Should Lake Play this week v North?

[bornadog]

Its round 17 and seven rounds to go. Lake has not exactly been in top form but is getting there. We have North this week, followed by Sydney and West Coast. We know that WC absolutely belted us last time, in particular their big men.

Is it time to get Lake back in and get some form at AFL level, or do we just persist with him at Willi?

[Mantis]

No.

He needs to get a kick in defence for Williamstown before he returns.

[bornadog]

No..

god quick fingers

[Ozza]

I was hoping that this week would see Lake return.

But by the sounds of it - he had a minor setback with his calf - and not playing pushes him further back. Realistically, you'd think he is at least another 2 weeks away - from the outside looking in - and thats assuming he plays two decent games at Willy.

[The Coon Dog]

No, I don't like the one step forward, one step backwards we've seen this year with Brian. Rather he be right physically & mentally before he plays.

[Greystache]

No, didn't even play for Willi on the weekend.

[always right]

He cannot be rushed back.....it would send a terrible message to the blokes who are currently doing the job for the team.

[LostDoggy]

Young Bwian is not at full fitness just yet , fit enough but not match fit . He has to get back to full confidence with full body contact , he just seems shy at the moment when it comes to competing for a mark , it will take some time before we see him back to his best as the top one or two contested markers in the game . Young Bwian is the sort of player who needs a balance between self confidence and confidence in his body and at the moment he,s flat on both counts . It will be good to see him back on the park but in his absence Williams and Markovic are doing great work

So in answering the question , no Brian shouldn,t play against North Melbourne , Brian will only be back on the park when Brian says to Brian " I,m ready Brian are you ready Brian "

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[LostDoggy]

I'd say no. He has had a bout of injuries and when he was played earlier in the season he didn't do too well as he had not recovered properly. He must be 100% at the business end of the season.

[Dazza]

Nope. Pick players on form not reputation.

Marko and Williams have been doing a good job.

[bornadog]

Young Bwian is not at full fitness just yet , fit enough but not match fit . He has to get back to full confidence with full body contact , he just seems shy at the moment when it comes to competing for a mark , it will take some time before we see him back to his best as the top one or two contested markers in the game . Young Bwian is the sort of player who needs a balance between self confidence and confidence in his body and at the moment he,s flat on both counts . It will be good to see him back on the park but in his absence Williams and Markovic are doing great work

So in answering the question , no Brian shouldn,t play against North Melbourne , Brian will only be back on the park when Brian says to Brian " I,m ready Brian are you ready Brian "

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17 rounds and he isnot fit. I just think that he isnot going to get any better playing at Willi.

[Topdog]

Agree with Stache. He didn't even play for Willi this week so no for me too.

[immortalmike]

17 rounds and he isnot fit. I just think that he isnot going to get any better playing at Willi.

Considering he didn't even play at Williamstown on Saturday, do you really feel he's fit enough to play seniors? And who would you drop?

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Agree with Stache. He didn't even play for Willi this week so no for me too.

This.

If he played for Williamstown it would have been tempting given we've got WCE the week after, but he didn't play. Plus - our back half has been terrific in the last month.

As bad as the back half was against West Coast the first time around, the midfield was even worse. I'd back them in (Marko, Williams) with full confidence.

Lake to return when he's mentally sound.

[G-Mo77]

No and I wouldn't even bring him back until he is absoloutly destroying it at VFL. We're better off with Williams and Marko right now.

[Mantis]

Lake to return when he's mentally sound.

So he will be back in..... Never?? ;)

But it would be nice to have him back in decent touch sooner rather than later... We have all seen the difference a half fit Cooney makes to our performance, it would be quantified if we could throw an AA FB into the mix too.

C'mon Bryza extract the digit and have a dip for a few weeks.

[bornadog]

C'mon Bryza extract the digit and have a dip for a few weeks.

This

[The Bulldogs Bite]

So he will be back in..... Never?? ;)

But it would be nice to have him back in decent touch sooner rather than later... We have all seen the difference a half fit Cooney makes to our performance, it would be quantified if we could throw an AA FB into the mix too.

C'mon Bryza extract the digit and have a dip for a few weeks.

Imagine if Lake returned fully fit and recaptured some of his best form.

Let's not mention the magical 'P' word. ;)

[Bulldog Revolution]

Whats news with Bryzas calf?

Did he just miss through soreness? or is it strained?

I think it would be good if he was right to go the week before the bye against West Coast and then could have a week off, and then another four, but if he is not right to play then its no point.

[chef]

Hell no.

I don't want him back at all this year unless he shows something special back at Willi. I would rather have Markovic at least having a dip than a half arsed Lake.

[westbulldog]

I'm not on this bandwagon, if Lake is reasonably fit I would bring him in and play him off the bench.

[Remi Moses]

So he will be back in..... Never?? ;)

But it would be nice to have him back in decent touch sooner rather than later... We have all seen the difference a half fit Cooney makes to our performance, it would be quantified if we could throw an AA FB into the mix too.

C'mon Bryza extract the digit and have a dip for a few weeks.

Ditto for me. Come on Brian

[AndrewP6]

I really just don't know about Briza. This year, we've heard he lacks fitness, lacks confidence, has to learn to play hurt, has to work harder, has issues with the coach, and recently, is doing a great job in his efforts to get back in the side. I'm staggered that, even with the surgeries he had, that he is still not in the side, and from accounts, doesn't look like getting back in anytime soon.

[LostDoggy]

He didn't even play for Willy so theres no chance.
When he plays down back he's just a average VFL defender. Playing him seriously hurts us as team IMO, as Marko's current form would be far ahead of anything Lake can produce.
Hopefully he can string back-to-back near dominant games in the VFL and get staight back into the team at around round 22 and get some moderate form heading in the finals and thats the best case scenario it seams

[LostDoggy]

We sure miss the man but Marko has at least made this thread possible by becoming a decent backup option.

I would still bring Brian in if we was 80% fit and starting to fire.

[LostDoggy]

We sure miss the man but Marko has at least made this thread possible by becoming a decent backup option.

I would still bring Brian in if we was 80% fit and starting to fire.

We've gone the 80%/reputation route for years and it doesn't work IMO. Much as we need our great lake back we don't need a dodgy lake opening holes down back. As you say, Marko's been decent in replacing the irresplacable...

We won'r see Lake until '12 IMO.....

[1eyedog]

I would like him to play this week but given the unexpected form of Markovic and the game Williams played on the weekend I think we have the luxury of nursing Lake back through Willy. Another set back and it could be goodbye season. I would like him to play the round before the bye, even as the sub, to get a taste and then rest him for another two weeks before bringing him back for rounds 21-24. A decent, but still limited block of four weeks of football prior to the finals. If his body is right he is good enough to find touch in four weeks.

Of course I have absolutely no idea where Brian is at with his confidence in his body.

[Doc26]

Although Brian blitzed against North last year I can't see what box has been ticked to recall him based on Brian circa 2011. A strong outing down back for Willy should be a prerequisite.

[LostDoggy]

No he shouldn't

[boydogs]

North won't get near us, if it helps him get back quicker then do it.

[LostDoggy]

How many games has he played this year?

And he's still not fit!

And he still can't get a kick!

There is no earthly reson to bring him back into the side.

[always right]

North won't get near us, if it helps him get back quicker then do it.

Let's hope the club isn't thinking like this. The current group has managed to resurect our season. Bringing Lake in because we believe we can carry him against North could very well backfire and derail the remainder of the season.

Bring him back because he has shown he is ready...not because of wishful thinking.

[BulldogBelle]

How many games has he played this year?

And he's still not fit!

And he still can't get a kick!

There is no earthly reson to bring him back into the side.



If Lake isnt confident with his body on the training track or in the VFL, and given the type of personality that he has - he will get chop to pieces against Norf or any other half decent side.

Markovic and Williams are both playing well, and Morris can play tall if required.

Lake can 'earn' his $500-600k playing at Williamstown until his form and confidence improves.

North dont have champagne Wayne Carey, Malcolm Blight and Doug Wade in their F50.

[LostDoggy]

Its round 17 and seven rounds to go. Lake has not exactly been in top form but is getting there. We have North this week, followed by Sydney and West Coast. We know that WC absolutely belted us last time, in particular their big men.

Is it time to get Lake back in and get some form at AFL level, or do we just persist with him at Willi?

NO! Not fit. End of argument!

[Mofra]

If he was fit, I'd bring him in for Reid.

He's not, and we've made an example of him - and example that arguably has been worth it in the last month. Short term pain for long term gain.

[LostDoggy]

If he was fit, I'd bring him in for Reid.

He's not, and we've made an example of him - and example that arguably has been worth it in the last month. Short term pain for long term gain.

This is a good point.
I wonder if the dropping of an All Australian has shocked a few of our (lets use the word) 'permanent' players into action?
Looks like it has.

[1eyedog]

North won't get near us, if it helps him get back quicker then do it.

Cough. I think you're underestimating North at the Dome. I wouldn't speak too soon it's another one we would be expected to win but could easilty drop. It's 70/30 in our favour IMO but that 30 implies that North could indeed get close. They will come out smarting after last week and will be competitive. They're not that bad a side.

[Curly5]

This is a good point.
I wonder if the dropping of an All Australian has shocked a few of our (lets use the word) 'permanent' players into action?
Looks like it has.

What a connection to make. Brian wasn't dropped simply on dodgy form. Anything can "look like" anything if you want to see it that way.

I'd love to see him back in the team, but it's going to be up to him in the long run. We obviously don't know the half of what's going on.

[LostDoggy]

What a connection to make. Brian wasn't dropped simply on dodgy form. Anything can "look like" anything if you want to see it that way.

I'd love to see him back in the team, but it's going to be up to him in the long run. We obviously don't know the half of what's going on.

No connection, just a mind ticking over. Hence the words "Wonder" and "Looks like".
I would assume Brian was dropped because he wasn't putting in effort due to fitness and his head not being in the game? Happy if people think otherwise.
Does dropping an AA send a mesage that no one is safe if they let it slip? I think it would, don't you?
Has the teams effort picked up since? I think it has with the help of the young pups.
I'm not saying a definite that this is the reason but you have to forgive me for not thinking it is not an overly large bow to draw??

[BulldogBelle]

No connection, just a mind ticking over. Hence the words "Wonder" and "Looks like".
I would assume Brian was dropped because he wasn't putting in effort due to fitness and his head not being in the game? Happy if people think otherwise.
Does dropping an AA send a mesage that no one is safe if they let it slip? I think it would, don't you?
Has the teams effort picked up since? I think it has with the help of the young pups.
I'm not saying a definite that this is the reason but you have to forgive me for not thinking it is not an overly large bow to draw??




Bwian should only play when he is listed amoungst the Bests for Willy

Otherwise Mr Akermanis theory that we treat Bwian differently compared to others will prove correct - and for all of the points that you mentioned above, to our detriment

Getting games into Markovic considering Bwian is 29 (30?) isnt such a bad thing

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

No and I wouldn't even bring him back until he is absoloutly destroying it at VFL. We're better off with Williams and Marko right now.

The Club has done the right thing in not playing Lake. It sends a strong message that players are not played on reputation. In form Lake is a better player than Williams and Markovic, but they have earned their stripes and should be picked.
Lake's lack of confidence in his body is obvious and I do not believe we can expect too much this year from him.

[merantau]

Brian Lake is a quality player who when fit/match fit and in form is a stand out attacking defender who can also do the nullifying job when he has to eg.. some of his performances on Franklin etc. I am a little mystified - is he not fit or his he not match fit? There is a difference of course. Even with injuries and not being able to get out on the park there is still a lot you can do to get fit and stay fit. But I am happy to see him come back a couple of weeks before the finals when he has strung together a few good games at Willy. No matter how well others have done they do not have the ability to influence games that Brian Lake has. That being said he has to EARN his place in the side. And if he is not mentally capable of doing that then that is a sad indictment of him as a footballer.

[The Adelaide Connection]

As much as we'd all love to see him back in AA or even reasonable form I think that ship might have sailed. But I think he still has a part to play.

I would like him (if he isn't already) to take on a massive mentoring role for Markovic et al. It would be good to see him come out with some proactive, positive comments about "putting the team ahead of himself" and "helping out in any way he can" etc rather than have the silence and mystery feed the "Disgruntled, selfish Brian" perception that is perpetuated through the media.

[w3design]

Brian Lake is a quality player who when fit/match fit and in form is a stand out attacking defender who can also do the nullifying job when he has to eg.. some of his performances on Franklin etc. I am a little mystified - is he not fit or his he not match fit? There is a difference of course. Even with injuries and not being able to get out on the park there is still a lot you can do to get fit and stay fit. But I am happy to see him come back a couple of weeks before the finals when he has strung together a few good games at Willy. No matter how well others have done they do not have the ability to influence games that Brian Lake has. That being said he has to EARN his place in the side. And if he is not mentally capable of doing that then that is a sad indictment of him as a footballer.

Good post. I too am mystified about what level of fitness Brian is alleged not to have attained. But the between-the- ears type seems most likely. Was at a club function last week and Rocket was asked, are there any players not carrying something this time of year? He answered that only a first year player would be genuinely injury-free.

From the outside it really looks as if Brian is unable, mentally, to cope with carrying niggles. No one suggests Cooney is completely injury free, but he has learnt to manage/accommodate it.

The team is performing well, unless Brian is able to show that he is fit and has this mythical
'confidence in his body' back, I'd really prefer him to have the rest of the year off and come
back as the player we know. I do agree he has lost a lot in my estimation in not being more
resolute in this situation, but this does seem as though it is a sizeable chunk of the problem.

[the banker]

Has the Club put a media ban on Brian? If not it would be great to have an in-depth interview - that would help us all understand his frame of mind and his thoughts for the future.

[LostDoggy]

When people say "he's not fit" I don't think they mean aerobic fitness. I think they just refer to getting rid of a niggle injury here and there. I'm sure he is fit fit. just needs to get over his injury(s) so he is 'fit' to play.

[A dogs life]

Apparently some of the players are still not happy with his attitude.
This worries me as he might want to leave if he does not feal the love.

[AndrewP6]

Apparently some of the players are still not happy with his attitude.
This worries me as he might want to leave if he does not feal the love.

Where's this from? Publicly, Briza's had support from players. Obviously, the footy club has 40-odd people though.

[Maddog37]

Apparently some of the players are still not happy with his attitude.
This worries me as he might want to leave if he does not feal the love.



According to who?

[Hotdog60]

Hasn't Brian been playing the last couple of seasons with some niggle of some sort. We all have heard about a hip problem he nursed through the finals 2 seasons ago and look at all the surgery he had at the end of last season.
Maybe his body is feeling the best it has in years and the mental block maybe he doesn't want to go back to pain filled days, this is all assumption though.
Here's hoping what is ever holding him back can release it's grip and he can get back to the player we know he can be.

[LostDoggy]

Bwian should only play when he is listed amoungst the Bests for Willy

Otherwise Mr Akermanis theory that we treat Bwian differently compared to others will prove correct - and for all of the points that you mentioned above, to our detriment

Getting games into Markovic considering Bwian is 29 (30?) isnt such a bad thing

Are you saying Bwian cos I said Bwian ;)


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Yes , it would be good if Bwian can get match fit and confident in mind and body and make it back to the big stage

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[boydogs]

Has the Club put a media ban on Brian? If not it would be great to have an in-depth interview - that would help us all understand his frame of mind and his thoughts for the future.

Great idea :)