Sniffing at the trade table

[Ghost Dog]

Players who feature on the trade table club by club
Players in bold, maybe we should consider.

Adelaide
Phil Davis is already off to the Giants while Bernie Vince and Taylor Walker were considered chances to leave but have re-committed to the club. Ivan Maric has been linked with Richmond's hunt for a ruckman and has put off contract talks until the end of the year.

Brisbane Lions
The Lions have managed to hang on to most of their young stars and with Luke Power and Brendan Fevola's departure from the club they have salary cap space. But a question mark continues to hover over Mitch Clark, who has been linked to GWS, Richmond and the two West Australian clubs.

Carlton
Shaun Hampson finds himself behind Rob Warnock and Matthew Kreuzer in the ruck pecking order and might field an offer or two. As with all ruckmen, Richmond looks a possible future home.

Collingwood
The Magpies' list management will be interesting, as Nathan Buckley might have a different view of some players than Mick Malthouse. Chris Dawes is out of contract at the end of the season and is understood to be in the sights of several clubs. John McCarthy has been on the fringe of the team for a while and could attract interest.

Essendon
Scott Gumbleton has come to the end of a fifth injury-riddled season and the Bombers' patience may be wearing thin. With Michael Hurley and Jake Carlilse developing up forward and ruckmen Patrick Ryder and David Hille alternating in attack, Gumbleton might find it hard to become a regular. He has one more year to go on his contract but if the right offer comes it could be beneficial for all parties. Ricky Dyson has been strongly linked with the Giants.

Fremantle
Zac Clarke falls in to the category of back-up ruckmen who could find greater opportunities at Punt Road. Rhys Palmer has been firmly linked with GWS all season long.

Geelong
Mark Blake is almost certain to leave Kardinia Park after failing to play a game all season. There is sure to be interest in other ruckmen Dawson Simpson and Trent West who have slipped behind Nathan Vardy.

Gold Coast
It's doubtful they would unwillingly lose someone after season one, but you never know what Scott Clayton might have up his sleeve. The Suns have a raft of players aged 18-20 most other clubs would give plenty for.

Hawthorn
Jordan Lisle has played just four games and has been named an emergency for most of the other matches this year and could be tempted by greener pastures.
So again, size plus lack of opportunity equals Richmond potential. Rick Ladson is no longer in the Hawks' best 22 and may be shopped around.

Melbourne
No player has had more scrutiny on his potential 2012 home than Tom Scully. He remains yet to commit to the Demons but many have accepted that he will be leading the GWS midfield next season. Stefan Martin's improvement this year also seems to have rival clubs interested while Colin Sylvia's axing from the side several weeks ago raised eyebrows.

North Melbourne
Hamish McIntosh has been superseded by Todd Goldstein as the No. 1 ruckman and will play his first match for 2011 this weekend. The Kangaroos have said he is a required player but they should at least entertain the offers that are sure to come their way. Richmond has been touted as a potential home, believe it or not.

Port Adelaide
They've re-signed Carlile and Trengove, along with Andrew Moore and Justin Westhoff, but Butcher remains out of contract and is likely to attract great interest from opposition clubs. His value increases with every game he plays and his signature will be prized by the Power. Danyle Pearce has also been linked to GWS.

Richmond
Kelvin Moore has had a nightmare run with injury this year and hasn't played a match after finishing in the top 10 of the club's best and fairest in 2009. Clubs are always on the lookout for tall defenders and there might be a nibble or two for Moore.

St Kilda
Brendon Goddard has been linked to GWS, but if that does happen it wouldn't be until the end of 2012 when his current contract expires - unless, of course, the Saints jump the gun and try to orchestrate a trade, which is unlikely.

Sydney Swans
Jesse White has struggled to hold down his position in the forward line and may attract some interest for clubs keen to find a tall forward/ruck.

West Coast
Bradd Dalziell has played some quality football at WAFL level but has only had one outing for the Eagles this season. He may look to further his career elsewhere from 2012.

Western Bulldogs
It seems almost a forgone conclusion that Callan Ward will be at GWS next season while Rodney Eade's departure casts further doubt on Brian Lake's future. He has a hefty contract and a terrible run with injury, which doesn't help.

[bornadog]

Western Bulldogs
It seems almost a forgone conclusion that Callan Ward will be at GWS next season while Rodney Eade's departure casts further doubt on Brian Lake's future. He has a hefty contract and a terrible run with injury, which doesn't help.

Who wrote this dribble?

[Ghost Dog]

Forget that. Who interests you in the list above?

[comrade]

Jesse White has shown some glimpses and of course, Butcher looks pretty handy.

A forward line with Jones and Butcher as the key targets, with Dahl at their feet would be pretty tasty in a couple of years.

Fantasia has no chance of orchestrating it though.

[Remi Moses]

Surely they'd look at Butcher. Wants to come back by all accounts.

[AndrewP6]

White and Butcher.

[chef]

McIntosh, Butcher or Lisle for me, if we could end up with one of these guys I would be rapt.

[The Coon Dog]

Heard a whisper that Nathan Brown at Collingwood has been offered a new contract that's an insult, he might be looking to leave.

[Mantis]

Heard a whisper that Nathan Brown at Collingwood has been offered a new contract that's an insult, he might be looking to leave.

Yes please.

With so players in their team who are on big $$'s the squeeze has to be felt by some.

He is exactly what we need.

[Desipura]

Yes please.

With so players in their team who are on big $$'s the squeeze has to be felt by some.

He is exactly what we need.
His pace is an issue however can play full back and is a strong body, definately worth looking at.

[The Coon Dog]

Yes please.

With so players in their team who are on big $$'s the squeeze has to be felt by some.

He is exactly what we need.

He was apparently told by Collingwood; 'You owe us'!

[Grantysghost]

Imagine the confusion it would create if he (brown) ended up at West Coast!

I like others think Butcher is worth pursuing, but every man and his dog are after him based on two games which is interesting in itself. Can take a nice contested mark, but kicking a concern but can be developed by the right coaches.

Maybe we should just develop our own for a while and take the pain down the bottom.

[Flamethrower]

Stay away from talls who have had knee recos.

Butcher is all but signed for another 2 years at Port according to reports in the paper.

[Mantis]

He was apparently told by Collingwood; 'You owe us'!

What does he owe them?

[Mantis]

Jesse White has shown some glimpses and of course, Butcher looks pretty handy.

A forward line with Jones and Butcher as the key targets, with Dahl at their feet would be pretty tasty in a couple of years.



We are going to have to pay massive overs for Butcher and for what?

If any of our 3 best defenders were playing in our recent game he would have been lucky to kick 2 goals rather than the 6 he kicked on Barlow & Wood.... Would the wraps be the same then as they are now?

Essendon also had players missing.

[The Coon Dog]

What does he owe them?

I get the feeling that they're talking about him playing in a Premiership when Presti didn't come up.

[Greystache]

We are going to have to pay massive overs for Butcher and for what?

If any of our 3 best defenders were playing in our recent game he would have been lucky to kick 2 goals rather than the 6 he kicked on Barlow & Wood.... Would the wraps be the same then as they are now?

Essendon also had players missing.

Did they? I can't think of any other than Fletcher and he wouldn't go within 100m of a forward in good form unless they were both on the bench.

[Mantis]

Did they? I can't think of any other than Fletcher and he wouldn't go within 100m of a forward in good form unless they were both on the bench.

Yeah I'm not sure.

Just heard that they had an under-strengthened backline, but didn't check to see who was missing.

[The Pie Man]

I get the feeling that they're talking about him playing in a Premiership when Presti didn't come up.

That's a dangerous way to play it for the Pies - Presti put his hand up, it's not like Brown sabotaged him to get a run...and he largely nullified Nick to repay the faith and then some.

Wow - let's get after him!

[Greystache]

Yeah I'm not sure.

Just heard that they had an under-strengthened backline, but didn't check to see who was missing.

I think that line keeps getting thrown around because they had some earlier in the year. Pears, Hooker, Hurley, Carlisle, Hardingham, and Myers all played. Fletcher was the only one missing, the other injuries are just mids.

[Mofra]

Heard a whisper that Nathan Brown at Collingwood has been offered a new contract that's an insult, he might be looking to leave.


Yes please.

With so players in their team who are on big $$'s the squeeze has to be felt by some.

He is exactly what we need.


He was apparently told by Collingwood; 'You owe us'!
I hope Collingwood have said that to him - I'd have him in a heartbeat.

How the article missed Matthew Bate and Paul Bower I don't know - they're the only two potential trades I've heard actually linked to the Bulldogs.

[LostDoggy]

I think that line keeps getting thrown around because they had some earlier in the year. Pears, Hooker, Hurley, Carlisle, Hardingham, and Myers all played. Fletcher was the only one missing, the other injuries are just mids.

Maybe becuase there backline is overated.

[bornadog]

Heard a whisper that Nathan Brown at Collingwood has been offered a new contract that's an insult, he might be looking to leave.

Dawes is out of contract as well but doubt they would let him go. I see Nathan Brown as a clone of Markovic, but then I can't remember too much about him.

[bornadog]

Imagine the confusion it would create if he (brown) ended up at West Coast!

I like others think Butcher is worth pursuing, but every man and his dog are after him based on two games which is interesting in itself. Can take a nice contested mark, but kicking a concern but can be developed by the right coaches.

Maybe we should just develop our own for a while and take the pain down the bottom.

Maybe go for his little brother:D

[1eyedog]

I think that line keeps getting thrown around because they had some earlier in the year. Pears, Hooker, Hurley, Carlisle, Hardingham, and Myers all played. Fletcher was the only one missing, the other injuries are just mids.

Both Pears and Hooker have only recently returned. It was Hooker's first game for quite a while coming off the injury list. They were underdone.

[Greystache]

Both Pears and Hooker have only recently returned. It was Hooker's first game for quite a while coming off the injury list. They were underdone.

I appreciate that, but underdone isn't undermaned.

[Dancin' Douggy]

Imagine the confusion it would create if he (brown) ended up at West Coast!

I like others think Butcher is worth pursuing, but every man and his dog are after him based on two games which is interesting in itself. Can take a nice contested mark, but kicking a concern but can be developed by the right coaches.

Maybe we should just develop our own for a while and take the pain down the bottom.

I agree. Take the pain and take it hard

[stefoid]

I understand not passing an opportunistic trade for a quality player at a decent price - you dont pass that up.

But our overwhelming need as I see it is for midfielders, and I dont want us wasting resources that should be directed at mids. By wasting I mean paying overs for average players.

Our first pick could get us a decent mid even in this draft, so it shouldnt be given up lightly. Ditto for Wards picks(s) which should be held onto until next year unless there is a very good reason not to.

[Topdog]

Both Pears and Hooker have only recently returned. It was Hooker's first game for quite a while coming off the injury list. They were underdone.

Hooker had played in the VFL for 2 or 3 weeks so it's not like he just came straight back into the side.

[the banker]

I am not sold on Butcher at an inflated price. He reminds me of Adelaide Crows Ken McGregor.

If Jesse White was cheap he could be worth considering structure wise.

If Grant can get his act together he could play the mobile leading FF, the Hampson could be very dangerous in the ruck and resting up forward, (then we would not look at White)

Nathan Brown after those reconstructions would be a risk. We won't need him if Brian comes back fit and motivated. Brian is the best going around (along with Scarlett and old man Fletcher)

I think Hampson could be good. The guy is a mountain and takes a grab.

[Axe Man]

Not sure about Hampson as a player but if he brings Megan Gale to the club then I'm all for it!

[Mofra]

Maybe go for his little brother:D
Arrrrrgggghhh

We have a shocking record with brothers - we need to rule out anyone who has a brother playing AFL.

[LostDoggy]

No way on Hampson. We already have average rucks.

[immortalmike]

Dawes is out of contract as well but doubt they would let him go. I see Nathan Brown as a clone of Markovic, but then I can't remember too much about him.

Here are his draft camp results:

20-metre sprint

Nathan Krakouer - 2.83 sec
Nathan Djerrkura - 2.90 sec
Nathan Brown - 2.91 sec
Simon Hogan - 2.91 sec
Brock O'Brien - 2.92 sec
Shaun Grigg - 2.92 sec
Ben Reid - 2.93 sec
Ben Ross - 2.94 sec
Clint Benjamin - 2.95 sec
Travis Boak - 2.96 sec

Repeat Sprints - 30 metres

Simon Hogan - 24.67 sec
Tim Houlihan - 24.72 sec
Clint Benjamin - 24.74 sec
Joe Anderson - 24.76 sec
Nathan Djerrkura - 25.00 sec
Nathan Brown - 25.07 sec
Nathan Krakouer - 25.08 sec
Mark Austin - 25.09 sec
Mitchell Brown - 25.34 sec
Jarryd Allen - 25.36 sec

So unless the knee really hampers him he is fairly quick and has played in a premiership. Would not be the worst trade we've ever done.

[LostDoggy]

The worry is seeing Djerrkura name above him.

[Desipura]

Here are his draft camp results:

20-metre sprint

Nathan Krakouer - 2.83 sec
Nathan Djerrkura - 2.90 sec
Nathan Brown - 2.91 sec
Simon Hogan - 2.91 sec
Brock O'Brien - 2.92 sec
Shaun Grigg - 2.92 sec
Ben Reid - 2.93 sec
Ben Ross - 2.94 sec
Clint Benjamin - 2.95 sec
Travis Boak - 2.96 sec

Repeat Sprints - 30 metres

Simon Hogan - 24.67 sec
Tim Houlihan - 24.72 sec
Clint Benjamin - 24.74 sec
Joe Anderson - 24.76 sec
Nathan Djerrkura - 25.00 sec
Nathan Brown - 25.07 sec
Nathan Krakouer - 25.08 sec
Mark Austin - 25.09 sec
Mitchell Brown - 25.34 sec
Jarryd Allen - 25.36 sec

So unless the knee really hampers him he is fairly quick and has played in a premiership. Would not be the worst trade we've ever done.
A 22yo fullback will not come cheaply. Richmond, Hawthorn and a few others will be looking at him as well. Expect to depart with a first rounder for him.
With Tarrant near the end, its not as if they have anyone else that can play full back

[DOG GOD]

Wouldnt want to deal with Team Eddie.

Most of the list i wouldnt want at the dogs, and you can add Bate and probably Bower to that as well.

Mitch Clark is the only one i would want from the so called trade table.

Forget the rest.

[immortalmike]

A 22yo fullback will not come cheaply. Richmond, Hawthorn and a few others will be looking at him as well. Expect to depart with a first rounder for him.
With Tarrant near the end, its not as if they have anyone else that can play full back

True but there could be a few things in any potential suitor's favour, i.e., his knee injury, he is uncontracted and if reports are true he may be disgruntled. But yeah I'm sure we wouldn't be the only one's sniffing around which would surely drive-up his price.

[Ghost Dog]

Historically, we have been able to get deals done with Sydney and Geelong. So based on that, are there any players with either clubs who are starved of opportunities?

[FrediKanoute]

Butcher......would allow us to play Jones up the field. Give them a couple of first round draft picks.....

[comrade]

Historically, we have been able to get deals done with Sydney and Geelong. So based on that, are there any players with either clubs who are starved of opportunities?

I'm sick of being a dumping ground for Geelong's fringe players.

[Ghost Dog]

I'm sick of being a dumping ground for Geelong's fringe players.

Well, the fringe players are all we can usually afford.

[Grantysghost]

I'm sick of being a dumping ground for Geelong's fringe players.

Yeah it doesn't work the other way.....They develop their own and create their own success. Only Ottens and Mooney come to mind as traded in players. I guess Pods as a late bloomer too. We now have the chance to do the same.

[ledge]

Big fan of Bate, goes hard and wont die wondering.

[Mofra]

Butcher......would allow us to play Jones up the field. Give them a couple of first round draft picks.....
I'm in isolation on the "no" to Butcher camp it seems, but if we are going to part with two first round picks for a guy who has played 3 games of AFL football I think we've lost it as a club.

I'd much rather use a first rounder on the best available tall if we're that desperate for one an use the second on the best available. Our best tall forward prospect and our best young ruckman were a second round picks anyway.

[Go_Dogs]

He is exactly what we need.

Another young player with a bung knee?

I agree he'd be exactly the type we need, just cautious regarding how his rehab is progressing, especially with our history with patella injuries, makes me nervous.

[Mofra]

Another young player with a bung knee?

I agree he'd be exactly the type we need, just cautious regarding how his rehab is progressing, especially with our history with patella injuries, makes me nervous.
We did knock back two rookies last year because they didn't pass the medical, so we must have some track record in our due diligence.

Selwood had knee issues before his was drafted IIRC - Geelong assessed him as acceptable and they've won out there.

[Go_Dogs]

I'm in isolation on the "no" to Butcher camp it seems, but if we are going to part with two first round picks for a guy who has played 3 games of AFL football I think we've lost it as a club.

Incredible the think about a month ago there was lot of speculation about Butcher being a wasted selection. He's going to be a player, I think that much is certain. He has some elite strengths for a big guy, but still has a lot of improvement to become a top quality key position player.

Giving up 2 first round picks for a still raw, tall would be stupid. If we want another tall forward (which I don't think we really need) surely the best bet is to draft one rather than pay overs.

He'll sign with Port anyway. Surely.

[Go_Dogs]

We did knock back two rookies last year because they didn't pass the medical, so we must have some track record in our due diligence.

Selwood had knee issues before his was drafted IIRC - Geelong assessed him as acceptable and they've won out there.

Agreed.

You are right on Selwood, but really, I don't think it's an exact science (although I'm not claiming to have any medical knowledge about how these things can be assessed) - Trengove slipped to Port due to concerns regarding his injuries, and he's come right too.

Perhaps I'm reading too much into it, but could it be a reason for Collingwood offering a shorter term, smaller monetary contract to Brown?

[Go_Dogs]

Players I'd be interested in having a look at who may currently be under-valued:

Urquhart - very keen to have a look
Suban - as above
Ellis - as above
Bower - as above
Salopek - could do with a change of scenery
Butler - query his body + age
Gumbleton - query body

[DOG GOD]

Players I'd be interested in having a look at who may currently be under-valued:

Urquhart - very keen to have a look
Suban - as above
Ellis - as above
Bower - as above
Salopek - could do with a change of scenery
Butler - query his body + age
Gumbleton - query body

Urquhart is interesting, but would he stop the development of players like Howard, Tutt and Schofield?

Suban can kick the ball at least but would he fall into the above category?

Bower i would be interested in IF we got a good deal to get him.

Butler - no, too slow.
Salopek - too slow and injury plagued
Gumbleton - if we could get him cheap, which i doubt dons would let him go for that.

So i would like to take a look at Bower and Suban if we wanted to strengthen our backline.

[the banker]

I'm in isolation on the "no" to Butcher camp it seems, but if we are going to part with two first round picks for a guy who has played 3 games of AFL football I think we've lost it as a club.

I'd much rather use a first rounder on the best available tall if we're that desperate for one an use the second on the best available. Our best tall forward prospect and our best young ruckman were a second round picks anyway.

I'm with you, Mofra. Reminds me of Ken McGregor.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

I'm with you, Mofra. Reminds me of Ken McGregor.

Butcher may well become a player, but I'm averse to having to pay overs for a bloke who has played 4 games of senior AFL football. Who knows where his career will go??

How many of our own blokes over the years have started out really well in their first few games only to fade away to obscurity as quickly as they came? John Georgiadis is one that springs to mind. Thought he was going to be an absolute star after his first game. only played a handful of games and was gone not long after.

[Maddog37]

Butcher will be ok but there is a lot of hoopla about him at present that is a touch over the top considering his achievements thus far.

[Yankee Hotel Foxtrot]

Butcher will be ok but there is a lot of hoopla about him at present that is a touch over the top considering his achievements thus far.

And tha'ts my issue. If he'd been doing this for a couple of seasons now so we could get a barometer on him, then I would'nt mind forking out for him. But his trade value at the moment based on 3 or 4 games is going to be well inflated and would be a far too risky trade to consider.

[Remi Moses]

Players I'd be interested in having a look at who may currently be under-valued:

Urquhart - very keen to have a look
Suban - as above
Ellis - as above
Bower - as above
Salopek - could do with a change of scenery
Butler - query his body + age
Gumbleton - query body

Urquhart( no thanks, can't kick)
Gumbleton ( can't get on the park
Butler( rarely plays ) injury prone
Salopek( needs a change, but once again seems injured often)
Ellis( good kick, phased out by Hawks having similar players)
Bower( uncoordinated)
Suban ( okay definite look)

[NoParkingOnMatchDays]

With the draft compensation for Ward, the coin we set aside for him over the next three years and Brain Lake to be traded (trust me on this one) Fantasia should have a bit to work with come trade time. Bit scary that last bit when you think about it.

[Remi Moses]

With the draft compensation for Ward, the coin we set aside for him over the next three years and Brain Lake to be traded (trust me on this one) Fantasia should have a bit to work with come trade time. Bit scary that last bit when you think about it.

So who would take Lake's contract?
Can't see it personally

[Pickenitup]

Lake will def be at ther Dogs Lock that in.
I would be Interested in Warnock From Melbourne Extra defender to Release lake to Play Forward.
Keen to have a look at Bate and possibly Macaffer from the Pies he is out of contract and is a very good player.

[hujsh]

Brain Lake to be traded (trust me on this one) .


Lake will def be at ther Dogs Lock that in.

Now I don't know what to believe

[KT31]

Now I don't know what to believe

I suppose at the end of the day it is Lake's and the Clubs desision.
He is qualitity and if on touch next season would make a HUGE difference.

[Remi Moses]

Now I don't know what to believe

He'll be there hujsh. We'd want a first round early pick, and with Brians contract just can't see it!

[mjp]

How the article missed Matthew Bate and Paul Bower I don't know - they're the only two potential trades I've heard actually linked to the Bulldogs.

Bower will re-sign at Carlton in the next couple of weeks.

Bate? Given our primary requirement right now is leg-speed, I just cannot see this. If we want a Bate 'type', why not just draft someone like Haiden Schloithe with a late pick/rookie selection? Played well at the 18's carnival and making an impact for South Freo at senior level since his return...

[LostDoggy]

I suppose at the end of the day it is Lake's and the Clubs desision.
He is qualitity and if on touch next season would make a HUGE difference.

We can't win the flag next year as we need to get games into the kids.

How about - Lake to Carlton to use at either FB or FF for serious draft picks. Gives them a chance at a premiership which they don't seem to quite have now.

Early 1st round draft pick + second rounder for Butcher. If he wants to come home then Port would have to consider it.

We use all other 1st rounders (hopefully 2 bonus from Ward) on midfielders in the 2012 draft

Any remaining picks for '11 and '12 drafts on strengthening the backline.

[Pickenitup]

Make no mistake Lake Will Be At The Club The Club will not even consider a Trade .
You Do Not Trade All Australian FullBacks No Matter What.
Lake Himself wants to Stay At The Club FACT.

[LostDoggy]

Make no mistake Lake Will Be At The Club The Club will not even consider a Trade .
You Do Not Trade All Australian FullBacks No Matter What.
Lake Himself wants to Stay At The Club FACT.

Might be "FACT" (? I'm going to assume you manage Brian's contract...) doesn't mean it's the right thing to do. We want to win a flag and this might be the best way to go about it. Both Brian and the club should consider whether they could both achieve that ultimate aim through a mutually beneficient trade exchange. We all love Brian and he has earned the right (IMO) to have a say in this. It would be foolish not to consider the options.

[Mofra]

Bower will re-sign at Carlton in the next couple of weeks.

Bate? Given our primary requirement right now is leg-speed, I just cannot see this. If we want a Bate 'type', why not just draft someone like Haiden Schloithe with a late pick/rookie selection? Played well at the 18's carnival and making an impact for South Freo at senior level since his return...
Schloithe? Haven't heard of him, much more to add mjp? Seems a bullocking/larger framed type?

[FrediKanoute]

And tha'ts my issue. If he'd been doing this for a couple of seasons now so we could get a barometer on him, then I would'nt mind forking out for him. But his trade value at the moment based on 3 or 4 games is going to be well inflated and would be a far too risky trade to consider.

Maybe, but the other way you coulc look at it is a guy who has had limited opportunity has finally gotten his body right and is emerging as the premier forward of the next decade. I would have a look.

[ledge]

Bower will re-sign at Carlton in the next couple of weeks.

Bate? Given our primary requirement right now is leg-speed, I just cannot see this. If we want a Bate 'type', why not just draft someone like Haiden Schloithe with a late pick/rookie selection? Played well at the 18's carnival and making an impact for South Freo at senior level since his return...

I think our primary requirement is the spine CHF, CHB.

[azabob]

I think our primary requirement is the spine CHF, CHB.

It is an interesting one. Outside midfielder with pace to break the lines and away from the packs with great skills would also be very very handy.

[LostDoggy]

It is an interesting one. Outside midfielder with pace to break the lines and away from the packs with great skills would also be very very handy.

I'm pretty happy with the way Jones is developing but Cooney is probably gone except for cameo midfield but more regular HFF roles and Griffin simply can't do it alone. We need to draft at least 2 quick, strong, skillful, outside mids that we can develop over the next 3 years or we are sunk long term. Even if I'm wrong about Cooney we still need them IMO.

[stefoid]

FWIW, on MMM they were talking about GWS taking on a number of 30yos to keep kids spots warm while they developed for a year or two. Like Luke Power. A ruckman such as Brogan was also mentioned. Decent players, but with a near term with a use-by date.

Who would have the cashola to pay Lakes salary? GWS.

Id rather Lake stay, get fit, find form and play 4 more years of great footy for us.

[1eyedog]

I am still very interested in Dangerfield.

[BulldogBelle]

I am still very interested in Dangerfield.


Agree.

Our midfield has been woeful at times this season, unwilling to chase, tackle and harass - and our disposal/skills under pressure has been outright disgusting at times.... our priority should be to draft some decent outside players as with Libba and Wallis we will hopefully have 2 premier inside mids in the coming seasons - we should also be looking to trade for a decent mid like Dangerfield also.

[1eyedog]

Agree.

Our midfield has been woeful at times this season, unwilling to chase, tackle and harass - and our disposal/skills under pressure has been outright disgusting at times.... our priority should be to draft some decent outside players as with Libba and Wallis we will hopefully have 2 premier inside mids in the coming seasons - we should also be looking to trade for a decent mid like Dangerfield also.

He's half the player that Cooney is at his best but if we can woo him over he will help compensate the loss of Ward and help out Griff.

Griffen, Dangerfield and intermittent appearances by Cooney makes the midfield look okay on paper. In addition, our second string midfield in Cross, Boyd and Libba, while one-paced is a strong defensive midfield. You would expect that Cooney's role in the middle is going to roll right back next year and with the loss of Ward we really need to look at an established young mid outside a key back.

I know Dangerfield is inconsistent but he is young and is going to get better.

[chef]

Apparently Jack Gunston wants to be traded back to Victoria. Young KF who would be worth a look at.

[LongWait]

In addition, our second string midfield in Cross, Boyd and Libba, while one-paced is a strong defensive midfield.

In my view this would have to be just about the worst defensive midfield unit in the AFL.

[Swoop]

In my view this would have to be just about the worst defensive midfield unit in the AFL.
Obviously the game has changed since 1997 but I see a similar situation to when Wallace came in and asked Liberatore to change his role. At the time Libba was a footballer with limitations and being exposed in the modern game, Wallace re-defined his role and asked him to play a defensive role which played to his strengths.

Cross & Boyd are in similar boats, both have the attributes to be great defensively minded players and they have played these roles previously with success however we can't be upset at them for playing roles they have been assigned by the coaches. Both have been encouraged to ball hunt as opposed to negate and they have been rewarded with accolades from their coaches as judged by their best and fairest placings, so it is hard to be critical of them for doing what they have been asked. Having said that both players appear to be the types that would do anything the coaches ask and I have seen both perform blanket jobs on quality opponents before, hopefully a new coach can identify this area as a weakness and actually turn it into a strength.

None of the current trendsetters in Collingwood, Geelong & Hawthorn adopt a genuine negating tagger however St Kilda still use 2 so there is debate as to whether the role is still relevant in modern day football when the focus is on team defence but that may be a seperate argument .

[stefoid]

I like Pickens attitude but Im not sold on 'carrying' a pure tagger.

I like the 'everybody attacks, everybody defends' mentality, based on the theory that the best form of defence is attack - Pickens opponents never have to worry about where Picken is or what he is doing, they can just concentrate on their own game exclusively.

It might actually hurt their game more if they had to worry about what Picken was up to as well. When we get the ball at a stoppage, we are playing a man down with our run and spread because speedy Picken is standing next to his man rather than providing an option.

[bornadog]

I like Pickens attitude but Im not sold on 'carrying' a pure tagger.

I like the 'everybody attacks, everybody defends' mentality, based on the theory that the best form of defence is attack - Pickens opponents never have to worry about where Picken is or what he is doing, they can just concentrate on their own game exclusively.

It might actually hurt their game more if they had to worry about what Picken was up to as well. When we get the ball at a stoppage, we are playing a man down with our run and spread because speedy Picken is standing next to his man rather than providing an option.

I agree the tagger is finished in the AFL

[mjp]

I agree the tagger is finished in the AFL

Not so fast.

If you zone, you cannot tag.

But what if you have a different plan?

[LostDoggy]

I'm in isolation on the "no" to Butcher camp it seems, but if we are going to part with two first round picks for a guy who has played 3 games of AFL football I think we've lost it as a club.

I'd much rather use a first rounder on the best available tall if we're that desperate for one an use the second on the best available. Our best tall forward prospect and our best young ruckman were a second round picks anyway.

I've been very vocal against the Butcher suggestion in a couple of other threads. I'm not even sold on him as a player, much less a 'premier forward of the AFL for the next decade'. TWO picks, including an EARLY first round, some are suggesting? That's around what Carlton paid for Judd in his prime, and some still think it was overs.

Tippett was going to be the 'next great forward', then Jesse White, now Butcher, but now no one wants Tippett or White but everyone wants Butcher? For first round draft picks? Geez people go early.

[comrade]

I've been very vocal against the Butcher suggestion in a couple of other threads. I'm not even sold on him as a player, much less a 'premier forward of the AFL for the next decade'. TWO picks, including an EARLY first round, some are suggesting? That's around what Carlton paid for Judd in his prime, and some still think it was overs.

Tippett was going to be the 'next great forward', then Jesse White, now Butcher, but now no one wants Tippett or White but everyone wants Butcher? For first round draft picks? Geez people go early.

Ha, you've convinced me.

We are in dire need for classy mids and some good tall defensive cover. I'd like to use our early picks on these types.

[Greystache]

I've been very vocal against the Butcher suggestion in a couple of other threads. I'm not even sold on him as a player, much less a 'premier forward of the AFL for the next decade'. TWO picks, including an EARLY first round, some are suggesting? That's around what Carlton paid for Judd in his prime, and some still think it was overs.

Tippett was going to be the 'next great forward', then Jesse White, now Butcher, but now no one wants Tippett or White but everyone wants Butcher? For first round draft picks? Geez people go early.

Our first round draft pick is 17, 2 places lower than in 2009 when we made the prelim final. No one outside of GWS, GC, or Port will get anything close to an early draft pick this year.

If you're going to trade a first round draft pick this is the year, their perceived value will be much higher than their true worth.

[LostDoggy]

If you zone, you cannot tag.


I think the next revolution in footy strategy is going to come from successfully integrating the two systems, as soccer did some years ago. (Before anyone gets their hackles up, we're essentially following the exact same tactical trend that soccer did from the '60s to the '90s. Okay, jargon alert: Zonal defence with a forward press, expressed generally in a 4-4-2 formation was developed by English and Spanish clubs in the '70s and '80s almost in direct response to defensive man-marking systems developed in Italy, but the modern 4-2-3-1 developed in the late '90s in Spain -- and has been almost universally adopted, with local variations of course, by top teams everywhere -- as a very flexible system which allows for both zonal marking AND man-marking to be going on in real-time depending on moment-to-moment match situations. It is an incredibly effective attacking formation that also allows for quick defensive transitions, and the midfield configuration allows for natural zonal marking but also leaves defensive mids close enough to their opponents, and with enough cover around them, to man-mark (ie. tag, in footy terminology) if necessary. I've necessarily simplified everything for brevity -- strategy isn't just about formations of course -- but footy has yet to come up with a system that effectively combines the two extremes... we seem to have to 'switch' systems mid-game from one to the other instead of having a more holistic, flexible one).

[LongWait]

Not so fast.

If you zone, you cannot tag.

But what if you have a different plan?

You can both zone and tag. This has happened plenty of times this year, including on the weekend. The zone you set is adjusted to account for one less player in it (ie the tagger or taggers.)

Ask Judd and Swan if they have been tagged this season.

[Mofra]

I've been very vocal against the Butcher suggestion in a couple of other threads. I'm not even sold on him as a player, much less a 'premier forward of the AFL for the next decade'. TWO picks, including an EARLY first round, some are suggesting? That's around what Carlton paid for Judd in his prime, and some still think it was overs.

Tippett was going to be the 'next great forward', then Jesse White, now Butcher, but now no one wants Tippett or White but everyone wants Butcher? For first round draft picks? Geez people go early.
Carlton also paid a gun forward - arguably, they'd be a more dangerous team with Kennedy & Masten than they would with Judd.

Agree on the paying overs - Butcher has played one game against a unit with a defence and struggled. Jury is out for mine and nowhere near 2 first rounders' worth.

[bornadog]

Not so fast.

If you zone, you cannot tag.

But what if you have a different plan?

The number of rotations also make it difficult to tag, but yeah if you have a different plan you could use a tagger .

[bornadog]

You can both zone and tag. This has happened plenty of times this year, including on the weekend. The zone you set is adjusted to account for one less player in it (ie the tagger or taggers.)

Ask Judd and Swan if they have been tagged this season.

but in a zone situation, what is the point of the tag? If you have the ball then you are better off to release the tagger to spread, not stick with his man. If you don't have the ball then you are applying a press, again the tagger is just one of the players pressing, but he isnot really supposed to be tagging under this scenario.

[LongWait]

but in a zone situation, what is the point of the tag? If you have the ball then you are better off to release the tagger to spread, not stick with his man. If you don't have the ball then you are applying a press, again the tagger is just one of the players pressing, but he isnot really supposed to be tagging under this scenario.

A number of teams that apply a zone also tag - Geelong, Carlton, Sydney and Essendon do it regularly. The point is that the zone is released almost immediately after the opposition gain/regain/keep possession - if Judd is not picked up immediately, guess who gets the next possession and proceeds to tear you a new one?

[stefoid]

Id just like to see Picken graduate to an all round midfielder - hes quick, hes hard at it, he has good concentration, and he can kick the ball.

[Mofra]

Id just like to see Picken graduate to an all round midfielder - hes quick, hes hard at it, he has good concentration, and he can kick the ball.
Defensive forward? He's been able to find the goals from the pockets when given a chance. He kicked two in a quarter on Delideo IIRC - he can play a few roles.

[Bulldog Revolution]

I wonder if Jesse White is worth inquiring about

Hasn't cemented himself as Sydneys forward under his second coach

I've not seen a lot of him but he has looked a good prospect in the little I've seen

[Sockeye Salmon]

Defensive forward? He's been able to find the goals from the pockets when given a chance. He kicked two in a quarter on Delideo IIRC - he can play a few roles.

Defensive forward is a euphorism for being crap.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

I wonder if Jesse White is worth inquiring about

Hasn't cemented himself as Sydneys forward under his second coach

I've not seen a lot of him but he has looked a good prospect in the little I've seen

He's an interesting one. However, he really hasn't done much at all in recent seasons.

I'm positive he would still cost a fair bit ... so it's probably a no.

[Happy Days]

Defensive forward is a euphorism for being crap.

It's the 2010's version of "reinvented in a run with role"

[The Underdog]

Defensive forward is a euphorism for being crap.

Is that a euphoric aphorism?

[Sockeye Salmon]

Is that a euphoric aphorism?

:D

The spellcheck told me it was wrong but I was so far away it didn't even give me any realistic alternatives.

[Greystache]

I was trying to work out if it was supposed to be an aphorism or a euphemism. :D

[LostDoggy]

Havent gone through this whole thread. But has anyone mentioned Tuck from Richmond? Seemed to be out a favour, came back and ripped it up. He may want out if a nice offer from a decent team comes about (i.e. Doggies)?

[Greystache]

Havent gone through this whole thread. But has anyone mentioned Tuck from Richmond? Seemed to be out a favour, came back and ripped it up. He may want out if a nice offer from a decent team comes about (i.e. Doggies)?

A slow inside midfielder with poor kicking skills is about the last thing I would want at the moment.

[Hot_Doggies]

I wonder if Jesse White is worth inquiring about

Hasn't cemented himself as Sydneys forward under his second coach

I've not seen a lot of him but he has looked a good prospect in the little I've seen


I wouldn't worry about Jesse White.


We need a Gary Rohan more.....

[LostDoggy]

A slow inside midfielder with poor kicking skills is about the last thing I would want at the moment.

I'll admit ive only seen him play twice, but looked the goods in those games

[1eyedog]

A slow inside midfielder with poor kicking skills is about the last thing I would want at the moment.

Yep another Reid.

[Maddog37]

Tuck signed a one year deal with Tiggers this week.

What about the other Tuck?

[Mofra]

A slow inside midfielder with poor kicking skills is about the last thing I would want at the moment.
I'd go further and say any inside midfielder is someone we don't need at present - we're realistically looking at shedding two over trade week as they're surplus to our needs.

[Mantis]

I'd go further and say any inside midfielder is someone we don't need at present - we're realistically looking at shedding two over trade week as they're surplus to our needs.

I thought we were shedding them because they aren't up to scratch?

[Mofra]

I thought we were shedding them because they aren't up to scratch?
A little from both columns really - DFA & Reid could play as serviceable players but they are behind too many on our list.

[stefoid]

I would have an opportunistic crack at Danyle Pearce, if he was willing to nominate us as a preferred club kind of thing. 2nd round pick kind of thing.

He is inconsistent, but his good games are pretty good. Change of scenery and all that.

[Mofra]

I would have an opportunistic crack at Danyle Pearce, if he was willing to nominate us as a preferred club kind of thing. 2nd round pick kind of thing.
His finishing skills would be quite welcome at the Bulldogs - when he's on, he's on in a big way

[PaddyWhack]

Tuck signed a one year deal with Tiggers this week.

What about the other Tuck?

Michael?

[1eyedog]

His finishing skills would be quite welcome at the Bulldogs - when he's on, he's on in a big way

Would not be adverse to this. Has a tendency to lose interest if things are not going well for the team on game day though. Welcome to half our club :rolleyes:

[Mofra]

Would not be adverse to this. Has a tendency to lose interest if things are not going well for the team on game day though. Welcome to half our club :rolleyes:
Get him in, sit him down with Jarrad Grant and a hypnotist :cool:

[LostDoggy]

Would not be adverse to this. Has a tendency to lose interest if things are not going well for the team on game day though. Welcome to half our club :rolleyes:

I thought we were pretty good at coming back from massive deficits -- our problem seems to be more switching on at the start, and finishing things off, not giving up.

[Maddog37]

Michael?

No. The other, other Tuck.

[Topdog]

No. The other, other Tuck.

The 3 strikes one?

[Maddog37]

Travis. Yes

[Topdog]

hell no.

[Maddog37]

hell no.


Because of the off field or on field?

[1eyedog]

I thought we were pretty good at coming back from massive deficits -- our problem seems to be more switching on at the start, and finishing things off, not giving up.

I was referring to certain individuals, rather than the ability of the team as a whole (where certain core players get us back into the match).

[Bulldog Revolution]

He's an interesting one. However, he really hasn't done much at all in recent seasons.

I'm positive he would still cost a fair bit ... so it's probably a no.

He hasn't, and he might cost a bit

I guess a second round pick would be fair for him. I cant say I'm sure he'd be worth it.

The interesting thing is how many other players they've preferred over him in recent times, Bradshaw, Reid, even LRT up forward on occasions, which maybe says they dont think hes very good.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

He hasn't, and he might cost a bit

I guess a second round pick would be fair for him. I cant say I'm sure he'd be worth it.

The interesting thing is how many other players they've preferred over him in recent times, Bradshaw, Reid, even LRT up forward on occasions, which maybe says they dont think hes very good.

Yep, and yet at times he certainly shows some special qualities. He can take a pack mark and has surprised me at ground level a few times ... but as you say, if LRT is getting a game over you - that says it all.

He's still young so I think Sydney would see him as being of more value to them, hence perhaps putting an early first round pick (for example) on his head.

Worth asking about but I wouldn't want to be giving a whole lot up.

[LostDoggy]

Yep, and yet at times he certainly shows some special qualities. He can take a pack mark and has surprised me at ground level a few times ... but as you say, if LRT is getting a game over you - that says it all.

He's still young so I think Sydney would see him as being of more value to them, hence perhaps putting an early first round pick (for example) on his head.

Worth asking about but I wouldn't want to be giving a whole lot up.

Jesse White is a young Travis Cloke. He may be struggling a bit this season but he's certainly a far more accomplished player than fad-of-the-month Butcher, who is apparently worth 2 first round picks and more than Judd.

If we get him anywhere near cheap (2nd round would be well under) I wouldn't think twice.

[Sedat]

Yep, and yet at times he certainly shows some special qualities. He can take a pack mark and has surprised me at ground level a few times ... but as you say, if LRT is getting a game over you - that says it all.
And now Spangher is ahead of him in the pecking order, who has never played as a key forward in his life until this year.

The Jesse White conundrum reminds me of the one faced by Jerry Seinfeld when he was dating that attractive woman who was previously dumped by Newman - there simply has to be something wrong despite appearances.

[LostDoggy]

The Jesse White conundrum reminds me of the one faced by Jerry Seinfeld when he was dating that attractive woman who was previously dumped by Newman - there simply has to be something wrong despite appearances.

I've dated plenty of hot, smart women who other guys were too shallow to appreciate, so I'm happy to take the punt haha.

The reality was that Clokey was up and down too 4/5 years ago -- the ferals were calling up SEN every week demanding he be traded. Whitey is fast, can take a grab, can kick, has 'presence' (for want of a better word)... who knows, maybe he hit on Longmire's missus.

I would suggest injury niggles and probably a poor fitness base.

[LostDoggy]

Longmire's also suggested the sub rule may have had something to do with it -- probably getting killed as a second ruck destroyed his confidence.

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/swans-in-bigman-worry-on-white-20110501-1e33a.html

[Remi Moses]

No thanks to White.
If you can't get a game ahead of Sphanger in a forward line you're battling.

[Grantysghost]

Butcher re-signed
-----------------------
Port Adelaide young gun John Butcher has signed a two-year contract with the club following teammates Jackson Trengove and Alipate Carlisle. Butcher's signing comes after recent approaches from several Melbourne clubs, including Carlton and Richmond, and is a major show of faith for Port after a dismal season.

[Mofra]

Butcher re-signed
-----------------------
Port Adelaide young gun John Butcher has signed a two-year contract with the club following teammates Jackson Trengove and Alipate Carlisle. Butcher's signing comes after recent approaches from several Melbourne clubs, including Carlton and Richmond, and is a major show of faith for Port after a dismal season.
In a way - good.

We'd be (potentially) throwing away two draft picks on a kid who may/may not be as good at Liam Jones. He's had two years in the system - draft our own, thanks.

[LostDoggy]

What are your thoughts on picking up Joel Houghton a tall KP from Freo was delisted today thought he might be worth looking at.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bcfsx7HrWzI

[GVGjr]

What are your thoughts on picking up Joel Houghton a tall KP from Freo was delisted today thought he might be worth looking at.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bcfsx7HrWzI
Where do you see him fitting in?

[Swoop]

What are your thoughts on picking up Joel Houghton a tall KP from Freo was delisted today thought he might be worth looking at.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bcfsx7HrWzI
I would prefer to look at a state player who is doing all the right things to earn a shot at AFL level as opposed to a player who has the opportunity on an AFL list and hasn't taken it.

I know it's a generic statement but in this scenario Houghton hasn't done anything to make Freo want to keep him and it's not like he wouldn't have had opportunities in their injury riddled season.

[LostDoggy]

http://www.afl.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/208/newsid/123004/default.aspx


Meeting needs


By Jason Phelan 3:17 PM Thu 08 Sep, 2011

Western Bulldogs NAB AFL Draft selection No.17
With Jarrod Harbrow's departure and Lindsay Gilbee's struggles, the Dogs could do with a bit more run and carry out of defence and Gippsland Power defender Sam Docherty can do just that. The 183cm half-back flanker takes the kick-ins for the Power and burst onto the scene for Vic Country with two games left in the champs. His ability to find a target would be an asset right out of the box for the Bulldogs. The injury issues of Brian Lake and Tom Williams might see the Dogs go for a tall defender, with Talia an option around this pick.

[The Adelaide Connection]

Jack Gunston has allegedly quit the crows and has told the club he wants to go back to Victoria. Pretty sure he is out of contract. Should we be keen?

From what I have seen of him I would say a big yes. Quick, 193cm, knows where the goals are and has good hands. Should have a bit of room in the cap with Ward leaving and would be able to accommodate him.

[chef]

Jack Gunston has allegedly quit the crows and has told the club he wants to go back to Victoria. Pretty sure he is out of contract. Should we be keen?

From what I have seen of him I would say a big yes. Quick, 193cm, knows where the goals are and has good hands. Should have a bit of room in the cap with Ward leaving and would be able to accommodate him.

Straight swap for Howard?

[Ghost Dog]

Gunston

Back in 2009 he looked like this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aSxvSug1RUw

[DOG GOD]

Jack Gunston has allegedly quit the crows and has told the club he wants to go back to Victoria. Pretty sure he is out of contract. Should we be keen?

From what I have seen of him I would say a big yes. Quick, 193cm, knows where the goals are and has good hands. Should have a bit of room in the cap with Ward leaving and would be able to accommodate him.

Very interested. Looks the goods.

[mjp]

What are your thoughts on picking up Joel Houghton a tall KP from Freo was delisted today thought he might be worth looking at.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bcfsx7HrWzI

No. And again, my reply is now more than 4 characters.

He might be tall but referring to him as a kpp is a stretch. If you want players from the Perth Footy Club, pick a real KPP - Haydn Busher. If you know about Houghton, you should be all over Busher. If you want others from the Perth Footy Club, try Michael Florio - a 190cm running wingman who has had a ripping season in the WAFL and is a truly elite runner.

[mjp]

I think all the player clips on YouTube should be replaced by 'player cuts that show why this player was delisted' as opposed to 'things the player did three years ago that made a recruiter somewhere think he was worth picking'.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

I think all the player clips on YouTube should be replaced by 'player cuts that show why this player was delisted' as opposed to 'things the player did three years ago that made a recruiter somewhere think he was worth picking'.

Have you seen much of Gunston mjp?

I know nothing about him, what would he even command?

[Sedat]

Jack Gunston has allegedly quit the crows and has told the club he wants to go back to Victoria. Pretty sure he is out of contract. Should we be keen?

From what I have seen of him I would say a big yes. Quick, 193cm, knows where the goals are and has good hands. Should have a bit of room in the cap with Ward leaving and would be able to accommodate him.
I'm not that keen. He's a mark and kick type who is a bit of a non-factor as soon as the ball hits the deck. He's not a monster either. He could definitely develop into something more but I would have thought someone like a Panos has a very similar skill set to Gunston and we already have him on our list (albeit as a rookie).

[The Coon Dog]

Jonathon Griffin at Freo wants to return to Adelaide & with Port needing a ruckman he might find a home at Alberton with Daniel Motlop being mentioned as going the other way.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Jonathon Griffin at Freo wants to return to Adelaide & with Port needing a ruckman he might find a home at Alberton with Daniel Motlop being mentioned as going the other way.

Most overrated footballer in the land, at least in media circles.

He's a spud.

[The Adelaide Connection]

Most overrated footballer in the land, at least in media circles.

He's a spud.

When he is 'on' he rivals Cyril Rioli for skills, speed and magic. Unfortunately these days he spends most of his time 'off' with his hands on his hips, he rarely turned up this season.

[soupman]

Jonathon Griffin at Freo wants to return to Adelaide & with Port needing a ruckman he might find a home at Alberton with Daniel Motlop being mentioned as going the other way.

Make up your mind. didn't he request a trade to Perth just last year?

[LostDoggy]

When he is 'on' he rivals Cyril Rioli for skills, speed and magic. Unfortunately these days he spends most of his time 'off' with his hands on his hips, he rarely turned up this season.

Reminds me of the Dogs/Port game this year. First player I saw with his hands on his hips in giving up mode as if he had tried all day which he hadn't.

[1eyedog]

When he is 'on' he rivals Cyril Rioli for skills, speed and magic. Unfortunately these days he spends most of his time 'off' with his hands on his hips, he rarely turned up this season.

and Jarrod Grant for commitment

[Topdog]

Most overrated footballer in the land, at least in media circles.

He's a spud.

I was about to say he isn't as overrated as .......


When he is 'on' he rivals Cyril Rioli for skills, speed and magic.

Is there a guy that produces less that is such a "champion" of the competition?

[Remi Moses]

Make up your mind. didn't he request a trade to Perth just last year?

I think he forgot They've got someone called Sandilands there!
Good fit for port, can't fathom why Richmond would make a play for Maric and not Griffin.

[Ghost Dog]

When he is 'on' he rivals Cyril Rioli for skills, speed and magic. Unfortunately these days he spends most of his time 'off' with his hands on his hips, he rarely turned up this season.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rRhwPxVP0uw

Pretty talented, while not always team oriented.

[kruder]

Straight swap for Howard?

Nope not Howard. He is one of the few run and spread types we have. I think next year will be the year he cements himself in the midfeild.

[Throughandthrough]

Is spread the most used word in.footy for the last three months

[mjp]

Is spread the most used word in.footy for the last three months

Most used word in coaching for the last 3 years.

I would have said 'PRESS' was the most used word for the past 12-months.

[The Adelaide Connection]

I was about to say he isn't as overrated as .......



Is there a guy that produces less that is such a "champion" of the competition?

Cyril is probably overrated in media circles, much the same way that Franklin can be, but you can see why. Both have the ability to turn games in the blink of an eye in freakish ways. They only have to show up for ten minutes some weeks and they will nearly get best on.

[Maddog37]

Most used word in coaching for the last 3 years.

I would have said 'PRESS' was the most used word for the past 12-months.

Structures and process are pretty high on the rotation too.

[Ghost Dog]

Cyril is probably overrated in media circles, much the same way that Franklin can be, but you can see why. Both have the ability to turn games in the blink of an eye in freakish ways. They only have to show up for ten minutes some weeks and they will nearly get best on.

he generally gets the best tag, remember.

[1eyedog]

Structures and process are pretty high on the rotation too.

Yeah nah are still the most used words at the start of sentences though.

[Topdog]

Cyril is probably overrated in media circles, much the same way that Franklin can be, but you can see why. Both have the ability to turn games in the blink of an eye in freakish ways. They only have to show up for ten minutes some weeks and they will nearly get best on.

Unfortunately for Cyril besides the bye (Port) he hasn't shown up for nearly 3 months.

[Dogs87]

How does everyone feel about Patrick Dangerfield? Is he still currently out of contract?

[Swoop]

I think he forgot They've got someone called Sandilands there!
Good fit for port, can't fathom why Richmond would make a play for Maric and not Griffin.
Griffin went back to Perth due to his father being seriously ill.

[w3design]

Griffin went back to Perth due to his father being seriously ill.

Wasn't that Adelaide mate?

[anfo27]

How does everyone feel about Patrick Dangerfield? Is he still currently out of contract?

He's a kid with enormous talent that has been very inconsistent thus far. Would love to get him but so would every other Victorian club and would cost any club plenty. Would see him as a great fit at Essendon and would think they would move heaven and earth to get him.

[anfo27]

Wasn't that Adelaide mate?

No. He's a Perth boy and left Adelaide to be closer to home.

[ledge]

Be an awesome pick up.

[EasternWest]

Wasn't that Adelaide mate?

I think he's referring to Jonathan Griffin.

[w3design]

I think he's referring to Jonathan Griffin.

Ohhh that's what you get for not reading the whole thread.

[chef]

According to Barrett on TFS Matt Campbell, Pratt, Dawson, Ray, McGuane and Connors are all looking for new homes.

[LostDoggy]

Matt Warnock apparently wants out of Melbourne.

[1eyedog]

Port Adelaide look set to rule out a play for Minson (Today's Sun).

[LostDoggy]

Port Adelaide look set to rule out a play for Minson (Today's Sun).

I don't understand that one. I doubt we would be shopping him around just yet given the coach is a week old. Why would Port rule him out then? I think no means yes here.

[bulldogsman]

According to Barrett on TFS Matt Campbell, Pratt, Dawson, Ray, McGuane and Connors are all looking for new homes.

Of that list Matt Campbell would be nice, would allow Dahlhaus to play more in the midfield. McGuane might be a handy 3rd tall if he comes cheap.

[Mofra]

Matt Warnock apparently wants out of Melbourne.
Interested, would Melbourne want a lot though? I thought he was pretty highly rated there.

[The Coon Dog]

Interested, would Melbourne want a lot though? I thought he was pretty highly rated there.

I listened to Dermott Brereton talk about him this morning & his biggest knock is his use of the ball coming out of defence.

He said in a team with good distributors such as Hawthorn could carry a Warnock as there would be a purely negating role, but a Richmond couldn't as they have other defenders who also turn the ball over. His answer was in relation to why he wasn't getting a game at Melbourne.

[kruder]

What are peoples thoughts of Burns from Geelong?

[LostDoggy]

What are peoples thoughts of Burns from Geelong?

No, enough of geelong fringe players

[immortalmike]

What are peoples thoughts of Burns from Geelong?

Ronnie Burns still plays for Geelong??:cool:

[Maddog37]

He's good on that footy show.

[LostDoggy]

We dont need players from other clubs. Lets keeping introducing young blokes.

[the banker]

Doesn't look like any real quality is available and evryone wants overs. Best to look in the minor leagues, there have been some big winners from there recently.

[Remi Moses]

Watching tonight, what's happened to Clinton Young?

[bornadog]

We dont need players from other clubs. Lets keeping introducing young blokes.

I agree. I would prefer we just stick to drafting young players for the next two years.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Hawthorn should go hard for Lake and take the risk. Nothing to lose, everything to gain. Lake's value is low for a player of his calibre, and even though he's 30? he's well worth the punt for them.

Shoenmakers is not a defender.

[1eyedog]

Hawthorn should go hard for Lake and take the risk. Nothing to lose, everything to gain. Lake's value is low for a player of his calibre, and even though he's 30? he's well worth the punt for them.

Shoenmakers is not a defender.

Agree on Hawthorn making a play for Lake, he would do wonders for them, but as Vossy says the deal needs to be very fair.

He's 29 isn't he? Where do you see Shoenmakers? I think he looks okay for a young tall?

[Bulldog Revolution]

Watching tonight, what's happened to Clinton Young?

Had some injury problems, played 10 games this year

With Breust, Savage, Smith, Shiels developing he has lost his spot in the team

Likely to be traded/de-listed??

[Desipura]

We dont need players from other clubs. Lets keeping introducing young blokes.

Disagree with the franchise getting all the early picks this year we should look at trading player for player or our first round pick or 2nd round pick.
I would be keen to know what Dangerfields intentions are, we cannot rely on Cooney returning to his best and we lack pace in the midfield not to mention "A" graders. I do not think we have seen the best of Patrick, my only concern is whether he has the tank to be a regular midfielder.
Griffen needs a chop out, looking at the top teams, they have more than just a few top class players.
Keep the Ward compensation pick for the future unless we got a Godfather deal which is unlikely.

[LostDoggy]

I know a few people have mentioned that they don't want to trade for geelongs fringe players but I think Simon hogan would be a valuable addition to most afl sides and could offer us some grunt work and some outside pace which we need. Anybody have any thoughts?

[Desipura]

I know a few people have mentioned that they don't want to trade for geelongs fringe players but I think Simon hogan would be a valuable addition to most afl sides and could offer us some grunt work and some outside pace which we need. Anybody have any thoughts?

Solid suggestion. If my memory serves me correct, we did look at drafting Hogan at the time.

[Maddog37]

If anyone knows about the Cats list it is a certain newly appointed Dogs coach. You would think if he had any players he rates from the Cats he will chase them. I would love Trent West......

[Desipura]

If anyone knows about the Cats list it is a certain newly appointed Dogs coach. You would think if he had any players he rates from the Cats he will chase them. I would love Trent West......
No one wanted him 12 months ago when he was being shopped around.

[The Coon Dog]

I know a few people have mentioned that they don't want to trade for geelongs fringe players but I think Simon Hogan would be a valuable addition to most afl sides and could offer us some grunt work and some outside pace which we need. Anybody have any thoughts?

Was he the player that stopped playing for a while this season due to depression?

[bornadog]

Was he the player that stopped playing for a while this season due to depression?

Yes, thats right.

[AndrewP6]

Yes, thats right.

Yep that is him.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/geelongs-simon-hogan-puts-his-career-on-hold/story-e6frf9jf-1226047952767

[the banker]

Macca will know who from Geelong will suit us.

(Wonder what his opinion of DJ is.)

[ledge]

Macca will know who from Geelong will suit us.

(Wonder what his opinion of DJ is.)

And Visa versa, Moles too.

[azabob]

And Visa versa, Moles too.

And Peter Street and Tim Callan. Oh yeah they are gone already.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Definitely go for Hogan.

Some genuine potential.

[Sedat]

Scott Clayton was a fan of Hogan but Geelong pipped us with pick 57 in the 06 ND - we ended up getting Josh Hill with our next pick instead from memory.

[azabob]

What about Dennis-Lane and Seaby from Sydney?

Both could play a role for us.

Seaby may be cheap but I don't think Dennis-Lane would be.

[Desipura]

What about Dennis-Lane and Seaby from Sydney?

Both could play a role for us.

Seaby may be cheap but I don't think Dennis-Lane would be.
Why Dennis Lane? Hardly going to address our defensive pressure in the forward line. He and Vespa are similar types.

[ledge]

I think Dennis-Lane could be a gun.

[Rocco Jones]

I think Dennis-Lane could be a gun.

If footy turns into a non-contact sport I think you might well be right.

[G-Mo77]

A guy I was talking to today seems to think that Davey and Slattery could be on the move and the Bulldogs as a possible destination.

Probably just the usual fluff that gets thrown around this time of year but thought I would share.

[ledge]

If footy turns into a non-contact sport I think you might well be right.

Its nearly there now with the old push in the back gone and its just a touch with hands, you cant run in hard anymore due to a player putting his head down, got to the stage now if you even look at a player running back its a free kick.
Only sport I know you get a penalty against you for looking at someone!:D

[ledge]

A guy I was talking to today seems to think that Davey and Slattery could be on the move and the Bulldogs as a possible destination.

Probably just the usual fluff that gets thrown around this time of year but thought I would share.

What did we do wrong to possibly get offered Davey?
They would have to pay us his wage and our debt to take him.

[w3design]

What are people's thoughts on Farren Ray? I know in his first stint with us he was often maligned as a soft player & not always a great decision- maker but though I don't see a lot of saints games he seemed to me to have rectified these things. As a contemporary fo Griff and Coons he fits into that age bracket where we are weak and as an outside runner could complement our slow inside players. Any takers??

[BulldogBelle]

What are people's thoughts on Farren Ray? I know in his first stint with us he was often maligned as a soft player & not always a great decision- maker but though I don't see a lot of saints games he seemed to me to have rectified these things. As a contemporary fo Griff and Coons he fits into that age bracket where we are weak and as an outside runner could complement our slow inside players. Any takers??

At the right price, absolutely!

He's definitely part of what we need right now. I'd love him back.

This cannot prevent us from hunting another Dangerfield type however.

[Greystache]

What are people's thoughts on Farren Ray? I know in his first stint with us he was often maligned as a soft player & not always a great decision- maker but though I don't see a lot of saints games he seemed to me to have rectified these things. As a contemporary fo Griff and Coons he fits into that age bracket where we are weak and as an outside runner could complement our slow inside players. Any takers??

Not for me. We shouldn't recruit anyone who's not quick and can't kick, Farren fits both those categories.

[The Coon Dog]

Not for me. We shouldn't recruit anyone who's not quick and can't kick, Farren fits both those categories.

Spot on, seems to go OK when using the ball by hand, but puts team mates under the pump by foot.

[EasternWest]

What are people's thoughts on Farren Ray? I know in his first stint with us he was often maligned as a soft player & not always a great decision- maker but though I don't see a lot of saints games he seemed to me to have rectified these things. As a contemporary fo Griff and Coons he fits into that age bracket where we are weak and as an outside runner could complement our slow inside players. Any takers??

Nope. Not for me.

I've got nothing against Ray. The Saints used him well, which is why his MO was always a sideways handball to a better kick. Even if that landed that better kick in strife.

I never thought he was soft. Not the hardest, but not a squib either. A good athlete that's a limited footballer. He doesn't give us anything we need.

[Prince Imperial]

Ray's fitted well into Lyon's ultra defensive flood structure. Watching St Kilda games over the last three years he's mostly had an easy kick sideways to a Fisher, a Gram or a Gilbert. When he's had to kick forward to advantage under pressure though he's fluffed it (just as he did regularly with us). Unless McCartney is going to implement a Lyon-style game plan (which I think is very unlikely) we should give him a big miss as we would expect half backs to be able to move the ball forward to advantage.

[LostDoggy]

How about Patrick Bowden and maybe give Jordan McMahon another chance also.

[AndrewP6]

How about Patrick Bowden and maybe give Jordan McMahon another chance also.

I reckon Adam Morgan and Andrew McDougall are cherry-ripe now... ;)

[Desipura]

At the right price, absolutely!

He's definitely part of what we need right now. I'd love him back.

This cannot prevent us from hunting another Dangerfield type however.

He is not overly quick and his disposal under pressure has not changed.
Actually it is not the best however St Kildas game plan of not moving the ball on too quickly suited Farren as it allowed him to kick long to Riewoldt rather than having to pinpoint disposal, no thanks!

[Desipura]

Spot on, seems to go OK when using the ball by hand, but puts team mates under the pump by foot.

His hospital handballs still sit in the memory bank for me.

[LostDoggy]

His hospital handballs into the corridor coming out of defence still sit in the memory bank for me.

This. (edited for accuracy!) :)

[Desipura]

This. (edited for accuracy!) :)
Which have so much air time that the opposition can gang tackle his teammates and really hurt them.

[chef]

Whats your opinion on Callum Wilson mjp?

[chef]

Marty Clarke is available for trade from GWS as a previously signed player.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

Marty Clarke is available for trade from GWS as a previously signed player.

Bit old isn't he? I'd guess 26?

[divvydan]

Marty Clarke will be 24 in November this year.

[The Underdog]

Marty Clarke will be 24 in November this year.

From memory he's fairly quick, can't remember what his ball use was like. Would have thought the Pies would take him back but he doesn't really fill a need for them at this point so maybe not.

[anfo27]

Marty Clarke is available for trade from GWS as a previously signed player.

showed something a few years back but he won't ever be a gun though. I'd rather get some kids in with a larger scope for improvement. Its far too expensive to get guns from other teams so we need to develop our own and with McCartney having a reputation as a great teacher we need to get as many high quality kids into the club as we can.

[divvydan]

Would be good for GWS though. Strong body with great endurance. Young enough to still be around if needed when GWS are likely to be competitive finals wise (4-5yrs). Would probably be relatively cheap so wouldn't really affect their salary cap either.

[Dancin' Douggy]

How old is Sedat Sir? We could get him pretty cheap I reckon

[Mofra]

What do people know about Callum Wilson? 24yo leading FF, unlikely to get much of a look in at WCE.

[The Bulldogs Bite]

When is trade week?

[divvydan]

Mon Oct 10th to Mon Oct 17th

[bulldogsman]

What do people know about Callum Wilson? 24yo leading FF, unlikely to get much of a look in at WCE.

From what I've been told, apparently he's a bit like Panos. Lead up forward, a little bit undersized at 191cm and not super athletic. He can play in defence though.

[Remi Moses]

Buckle yourself in folks, we're about to be bombarded with unrealistic trade scenarios and just total B/S. Someone should keep tally of trades that don't eventuate.

[Mofra]

From what I've been told, apparently he's a bit like Panos. Lead up forward, a little bit undersized at 191cm and not super athletic. He can play in defence though.
In that case I'd rather stick with Panos and keep our picks

[LostDoggy]

Ex Richmond and West Coast superstar Jarred Oakley-Nicholls has been delisted. Also Tim Houlihan.

[WB4Life]

Sounds like we're interested in Master Bates, not a game changer, but could be handy? Depends on what we'd have to give up.

[LostDoggy]

Why would we be even half interested in Ray and Bate? Surely one area of our attention should be for sussing out if there are any hidden gems who can be developed into big bodied mobile contested markers.

[Sedat]

Bate? Ray? I'm getting that sinking feeling with what we are planning to do in trade week. Haven't felt like this since 2003 :(

There are some players that we should be chasing that would fill a void but we are going after a slow mid sized forward and a mid paced runner with questionable decision making skills. One thing for certain, if we snag Bate we will own just about every slow mid sized forward in the entire AFL. As for Ray, he is a role player at best. St Kilda used him wisely by sucking out any creativity from his game and programming him into being a 'dish off sideways to Fisher or Goddard' robot in the Blake/Baker/Dawson mould. The reality with Ray is that he is not a great decision-maker with ball in hand, and frankly we have enough of these types on our list as it is. He will be servicable for us but I want us to trade for players that will make a difference to us.

Setanta I'm not that fussed about. His last game for Carlton was as a very competitive forward/ruck relief in a cut-throat final that was probably the best game of the year - he did not look out of place. We have Will, Roughy and Cordy as our entire ruck division - we need some cover here and Setanta would be the most effective immediate option to address this. He will never be a superstar but I'd much rather see him in our forward line helping out Jones and Grant by bashing and crashing, as opposed to an in-betweener with questionable pace like Bate.

We should be going after players like Toovey. He is a terrific one-on-one defender who can play on talls and smalls and has great pace off the mark (we'll need one of those soon with Morris getting on and Shaggy just about done).

Trading away our Ward pick and something else to get Crouch? This is completely in the lap of Dalrymple whether or not this is a good move. I can't say if this is a boom or bust knowing very little about the draft crop, so if Dalrymple thinks that Crouch is an elite talent, bring it on because we are certainly in short supply of top-end talent on our list.

[Maddog37]

I have no major reason but I like Farren Ray. Was not overly happy to see him go in the first place.

[stefoid]

Bate? Ray? I'm getting that sinking feeling with what we are planning to do in trade week. Haven't felt like this since 2003 :(

There are some players that we should be chasing that would fill a void but we are going after a slow mid sized forward and a mid paced runner with questionable decision making skills. One thing for certain, if we snag Bate we will own just about every slow mid sized forward in the entire AFL. As for Ray, he is a role player at best. St Kilda used him wisely by sucking out any creativity from his game and programming him into being a 'dish off sideways to Fisher or Goddard' robot in the Blake/Baker/Dawson mould. The reality with Ray is that he is not a great decision-maker with ball in hand, and frankly we have enough of these types on our list as it is. He will be servicable for us but I want us to trade for players that will make a difference to us.

Setanta I'm not that fussed about. His last game for Carlton was as a very competitive forward/ruck relief in a cut-throat final that was probably the best game of the year - he did not look out of place. We have Will, Roughy and Cordy as our entire ruck division - we need some cover here and Setanta would be the most effective immediate option to address this. He will never be a superstar but I'd much rather see him in our forward line helping out Jones and Grant by bashing and crashing, as opposed to an in-betweener with questionable pace like Bate.

We should be going after players like Toovey. He is a terrific one-on-one defender who can play on talls and smalls and has great pace off the mark (we'll need one of those soon with Morris getting on and Shaggy just about done).

Trading away our Ward pick and something else to get Crouch? This is completely in the lap of Dalrymple whether or not this is a good move. I can't say if this is a boom or bust knowing very little about the draft crop, so if Dalrymple thinks that Crouch is an elite talent, bring it on because we are certainly in short supply of top-end talent on our list.

Agree with all of this, but if Ray came cheeeap, I could see him in a run-with role, and free Picken from his hard-tag role. I am against hard-tags, but run-with players who take the edge off their opponent but still offer something offensively are OK by me.

Really hope Bmac loosens the leash on Picken somewhat. I just hate being a man down when we spread because Picken's job is to stay with his man even when we have the ball. he is fast, tough and a decent kick - I want to see those skills used offensively next year.

Ray on the other hand is the perfect run-with. Reasonable pace, tough enough and a big enough tank to run hard both ways.

[Mofra]

Agree with all of this, but if Ray came cheeeap, I could see him in a run-with role, and free Picken from his hard-tag role. I am against hard-tags, but run-with players who take the edge off their opponent but still offer something offensively are OK by me.

Really hope Bmac loosens the leash on Picken somewhat. I just hate being a man down when we spread because Picken's job is to stay with his man even when we have the ball. he is fast, tough and a decent kick - I want to see those skills used offensively next year.

Ray on the other hand is the perfect run-with. Reasonable pace, tough enough and a big enough tank to run hard both ways.
Did Picken often play run-with roles though? He seemed to play as a BP for many of the game I saw this year.

If Ray came cheap I wouldn't be against him returning, but he's not going to significantly improve the side. He has a good tank and is pretty brave in filling holes on the HB line, but certainly isn't the type other teams put work into to stop his "rebound".

[Sedat]

Re: Bate, this just in from a close mate who's a hardcore Demons supporter and who sees them week:

Bate played predominantly as a lead up forward with varying success. He can be a little hot and cold, but I actually think he plays his best pinch hitting in the midfield. Didn’t do it a lot under the Bailey era – no one did a lot under the Bailey era – but he used to do it a lot under Daniher. He has good pace off the mark and often cleared stoppages just by taking off. I couldn’t understand why they didn’t persist with that. I blame the coaches.

Positives:
Booming Left Foot
Deceptively quick
Can clear the ball, dangerous at stoppages
He’d have more positives if they persisted with him in there

Negatives:
Can be jittery with hands/marking
Can hold onto the ball too long and end up making errors

He got 30+ touches first time he played midfield for casey this year – ended playing last game of season against port and got plenty of it.

[stefoid]

Did Picken often play run-with roles though? He seemed to play as a BP for many of the game I saw this year.

If Ray came cheap I wouldn't be against him returning, but he's not going to significantly improve the side. He has a good tank and is pretty brave in filling holes on the HB line, but certainly isn't the type other teams put work into to stop his "rebound".

Not sure - some midfielders might go to a pocket in an attempt to break his tag I guess

[stefoid]

Re: Bate, this just in from a close mate who's a hardcore Demons supporter and who sees them week:

Bate played predominantly as a lead up forward with varying success. He can be a little hot and cold, but I actually think he plays his best pinch hitting in the midfield. Didn’t do it a lot under the Bailey era – no one did a lot under the Bailey era – but he used to do it a lot under Daniher. He has good pace off the mark and often cleared stoppages just by taking off. I couldn’t understand why they didn’t persist with that. I blame the coaches.

Positives:
Booming Left Foot
Deceptively quick
Can clear the ball, dangerous at stoppages
He’d have more positives if they persisted with him in there

Negatives:
Can be jittery with hands/marking
Can hold onto the ball too long and end up making errors

He got 30+ touches first time he played midfield for casey this year – ended playing last game of season against port and got plenty of it.

I thought bate was going to be a good player when he first arrived, playing in defence - seemed lively and liked to go for a run, with mixed results. A somewhat less athletic version of Easton Wood. Possibly a longer kick but not neccessarilly a better one.

I dont think we need two Easton Wood types.

[Remi Moses]

Gotta love trade time seeing that disengenious Pelchen smirk :rolleyes:
Blimey Terry Wallace SEN's trade expert

[stefoid]

Should we go hard at Josh Toy?

Rumours circulate that a move back to Melbourne, and an onfield move from defender to midfield / forward would do him wonders.

Was a highly rated midfielder, and picked up as one of GCs under age 17yos.

If our first pick is not utilized in a Crouch deal, consider using it on Toy?

http://afldraftinfo.blogspot.com/2009/11/josh-toy-calder-cannonsvic-metro-draft.html

Hasnt lived up to the potential at GC, and one wonders why given the raps before he went there...

[Desipura]

Should we go hard at Josh Toy?

Rumours circulate that a move back to Melbourne, and an onfield move from defender to midfield / forward would do him wonders.

Was a highly rated midfielder, and picked up as one of GCs under age 17yos.

If our first pick is not utilized in a Crouch deal, consider using it on Toy?

http://afldraftinfo.blogspot.com/2009/11/josh-toy-calder-cannonsvic-metro-draft.html

Hasnt lived up to the potential at GC, and one wonders why given the raps before he went there...

Gotta love it, been there only 1 year and he has not lived up to expectations!

[LostDoggy]

Gotta love it, been there only 1 year and he has not lived up to expectations!

I'm with you here Desi -- if this kid was rated to be anything a year ago and is available on the cheap I would be making a play (after conducting proper due diligence, of course, especially in relation to injury issues).

[stefoid]

Gotta love it, been there only 1 year and he has not lived up to expectations!

From what Ive read, if not taken as a 17yo, he would have gone 1 or 2 with Swallow. Swallow is playing great in the midfield and Toy is having a few forgettable games in a back pocket.

so who knows?

[jeemak]

I thought bate was going to be a good player when he first arrived, playing in defence - seemed lively and liked to go for a run, with mixed results. A somewhat less athletic version of Easton Wood. Possibly a longer kick but not neccessarilly a better one.

I dont think we need two Easton Wood types.

Wood's athletic characteristics are unique as far as our list is concerned, and adding Bate wouldn't provide any conflict in terms of having to find a place for him in the side due to Wood's style. I also think we could do with another Easton Wood type on our list, any side could.

If Bate was to come to us, he'd be used as a high leading HF, which aside from outside midfield runners is something we're going to need in order to find a way forward considering we're not going to be able to rely on kicking it long and direct to Hall. I like Grant and Jones as players - particularly Jones - but neither is ready to command the ball as the main target on each of the forward lines.

Any player that might be good for one to two goals a game while providing a target over the next couple of years is going to be valuable to us. If they happen to be 24, like Bate is now, then they also have the potential to be an ingredient that makes up our side that might be ready for another tilt in three or four years.

We're all looking for the next hidden gem in the draft, and we're all sceptical on picking up players that didn't add a lot to the side that they might be trying to depart from. But, if we're going to be serious about challenging within a reasonable timeframe we need to get some players that will be in peak form in three or four years from now. There's a gap on our list when it comes to effective role players in their early to mid twenties. We need to fill it now so we're ready with mature players in a few years time.

[Desipura]

From what Ive read, if not taken as a 17yo, he would have gone 1 or 2 with Swallow. Swallow is playing great in the midfield and Toy is having a few forgettable games in a back pocket.

so who knows?

Playing on Stevie Johnson in your 1st year with not much experience beside you, it would not be easy. Also getting spanked by over 100 points at the cattery does not help.

[stefoid]

Playing on Stevie Johnson in your 1st year with not much experience beside you, it would not be easy. Also getting spanked by over 100 points at the cattery does not help.

just passing on what ive read. trade rumours, take with bucket of salt

[Mofra]

Should we go hard at Josh Toy?

Rumours circulate that a move back to Melbourne, and an onfield move from defender to midfield / forward would do him wonders.
I like - was set some very hard tasks in 2011 when most would have had a quieter, development year

[ledge]

If GC are considering trading Josh Toy afrer 1 year and with all the hype about him last year, I would seriously be looking deep into why he is on the table.