one hand, a respectful commemoration of our veterans, their sacrifices and an important opportunity to raise money for important causes, chance for families and veterans to come together.
Historical, hugely popular event and one day where Australians actually are prepared to be humble and respectful to what the older generation had to experience.

On the other, a bit crass, commercial, celebrates a day where we invaded another country, a military disaster, nationalistic jingoism, does not commemorate real 'war', (where is the Turkish perspective? Vietnamese perspective? etc etc.)

What's your view? Interested to know if any ex-serviceman or women here, or relatives of have a view.

[AndrewP6]

On one hand, a celebration of our veterans, their sacrifices and an important opportunity to raise money for important causes, chance for families and veterans to come together.
Historical, hugely popular event and one day where Australians actually are prepared to be humble and respectful to what the older generation had to experience.

On the other, a bit crass, commercial, celebrates a day where we invaded another country, a military disaster, nationalistic jingoism, does not commemorate real 'war', (where is the Turkish perspective? Vietnamese perspective? etc etc.)

What's your view?

It's just a game of footy to me. Comparing it to war is ludicrous IMO. The bolded bit is a good description for mine...

[The Underdog]

On one hand, a celebration of our veterans, their sacrifices and an important opportunity to raise money for important causes, chance for families and veterans to come together.
Historical, hugely popular event and one day where Australians actually are prepared to be humble and respectful to what the older generation had to experience.

On the other, a bit crass, commercial, celebrates a day where we invaded another country, a military disaster, nationalistic jingoism, does not commemorate real 'war', (where is the Turkish perspective? Vietnamese perspective? etc etc.)

What's your view? Interested to know if any ex-serviceman or women here, or relatives of have a view.

As for the first bit, isn't that what the day itself is for? Do we really need a game of footy to illustrate the point of the day?
I just think it is about the AFL's ability to worm its way into an occasion to make itself seem like some righteous and pious entity whenever it can. The problem is that Anzac Day isn't at it's core a nationalistic, jingoistic day, it's about the real experiences of war veteran's and respect for those who fought and those who died. But jeez the AFL and the wider media can turn it into a jingoistic show of patriotism like nobody's business.

[Ghost Dog]

As for the first bit, isn't that what the day itself is for? Do we really need a game of footy to illustrate the point of the day?
I just think it is about the AFL's ability to worm its way into an occasion to make itself seem like some righteous and pious entity whenever it can. The problem is that Anzac Day isn't at it's core a nationalistic, jingoistic day, it's about the real experiences of war veteran's and respect for those who fought and those who died. But jeez the AFL and the wider media can turn it into a jingoistic show of patriotism like nobody's business.

Some good points. To see the Anzac badge appear on advertising, TV commercials and other parephanalia to promote a sporting match does not sit well with me personally.

[AndrewP6]

Slightly off topic, but a huge sledge to whoever scheduled our game to be on at 6.45 tonight. If I wasn't such a diehard ;), I'd have lost interest by now. I was initially happy to have an ANZAC day game, but that late, it's hardly worth it.

[mjp]

I don't like the idea of motivating footballers with imagery of war...the day isn't about that.

In terms of bringing community recognition to the vets (and those currently serving) I do think it is worthwhile and as such don't have an issue with the use of ANZAC badge to promote the game. This from someone who cringes at southern cross tattoos and the nationalistic push of the last decade or so...

[The Underdog]

I don't like the idea of motivating footballers with imagery of war...the day isn't about that.

In terms of bringing community recognition to the vets (and those currently serving) I do think it is worthwhile and as such don't have an issue with the use of ANZAC badge to promote the game. This from someone who cringes at southern cross tattoos and the nationalistic push of the last decade or so...

The Howard years continue to haunt us.

There's a lot of very keen astonomer's out there judging by the number of Southern Cross' I see around. My brother had the hilarious idea to get a tattoo of the Saucepan, his favourite constellation.

[Ghost Dog]

The big dipper?? ...well, at least it's original.

Notice the club had some SAS soldiers giving our players a rev up. Agree with MJP, not sure I like the idea of using war imagery to inspire players.
Then again, Leigh Mathews did use 'Predator' ( if it bleeds, we can kill it ) ^_^

[LostDoggy]

The Howard years continue to haunt us.

There's a lot of very keen astonomer's out there judging by the number of Southern Cross' I see around. My brother had the hilarious idea to get a tattoo of the Saucepan, his favourite constellation.

They do. The current wave of over the top patriotism makes me very uncomfortable. I don't remember every single person at the big day out (for example) when i was younger running around with an australian flag tattoo, or the australian flag as a cape or bikini or whatever...the ugly phrase un- australian i also dont really remember being so prevalent before Howard. And dont even get me started on the issue of asylum seekers ...He has left an ugly legacy.

[EasternWest]

I don't like the idea of motivating footballers with imagery of war...the day isn't about that.

In terms of bringing community recognition to the vets (and those currently serving) I do think it is worthwhile and as such don't have an issue with the use of ANZAC badge to promote the game. This from someone who cringes at southern cross tattoos and the nationalistic push of the last decade or so...

The problem with the recent nationalistic push is that it's a bogan concept driven by bogans.

Don't get me wrong, I'm proud to be Australian. And I'll gladly discuss/debate the merits of our country over others.

But I'll never get (nor will I understand) a bumper sticker that says "we're full" or, "if you don't love it leave". To me, that couldn't be further from what being Australian is all about.

Back on topic though, I'm fine with footy and Anzac day. I don't like the war/football comparisons. They're not even remotely related. But if footy is used as a vessel to commemorate and honour our service people, I'm ok with it.

[azabob]

They do. The current wave of over the top patriotism makes me very uncomfortable. I don't remember every single person at the big day out (for example) when i was younger running around with an australian flag tattoo, or the australian flag as a cape or bikini or whatever...the ugly phrase un- australian i also dont really remember being so prevalent before Howard. And dont even get me started on the issue of asylum seekers ...He has left an ugly legacy.

Un Australian has to be one of the most over rated and over used phrases.

[ledge]

Sadly the public back up the footy/Anzac footy by going to it.

[Hotdog60]

To me the footy is just the footy, but with the diggers getting less and less I think it's good to let future generations know what ANZAC day is about. I just hope footy doesn't overtake the remembrance.

Less we forget.....

[bornadog]

I remember going to watch us play Collingwood on ANZAC day at Victoria park and being pissed off the reserves were scheduled for the same time at a different ground. All due to the 1pm or after kickoff. This was in the 80's and no one cared so much about ANZAC day.

[Rocco Jones]

I don't like the idea of motivating footballers with imagery of war...the day isn't about that.

In terms of bringing community recognition to the vets (and those currently serving) I do think it is worthwhile and as such don't have an issue with the use of ANZAC badge to promote the game. This from someone who cringes at southern cross tattoos and the nationalistic push of the last decade or so...

Agree with that word for word.

[LostDoggy]

Agree with that word for word.

Seconded.

Rocco, love the Uncle Rico quote in your signature.

[westdog54]

On one hand, a respectful commemoration of our veterans, their sacrifices and an important opportunity to raise money for important causes, chance for families and veterans to come together.
Historical, hugely popular event and one day where Australians actually are prepared to be humble and respectful to what the older generation had to experience.

On the other, a bit crass, commercial, celebrates a day where we invaded another country, a military disaster, nationalistic jingoism, does not commemorate real 'war', (where is the Turkish perspective? Vietnamese perspective? etc etc.)

What's your view? Interested to know if any ex-serviceman or women here, or relatives of have a view.

I can only relate my experience of ANZAC Day from this year, having never previously participated in a service or had any significant involvement in the day.

I am a Police Officer in a country town. As part of the work that the station does, last year we started a program with the local Maori population, designed to help them feel like a part of the wider community and improve their relationship with Police. It started out simply enough, they'd come down to one of the local reserves on a Friday night, we'd have a muck around game of touch rugby with us and we'd put on a BBQ every now and again.

Then, a couple of Months ago, one of the older blokes, a local shearing contractor who acts as a mentor to the younger guys, enquired about participating in ANZAC Day. We went to the local RSL president, who was ecstatic. There had never been an active New Zealand involvement in ANZAC day, let alone from the Maori Community.

It was decided that the boys would:

March in the parade
Perform a haka that was used by the Maori Battalion in World War 1, and that symbolises the struggles young men must overcome as they mature, and
A replica flag of the Maori Battalion would be handed over to the RSL for permanent display



Being one of the members involved with the program, I was expecting to just help them through the process and be there as support on the day. So imagine how I felt when they asked me to join them in performing the haka. 4 weeks of practice and preparation later and the day came along.

We marched down the main street, our local Inspector plus three of the 'troops', with the Maori boys marching proudly behind us, heads held high. After speeches by the RSL president and the guest speaker, the mentor is invited to speak and gives a blessing and welcome in the Maori tongue. We then formed up and performed the haka in front of the town monument. The applause at the end was deafening. We were concerned about how it might be received by some of the old diggers, but the response was overwhelming.

At the official lunch, the flag was handed over. In accordance with Maori custom, a traditional song was sung by the maori boys and their families. The RSL president did his research, and found that in such a situation, it was customary to 'respond in kind'. He daid he had a 'surpsise' planned as his response. Withouth our knowledge, he'd arranged one of the local School Choirs to perform a song called 'Lest We Forget' as the RSL's response. There were tears in the room. The response to the whole day from those who attended was very humbling and we were congratulated from all fronts for our contribution to the day.

I didn't get home until 3pm after having started the day at 7am straight from working a nightshift. I got straight into bed to try and get some sleep before coming back to work at 11pm.

Until I logged onto WOOF after getting to work I didn't think about football once for the day.

To me, this day is about rememberance, and honouring respecting those who have gone before us. The football should be no more than an afterthought.

[Ghost Dog]

I can only relate my experience of ANZAC Day from this year, having never previously participated in a service or had any significant involvement in the day.

I am a Police Officer in a country town. As part of the work that the station does, last year we started a program with the local Maori population, designed to help them feel like a part of the wider community and improve their relationship with Police. It started out simply enough, they'd come down to one of the local reserves on a Friday night, we'd have a muck around game of touch rugby with us and we'd put on a BBQ every now and again.

Then, a couple of Months ago, one of the older blokes, a local shearing contractor who acts as a mentor to the younger guys, enquired about participating in ANZAC Day. We went to the local RSL president, who was ecstatic. There had never been an active New Zealand involvement in ANZAC day, let alone from the Maori Community.

It was decided that the boys would:

March in the parade
Perform a haka that was used by the Maori Battalion in World War 1, and that symbolises the struggles young men must overcome as they mature, and
A replica flag of the Maori Battalion would be handed over to the RSL for permanent display



Being one of the members involved with the program, I was expecting to just help them through the process and be there as support on the day. So imagine how I felt when they asked me to join them in performing the haka. 4 weeks of practice and preparation later and the day came along.

We marched down the main street, our local Inspector plus three of the 'troops', with the Maori boys marching proudly behind us, heads held high. After speeches by the RSL president and the guest speaker, the mentor is invited to speak and gives a blessing and welcome in the Maori tongue. We then formed up and performed the haka in front of the town monument. The applause at the end was deafening. We were concerned about how it might be received by some of the old diggers, but the response was overwhelming.

At the official lunch, the flag was handed over. In accordance with Maori custom, a traditional song was sung by the maori boys and their families. The RSL president did his research, and found that in such a situation, it was customary to 'respond in kind'. He daid he had a 'surpsise' planned as his response. Withouth our knowledge, he'd arranged one of the local School Choirs to perform a song called 'Lest We Forget' as the RSL's response. There were tears in the room. The response to the whole day from those who attended was very humbling and we were congratulated from all fronts for our contribution to the day.

I didn't get home until 3pm after having started the day at 7am straight from working a nightshift. I got straight into bed to try and get some sleep before coming back to work at 11pm.

Until I logged onto WOOF after getting to work I didn't think about football once for the day.

To me, this day is about rememberance, and honouring respecting those who have gone before us. The football should be no more than an afterthought.

Magnificent. Thanks for the well written post, I enjoyed reading that.

[westdog54]

Magnificent. Thanks for the well written post, I enjoyed reading that.

Glad you enjoyed it. I wouldn't trade the day for the world.

[FrediKanoute]

My fondest memories of ANZAC Day have nothing to do with the footy. For mine ANZAC Day is one of reflection, rememberance and honouring those people who sacrificed so much. As a child it would be watching the ANZAC DAy March, usually on TV. As I got older it was about attending the dawn service and then more latterly, heading to a pub to have a few pints and play some 2 up, the latter moreso in Sydney and Brissy as they tend to have more of a tradition of playing it.

[westdog54]

My fondest memories of ANZAC Day have nothing to do with the footy. For mine ANZAC Day is one of reflection, rememberance and honouring those people who sacrificed so much. As a child it would be watching the ANZAC DAy March, usually on TV. As I got older it was about attending the dawn service and then more latterly, heading to a pub to have a few pints and play some 2 up, the latter moreso in Sydney and Brissy as they tend to have more of a tradition of playing it.

The year I moved into our old place we hosted an ANZAC day BBQ and my cousin brought a Two Up set that he'd bought. All the boys, who ranged in age from 4 to 55, were out on the lawn throwing amounts of money between 20c and $5 about. A great time was had by all.

[Sedat]

Un Australian has to be one of the most over rated and over used phrases.
Stop being so unaustralian :D

Off topic a little, but I spend quite a bit of my time at work dealing with the major retailers in Australia, and the concept of nationalism (in particular the explosion of Australiana merchandise flogged off for Australia Day) has been artificially created by the retail sector to fill the void left by the post-Xmas and Boxing Day consumer hangover. Retailers are all about creating 'events' throughout the year to ensure that the wheel continues to be adequately greased throughout the year. That is why Easter has become almost as big a gift-giving time as Xmas, Halloween has been shoved down our throats in recent years, and the most cynical of all, Toy Sale catalogues have been created as major events in the middle of the year so that consumers are compelled to use their discretionary spend on big ticket Xmas items in mid year, lay-by them and pick them up before Xmas (while still being force-fed Xmas catalogues in the weeks leading up to Xmas and continuing to buy more landfill than they'll ever need on the day).

Whilst the AFL (in particular the current regime) have maintained an intrinsic involvement in ANZAC Day for cynical and self-seeking reasons, at least all the right observances are enacted on the day at the MCG. It is the media (more than likely at the behest of the AFL) that overblows the ANZAC Day match and turns the hyperbole into overdrive.