It's still a Dog's life for Lake

[chef]

MEETINGS this week between Brian Lake and the Western Bulldogs' new coach have led the All-Australian defender - disillusioned through a miserable year of injury and seemingly open to continuing his career elsewhere - to reaffirm his commitment to the Dogs.

Lake had been evasive about his playing future as recently as last week when he described how he used anti-inflammatory suppositories simply to get through training in a rehabilitation program that backfired before the Dogs ended his season in July.

In the aftermath of Rodney Eade's sacking, Lake indicated the club's new coach would have a strong influence on his feelings about remaining at Whitten Oval, and when Brendan McCartney was announced as Eade's successor this week he said it was a priority to ascertain Lake's intentions.



The Saturday Age understands that McCartney and Lake met twice this week, most recently on Thursday, and that the discussions reassured the club - which has insisted all season that trading Lake two years into a lucrative four-year deal would not be entertained - that the player is committed to rebounding at Whitten Oval.

Bulldogs football operations boss James Fantasia yesterday confirmed the coach and defender had met, but would not elaborate.

Lake has also informed his management about of discussions with McCartney, who has indicated publicly he would consider using Lake as a forward next season, and relayed that they were positive.

Despite being contracted to the Dogs on a handsome contract until the end of 2013, the 29-year-old dual All-Australian became increasingly frustrated in his 10th season when he managed just five senior games.

Lake was the competition's premier defender in 2009 and 2010, but as well as being injured this season - he battled various leg, hip, shoulder and groin problems after several operations - he had his mental toughness questioned publicly by a member of the Bulldogs' coaching panel, Brett Montgomery, this year.

Lake's relationship with Eade was also strained at times, and when the player would not commit unequivocally to the Dogs in a Channel Nine interview last week, the sense he was seriously contemplating a request to be traded was fuelled.

''It's hard. You've got a new coach coming into the club in the coming weeks,'' Lake said before McCartney was confirmed as Eade's replacement.

''I've got to know what he thinks of myself, if he sees me in the picture long term.

''You can't guarantee anything in football. If the coach comes in and says, 'We think it's probably better if you move on', so be it.

''I probably don't see that happening, but you just don't know.''

When the Dogs decided, at the end of July, that Lake should not try to play again at any level this season, the club's president, David Smorgon, and football manager, Fantasia, were emphatic that they wanted to retain the defender.

Given the Bulldogs have lost two stars in two seasons - Callan Ward to Greater Western Sydney and Jarrod Harbrow to Gold Coast - the prospect of their best defender and one of their highest-paid players stating a preference to start afresh elsewhere would have been disastrous.

McCartney will continue meeting players next week.


Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/its-still-a-dogs-life-for-lake-20110923-1kpdy.html#ixzz1YoPIn4wJ

[LostDoggy]

anti-inflammatory suppositories simply to get through training

No wonder the guy was so gutted this year. Imagine sticking anti-inflammatories up your ar$e just to train.... (to quote Allen Iverson: "not a game! We talking 'bout practice")..... and still not being able to get himself right for the weekend? Makes you respect what some of these guys go through behind the scenes each week just so we can take them apart after an average game.

[mjp]

So - our best player is going to stay - and play?

AWESOME!

[G-Mo77]

Lukewarm on this as I really don't think he'll be of much value to us for the final 2 years of his contract. I don't see the value of keeping an unhappy player on a developing list, if there was an inkling of him wanting to leave the club I really think we should have moved him.

Time to nut up now Lake! Prove all the doubters like me wrong and I hope I am.

[GVGjr]

Lukewarm on this as I really don't think he'll be of much value to us for the final 2 years of his contract. I don't see the value of keeping an unhappy player on a developing list, if there was an inkling of him wanting to leave the club I really think we should have moved him.

Time to nut up now Lake! Prove all the doubters like me wrong and I hope I am.

I understand what you are saying but I don't agree.
Unless he gives a clear indication that he doesn't want to be playing football with us then we need to keep him.
- He has a large contract that other interested clubs would have a problem accommodating
- Us 'chipping in' some of his salary to another club isn't a good outcome
- We would be unlikely to get a fair market value on any compensation unless a few teams tried to outbid each other.

We have a new coach and a clean slate so the past is just that and any bridges burned last year can be fixed. Lake should want to play footy with his mates and we need him to step up. I think he will be with us so the trick is getting him back to wanting to play for us and that shouldn't be too hard.

[Ghost Dog]

Turning him into a KPF swingman is the spark that will reignite his career IMO. He's a nightmare to play on and some of my fav games have been watching him have a purple patch over buddy. If he can read the ball that well down back, imagine the havoc he can cause in the f50? Reckon he would be just as dangerous up forward.

[G-Mo77]

I understand what you are saying but I don't agree.
Unless he gives a clear indication that he doesn't want to be playing football with us then we need to keep him.
- He has a large contract that other interested clubs would have a problem accommodating
- Us 'chipping in' some of his salary to another club isn't a good outcome
- We would be unlikely to get a fair market value on any compensation unless a few teams tried to outbid each other.

We have a new coach and a clean slate so the past is just that and any bridges burned last year can be fixed. Lake should want to play footy with his mates and we need him to step up. I think he will be with us so the trick is getting him back to wanting to play for us and that shouldn't be too hard.


Taking all that into account I would rather any of those options than our highest paid player spitting the dummy and developing a horrible culture internally. When you get that much money you are under the microscope from every angle including team mates so it could become even more fragile internally.

If his mind not 100% set on being a Western Bulldogs player then he's got to go IMO. He shouldn't need to be persuaded to stay he should want to be here after all he committed to the club for 4 years.

[AndrewP6]

Lukewarm on this as I really don't think he'll be of much value to us for the final 2 years of his contract. I don't see the value of keeping an unhappy player on a developing list, if there was an inkling of him wanting to leave the club I really think we should have moved him.

Time to nut up now Lake! Prove all the doubters like me wrong and I hope I am.

To me, the article seemed to lean towards him staying. The meetings with Paul have been positive, he's told his management they were positive. I can fully understand Brian's uncertainties - when you're going through a sustained period of not being able to do what you want to do, to the extent that you need to have drugs to even attempt it, you begin to wonder, is it all worth it, why don't I try something/where else?

I say, get him healthy (both physically and mentally), get him out on the track with his mates, and get the best out of him in the next couple of years. All-Australian talent doesn't just evaporate.

[GVGjr]

If his mind not 100% set on being a Western Bulldogs player then he's got to go IMO. He shouldn't need to be persuaded to stay he should want to be here after all he committed to the club for 4 years.

This goes back to when I used the word unless.
McCartney speaks to him and says something along the lines of I have heard you might not be happy to stay with us? If Lake's response is yes he'd like to look elsewhere then we agree to that and look at getting the best outcome. If however, Lake says he wants to stay then we check his level of commitment and if that measures up we look at getting him as fit as we can.

We need him in the side but he has to want to do it.

[1eyedog]

I am still none the wiser whether he is staying or going.

[Bulldog Revolution]

He's staying

[1eyedog]

Great!

[the banker]

If he plays forward is it deep or CHF? Got to keep him and Jones out of each others way...

[w3design]

Lukewarm on this as I really don't think he'll be of much value to us for the final 2 years of his contract. I don't see the value of keeping an unhappy player on a developing list, if there was an inkling of him wanting to leave the club I really think we should have moved him.

Time to nut up now Lake! Prove all the doubters like me wrong and I hope I am.

Could not have said it any better Lake needs to go.

[DragzLS1]

Lake and Jones up front would be great but keep Lake alternating I'm excited about next season, new coach with a fit Lake and Cooney we will be worrying a few sides ;) well done to Brian for staying now let's get him right for his own good not just ours.

[immortalmike]

Taking all that into account I would rather any of those options than our highest paid player spitting the dummy and developing a horrible culture internally. When you get that much money you are under the microscope from every angle including team mates so it could become even more fragile internally.

If his mind not 100% set on being a Western Bulldogs player then he's got to go IMO. He shouldn't need to be persuaded to stay he should want to be here after all he committed to the club for 4 years.

Coons is our highest paid player, Lake is getting roughly what we offered Ward. He is not a leader so I doubt his mental attitude will have as much effect on the club as that of say Boyd or Morris. If you take an optimistic view what if a little faith is all he needed after a year of people questioning his commitment?

Were you of the view that Sydney should have traded O'Keefe when he wanted out a couple of years ago? Callan Ward's mind was not 100% set on being a Bulldogs player this year nor was Harbrow's last year. How did you rate their years? Chris Grant in 96?

You don't trade champions, and you especially don't trade them for peanuts.

I can't believe I'm saying this but if you only look for a negative that's all you'll find.

[Hotdog60]

Lake and Jones up front would be great but keep Lake alternating I'm excited about next season, new coach with a fit Lake and Cooney we will be worrying a few sides ;) well done to Brian for staying now let's get him right for his own good not just ours.

Cooney will never be fully fit, his knee will always be a concern. Brian has a history of a hip complaint but hopefully with good management we will reap some rewards.

[G-Mo77]

Were you of the view that Sydney should have traded O'Keefe when he wanted out a couple of years ago? Callan Ward's mind was not 100% set on being a Bulldogs player this year nor was Harbrow's last year. How did you rate their years? Chris Grant in 96?



Fair point, I'm sure things can be smoothed over it's just that I have my concerns with were our list is right now and the effect of a disgruntled player may have on that. I don't want a shitty culture growing any stronger in our club. In regards to Ward to be honest I'm pretty pissed off with the players for not taking the Ward switch more personally. I maybe reading into it to much but this comes across as the players are not united to the club which is what I found so disappointing.


I can't believe I'm saying this but if you only look for a negative that's all you'll find.

I think that's a fairly unfair barb thrown my way. Yeah I'm very pessimistic about Lake but I think my concerns are valid. I could also be saying to everyone that thinks it will all turn out fine and dandy to stop looking through rose colored glasses.

[Desipura]

We don't have a good full back other than Lake and people want him to play forward, bizarre!

[1eyedog]

Coons is our highest paid player, Lake is getting roughly what we offered Ward. He is not a leader so I doubt his mental attitude will have as much effect on the club as that of say Boyd or Morris. If you take an optimistic view what if a little faith is all he needed after a year of people questioning his commitment?

Were you of the view that Sydney should have traded O'Keefe when he wanted out a couple of years ago? Callan Ward's mind was not 100% set on being a Bulldogs player this year nor was Harbrow's last year. How did you rate their years? Chris Grant in 96?

You don't trade champions, and you especially don't trade them for peanuts.

I can't believe I'm saying this but if you only look for a negative that's all you'll find.

I'm thinking Templeton at the end of 82, at least we got a packet for him. Templeton's body was questionable, so is Lake's.


We don't have a good full back other than Lake and people want him to play forward, bizarre!

Marko is servicable enough, Lake to go forward. What I think is bizarre is people saying that Jones and Lake will get in each others way. Hasn't anyone every heard of a key forward combination? :confused:

[Hotdog60]

This doen't look to bad:

HFF: Panos HF: Jones HFF: Veszpremi
FP: T.Hill FF: Lake FP: Grant

Plus Cooney, Dahlhaus, Minson and Hooper. I think we'll have enough fire power, it will how it gets there will be the problem.

[Remi Moses]

Heard Brendan McCartney on the ABC saying He's had a phone call and a long meeting with Brian. Confirmed he's staying and will play full back.
Some here very quick to write off Lake, will be interested if we get an apology or two if Lake returns to his previous form!

[Desipura]

I'm thinking Templeton at the end of 82, at least we got a packet for him. Templeton's body was questionable, so is Lake's.



Marko is servicable enough, Lake to go forward. What I think is bizarre is people saying that Jones and Lake will get in each others way. Hasn't anyone every heard of a key forward combination? :confused:

I don't think Marko has a long term career in the AFL

[Desipura]

This doen't look to bad:

HFF: Panos HF: Jones HFF: Veszpremi
FP: T.Hill FF: Lake FP: Jones

Plus Cooney, Dahlhaus, Minson and Hooper. I think we'll have enough fire power, it will how it gets there will be the problem.

So Tom Hill is suddenly in our best 22, ha not even played at Willi 1sts has he?
Panos is still on the rookie list and Hooper will be lucky to be on the list in 12 mths time.
You will need to come up with somethimhpg a lot better than the above forward line to convince me.
Do we have 2 Jones?

[Hotdog60]

So Tom Hill is suddenly in our best 22, ha not even played at Willi 1sts has he?
Panos is still on the rookie list and Hooper will be lucky to be on the list in 12 mths time.
You will need to come up with somethimhpg a lot better than the above forward line to convince me.
Do we have 2 Jones?

Edited I meant Grant. Maybe not straight away but there is potential. Hooper is a iffy but he has played well at Willy so it depends how he presents next year.

[1eyedog]

I don't think Marko has a long term career in the AFL

Me either, but his game can probably hold up long enough next year to have a look at Lake forward. Anyway, I have back and forwarded on this one so I'll leave it alone now.

[Mantis]

Coons is our highest paid player, Lake is getting roughly what we offered Ward. He is not a leader so I doubt his mental attitude will have as much effect on the club as that of say Boyd or Morris. If you take an optimistic view what if a little faith is all he needed after a year of people questioning his commitment?



Was Ward offered over $500k per year?

[kruder]

There is a proven formula for a bad year in the AFL it is

NO FULL PRESEASON= NO GOOD! Just ask Dids!

I'm not sure why he has copped so much flakk.

[bornadog]

This goes back to when I used the word unless.
McCartney speaks to him and says something along the lines of I have heard you might not be happy to stay with us? If Lake's response is yes he'd like to look elsewhere then we agree to that and look at getting the best outcome. If however, Lake says he wants to stay then we check his level of commitment and if that measures up we look at getting him as fit as we can.

We need him in the side but he has to want to do it.

Heard McCartney on 774 this afternoon. Basically said he spoke to Brian once by phone then had a long meeting with him. The main gist of their discussion was Lake is happy to play with the dogs, and will play fullback. McCartney believes in playing players in the position where they are best suited or have the best ability to play in.

[GVGjr]

Heard McCartney on 774 this afternoon. Basically said he spoke to Brian once by phone then had a long meeting with him. The main gist of their discussion was Lake is happy to play with the dogs, and will play fullback. McCartney believes in playing players in the position where they are best suited or have the best ability to play in.

Common sense approach

[Remi Moses]

There is a proven formula for a bad year in the AFL it is

NO FULL PRESEASON= NO GOOD! Just ask Dids!

I'm not sure why he has copped so much flakk.

Perfect example Didak. No pre-season looks injured still, getting a pre- season is just unbelieveably important

[immortalmike]

Fair point, I'm sure things can be smoothed over it's just that I have my concerns with were our list is right now and the effect of a disgruntled player may have on that. I don't want a shitty culture growing any stronger in our club. In regards to Ward to be honest I'm pretty pissed off with the players for not taking the Ward switch more personally. I maybe reading into it to much but this comes across as the players are not united to the club which is what I found so disappointing.



I think that's a fairly unfair barb thrown my way. Yeah I'm very pessimistic about Lake but I think my concerns are valid. I could also be saying to everyone that thinks it will all turn out fine and dandy to stop looking through rose colored glasses.

I agree with being annoyed with the players not taking Callan's departure personally. Johnno, Bubba, Darce and Chris have stated a few times that they weren't happy with Nathan Brown's exit. But call me an optimist (you'd be the first one) but I think a new senior coach with (hopefully) some new assistants may be as good as a change in environment for Lakey.

I agree that your concerns are valid and you are correct that we can't just expect things to be fine and dandy but Lake qualifies for the veterans list soon, his currency is very low and any club who would want him will probably ask us to pay part of his salary. When you look at the risk versus the reward it's fairly obvious keeping Brian is a better idea than shipping him off.


Was Ward offered over $500k per year?

It has been widely reported that Ward was offered $450, 000 a year for 3-5 years (depending on reports). Lake is apparently on the same. Now if you have some inside info please share it with the rest of us. If not here are some of my sources...

http://www.theage.com.au/news/rfnews/lake-signs-with-bulldogs/2009/10/07/1254701047967.html


http://www.smh.com.au/afl/afl-news/ward-jumps-bulldog-ship-to-join-gws-20110830-1jk5s.html

[Maddog37]

I disagree with Gmo on this. Lake deserves a chance and if he is no good then bad luck. Trading him now and you would get unders. The guy is a champion full back. Better than Scarlett for the two years prior to this. He gets injured and we say piss off???? No way.

[LostDoggy]

Really good news, hopefuly he will back to full fitness next year and back to playing good footy for us.

[bornadog]

I disagree with Gmo on this. Lake deserves a chance and if he is no good then bad luck. Trading him now and you would get unders. The guy is a champion full back. Better than Scarlett for the two years prior to this. He gets injured and we say piss off???? No way.

This

[anfo27]

Perfect example Didak. No pre-season looks injured still, getting a pre- season is just unbelieveably important

maybe we need to let Brian know how important this is because at present his pre-season takes a back seat to his holidays.

[G-Mo77]

I disagree with Gmo on this. Lake deserves a chance and if he is no good then bad luck. Trading him now and you would get unders. The guy is a champion full back. Better than Scarlett for the two years prior to this. He gets injured and we say piss off???? No way.

More to it than injury. If that was just the case then I'd agree with you.


This

Quality post as usual. :rolleyes:

[chef]

More to it than injury. If that was just the case then I'd agree with you.




Quality post as usual. :rolleyes:

Do you know this for fact, or is it just an assumption?

[w3design]

maybe we need to let Brian know how important this is because at present his pre-season takes a back seat to his holidays.

True good call.

[G-Mo77]

Do you know this for fact, or is it just an assumption?

Bit of both, I've got some pretty reliable sources and can read between the lines on what's been said in the media so pretty much the same as anyone who just says it's just injury or bad luck. :)

[chef]

Bit of both, I've got some pretty reliable sources and can read between the lines on what's been said in the media so pretty much the same as anyone who just says it's just injury or bad luck. :)

Fair enough.

According to McCartney he's a required player so I can't see him going anywhere.

[ledge]

Injury is fully to blame, if he hadnt had injuries all would have been good, he would have had a full pre season etc etc...
Its what grew from having injuries and operations that caused the tension and created other issues.
Obviously pressure built on player and coaches due to us starting to lose games and the season not panning out as planned.
Media start to see this and stories are written, true or not.
Snowballed, no injuries , no snowball thus it was due to Brians injuries.

[bornadog]

Quality post as usual. :rolleyes:

Any need to make a comment? I don't think so.

[Bulldog4life]

I'm glad Brian is staying. Whatever the reason(s) he had a shocking year but let's look at the great years he played before that. Everyone loved him. If he wants to stay and start afresh let's all get behind him instead of bagging him.

[LostDoggy]

Injury is fully to blame, if he hadnt had injuries all would have been good, he would have had a full pre season etc etc...
Its what grew from having injuries and operations that caused the tension and created other issues.
Obviously pressure built on player and coaches due to us starting to lose games and the season not panning out as planned.
Media start to see this and stories are written, true or not.
Snowballed, no injuries , no snowball thus it was due to Brians injuries.

Totally agree with this post. Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't Lake have three big operations? Plenty of players take a long time to get over one major operation let alone three. No preseason is the killer imo. You are always playing catch up with the players who have had a solid preseason. Possibly throw in some other off-field stuff and you don't have a recipe for a successful season. I simply refuse to believe that a guy with Brian's ability would have lost it all so quickly to the point where he'll never play well again. As for trading him - do we trade Cooney as well on the back of one crap year?

[anfo27]

Fair enough.

According to McCartney he's a required player so I can't see him going anywhere.

Every player on every list with any value at all is a required player. We all know that is a throw away line that every coach/list manager/president/assistant says about any player. I'm not saying Lake is going or not but I wouldn't take any notice of what coaches say about players being a required player.

[anfo27]

Injury is fully to blame, if he hadnt had injuries all would have been good, he would have had a full pre season etc etc...
Its what grew from having injuries and operations that caused the tension and created other issues.
Obviously pressure built on player and coaches due to us starting to lose games and the season not panning out as planned.
Media start to see this and stories are written, true or not.
Snowballed, no injuries , no snowball thus it was due to Brians injuries.

This is just a cop out Ledge.
Was Lake crippled with injuries? Yes. Did Lake do everything within his power to get himself right this pre-season? Absolutely not. That is the issue here, nothing more nothing less. We all love Lake, we all think he is a superstar of the competition and we all would love to see him in bulldogs colours next year dominating like we all know he can but you can't just ignore the fact that Lake our 2nd highest paid player has treated the club, team mates & supporters like mugs because he wanted to have a holiday that wasn't ruined with rehab.
I love Lake but this is unprofessional & unacceptable.

[ledge]

This is just a cop out Ledge.
Was Lake crippled with injuries? Yes. Did Lake do everything within his power to get himself right this pre-season? Absolutely not. That is the issue here, nothing more nothing less. We all love Lake, we all think he is a superstar of the competition and we all would love to see him in bulldogs colours next year dominating like we all know he can but you can't just ignore the fact that Lake our 2nd highest paid player has treated the club, team mates & supporters like mugs because he wanted to have a holiday that wasn't ruined with rehab.
I love Lake but this is unprofessional & unacceptable.

Well facts as i understand them have nothing to do with holiday, he had 2 ops before holiday and couldnt have third one straight away.
Had it when he got back, holiday was not issue, the club tried to play him too early, basically whichever way you look at it he missed a pre season, he tried to play but the pain was too much, asked for a month off during season club said no, go play at Willy.
Not a cop out, they were major operations.

Club took gamble in playing him it didnt come off, thus the injury caused it all not a holiday.
He got frustrated, club got frustrated.
Its funny how people now turn it to he went on holiday when he shouldnt have as the reason it all went bum up, its not the case.

[anfo27]

Well facts as i understand them have nothing to do with holiday, he had 2 ops before holiday and couldnt have third one straight away.
Had it when he got back, holiday was not issue, the club tried to play him too early, basically whichever way you look at it he missed a pre season, he tried to play but the pain was too much, asked for a month off during season club said no, go play at Willy.
Not a cop out, they were major operations.

Club took gamble in playing him it didnt come off, thus the injury caused it all not a holiday.
He got frustrated, club got frustrated.
Its funny how people now turn it to he went on holiday when he shouldnt have as the reason it all went bum up, its not the case.

Mantis (i think) stated in another thread that Lake hid the injury he had the 3rd op for pre-holiday because he knew the op would really effect his time off. This is what I'm gutted about.

[ledge]

Mantis (i think) stated in another thread that Lake hid the injury he had the 3rd op for pre-holiday because he knew the op would really effect his time off. This is what I'm gutted about.

Well My understanding was he couldnt have 2 of the ops at once, either way what exact training can you do with a major operation on your hip and other ops?
Personally in my opinion the club asked too much and maybe didnt realize the extent of it.
It all backfired and so did the whole season overall.
Actually its probably helped us in his situation having a new coach.

[Mantis]

It has been widely reported that Ward was offered $450, 000 a year for 3-5 years (depending on reports). Lake is apparently on the same. Now if you have some inside info please share it with the rest of us. If not here are some of my sources...

http://www.theage.com.au/news/rfnews/lake-signs-with-bulldogs/2009/10/07/1254701047967.html


http://www.smh.com.au/afl/afl-news/ward-jumps-bulldog-ship-to-join-gws-20110830-1jk5s.html

Lake is on much more than the figure 'the age' has reported, pretty sure it was reported at time of signing that he is on something like $2.2mil over 4 years... which was a reasonable contract when signed.

[anfo27]

Well My understanding was he couldnt have 2 of the ops at once, either way what exact training can you do with a major operation on your hip and other ops?
Personally in my opinion the club asked too much and maybe didnt realize the extent of it.
It all backfired and so did the whole season overall.
Actually its probably helped us in his situation having a new coach.

Certainly agree with that. If rocket was still there I don't think Lake would be.

[immortalmike]

Lake is on much more than the figure 'the age' has reported, pretty sure it was reported at time of signing that he is on something like $2.2mil over 4 years... which was a reasonable contract when signed.

The date of that article was when he signed (i.e., 2009)...so either your memory is wrong or that article is...Do you have any proof other than your memory (I know this sounds snarky but believe me I'm actually being sincere).

[Mantis]

The date of that article was when he signed (i.e., 2009)...so either your memory is wrong or that article is...Do you have any proof other than your memory (I know this sounds snarky but believe me I'm actually being sincere).

No proof other than my memory so you can believe whatever you want.

[LostDoggy]

Lake is on much more than the figure 'the age' has reported, pretty sure it was reported at time of signing that he is on something like $2.2mil over 4 years... which was a reasonable contract when signed.

$1.8mil over 4yrs (bet he wishes he was on $2.2mil)

[immortalmike]

No proof other than my memory so you can believe whatever you want.

Fair enough my memory also corroborates the story I linked to, so I'll continue to believe that. But I do respect your opinion and we are kind of splitting hairs anyway as 500,000 a year is pretty close to 450,000 a year.

[Mantis]

Fair enough my memory also corroborates the story I linked to, so I'll continue to believe that. But I do respect your opinion and we are kind of splitting hairs anyway as 500,000 a year is pretty close to 450,000 a year.

I did say $2.2mil over 4 which is $550k per year.

[immortalmike]

I did say $2.2mil over 4 which is $550k per year.

I was going by your first post. Sorry.That is a fair difference though. Although it also further calls into question your figure in my mind.

[LostDoggy]

Injury is fully to blame, if he hadnt had injuries all would have been good, he would have had a full pre season etc etc...
Its what grew from having injuries and operations that caused the tension and created other issues.
Obviously pressure built on player and coaches due to us starting to lose games and the season not panning out as planned.
Media start to see this and stories are written, true or not.
Snowballed, no injuries , no snowball thus it was due to Brians injuries.

Pretty much agree, I would add that some of these operations can take a toll on an individuals confidence in their body for longer than anticipated. He certainly seemed 'ginger' on the occasions I saw him play. Let's see how he goes with a preseason. I certainly missed watching opposition forwards seemingly kick it to him repeatedly throughout each match. Some fun forays up forward to come as well. Brians an enigma.

[Stefcep]

Well facts as i understand them have nothing to do with holiday, he had 2 ops before holiday and couldnt have third one straight away.
Had it when he got back, holiday was not issue, the club tried to play him too early, basically whichever way you look at it he missed a pre season, he tried to play but the pain was too much, asked for a month off during season club said no, go play at Willy.
Not a cop out, they were major operations.

Club took gamble in playing him it didnt come off, thus the injury caused it all not a holiday.
He got frustrated, club got frustrated.
Its funny how people now turn it to he went on holiday when he shouldnt have as the reason it all went bum up, its not the case.


OK, if it was just the injuries: tell me why has their been speculation that he wants to change clubs, and why was Lake waiting to see who the new coach was going to be and what he would want? Why has the coach stated that having discussions with Lake is a high priority? If its just injuries, then a chat with the medico's, a chat with Brian about his physical condition, all in-house and routine, and we move on.

Changing clubs and who the coach is/wants should not enter into his thoughts if its just the injuries. Its NOT just about his injuries.

IMO, he is mentally fragile, always has been, and he crumbled under Eade's verbal dressing-downs when as one of the highest paid and most senior at the club, for all the good things he's done some costly things on the field all too often.

Lake's issues are a as much mental as physical. The club can help with the physical side of it, the mental side is up to Brian. If he isn't 100% motivated to play WITH US, then cut him loose.

[GVGjr]

Lake's issues are a as much mental as physical. The club can help with the physical side of it, the mental side is up to Brian. If he isn't 100% motivated to play WITH US, then cut him loose.

The club can certainly help him with restoring his confidence and I'm sure the new coach is working on it.

Like any player though, if his heart isn't with us then it's best to seek out the best deal and move them on.

[Stefcep]

The club can certainly help him with restoring his confidence and I'm sure the new coach is working on it.

Like any player though, if his heart isn't with us then it's best to seek out the best deal and move them on.

i should have clarified that and I agree: if he is suffering the symptoms of some depressive state as a result of the injuries and treatments, then sure, the club can help. But my concern is thats not all there is to it if the guys is waiting on who the next coach is going to be, and what that coach will want from him, before he commits to playing for us.

I'm really disappointed with Lake actually. We've had one or two first class season in 10 from him, we've bent over paying a shed load of money and got nothing for it this season. Either come out and say you're a Bulldog, or move on.

[anfo27]

Was talking to mate today and he told me a friend of his went to breakfast function with rocket as one of the speakers and rocket was asked a question about Lake and rocket said that Lake has some mental issues. Not exactly the type of stuff i would have like to hear from an ex coach.

[ledge]

Was talking to mate today and he told me a friend of his went to breakfast function with rocket as one of the speakers and rocket was asked a question about Lake and rocket said that Lake has some mental issues. Not exactly the type of stuff i would have like to hear from an ex coach.

Mental issues in the way Eade and him didnt agree on stuff or mental mental issues?

[bulldogsman]

Was talking to mate today and he told me a friend of his went to breakfast function with rocket as one of the speakers and rocket was asked a question about Lake and rocket said that Lake has some mental issues. Not exactly the type of stuff i would have like to hear from an ex coach.

Sorry, but I stopped reading here.

[Sockeye Salmon]

Was talking to mate today and he told me a friend of his went to breakfast function with rocket as one of the speakers and rocket was asked a question about Lake and rocket said that Lake has some mental issues. Not exactly the type of stuff i would have like to hear from an ex coach.

This is not at all consistent with what I have heard from Eade. Even two weeks after his sacking he was still positive about Lake.

He has told us before that Lake used to do his head in by not following instructions but Eade otherwise always spoke highly of him.


A one stage there every club was peeling off when Lake had the ball knowing that Lake was prone to trying dinky little kicks and doing massive turnovers. Lake was under strict instructions that if that happened he was to take all the space they would give him then kick long.

Every time you saw Eade going ballistic either in the coaches box or at Lake on the ground you could just about bet it was after another 15m kick that led to an opposition goal.

[anfo27]

He also said that Lake would refuse to do some drills at training. Now there are a few posters here that go to training so maybe they might be able to tell us if this is rubbish or not.

[Greystache]

He also said that Lake would refuse to do some drills at training. Now there are a few posters here that go to training so maybe they might be able to tell us if this is rubbish or not.

I go to training fairly regularly, and this is very unlikely. More to point these guys are professionals, you do as you're told or you get moved on. Simple.

The idea that players pick and choose what they will do (with occasional exceptions for age or injury), or that they only listen to people they believe have achieved more than them is frankly rediculous.

[immortalmike]

This is not at all consistent with what I have heard from Eade. Even two weeks after his sacking he was still positive about Lake.

He has told us before that Lake used to do his head in by not following instructions but Eade otherwise always spoke highly of him.


A one stage there every club was peeling off when Lake had the ball knowing that Lake was prone to trying dinky little kicks and doing massive turnovers. Lake was under strict instructions that if that happened he was to take all the space they would give him then kick long.

Every time you saw Eade going ballistic either in the coaches box or at Lake on the ground you could just about bet it was after another 15m kick that led to an opposition goal.

Really because apparently I've heard that all AFL footballers are professionals and do what they're told...:cool:

[Greystache]

Really because apparently I've heard that all AFL footballers are professionals and do what they're told...:cool:

Or they end up playing somewhere else... Say Williamstown. :rolleyes:

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

Was talking to mate today and he told me a friend of his went to breakfast function with rocket as one of the speakers and rocket was asked a question about Lake and rocket said that Lake has some mental issues. Not exactly the type of stuff i would have like to hear from an ex coach.

The feedback from McCartney after his initial meeting with Lake paints a totally different and positive opinion of Lake. I doubt if you will see any further negative outbursts from the likes of Monty and others in the Bulldogs camp in 2012. The maturity of the new coach will ensure this doesn't occur.

[ledge]

The feedback from McCartney after his initial meeting with Lake paints a totally different and positive opinion of Lake. I doubt if you will see any further negative outbursts from the likes of Monty and others in the Bulldogs camp in 2012. The maturity of the new coach will ensure this doesn't occur.

NGP sounds like you are really impressed so far with Macca, are you in the know somehow?

[Nuggety Back Pocket]

NGP sounds like you are really impressed so far with Macca, are you in the know somehow?

I have been fortunate enough to have met BMcC and have been impressed.

[anfo27]

The feedback from McCartney after his initial meeting with Lake paints a totally different and positive opinion of Lake. I doubt if you will see any further negative outbursts from the likes of Monty and others in the Bulldogs camp in 2012. The maturity of the new coach will ensure this doesn't occur.

Things need to change down there so hopefully macca is the one to do that. He is saying all the right things and from what I have red he seems to more than just words.